1322: # of pumps and POI change

[pistolero]

Of course learning your trajectory and using holdover/under works. That's how we shoot everything that doesn't have adjustable power. It's not rocket science. Pumping for distance isn't either. Same as you know how much holdover/under for a certain distance you could learn how many pumps. I don't see how that's alot more complicated.
 I didn't get my "BDU's in a bunch" until you came up out of the blue with I'm somehow saying it's OK to shoot animals and not care about humane shots.
 Low and behold a search on the subject reveals the thread I linked to.  The fact remains the EXACT same subject was discussed there (and yes you did stay with the same number of pumps). Yes TimmyMac1's experience and abilities are well known. How come his "opinion" gets "respect" but in this thread when the OP mentions experimenting with THE SAME METHOD it's irresponsible???

"He then does not intend to pummel his theory, as much as i dont try to push mine on him. That is where you went wrong."
 What??? Where I went wrong? Are you reading the same thread we are? Again where did I pummel any theory on anyone??? You are the one who came straight in and said YOU CAN'T HIT A TARGET by changing the number of pumps. Where did anyone say that about holdover/holdunder? And again, why could you not clue in TimmyMac1 on how misguided he is and how irresponsible it is to espouse that method for shooting game? Because as you so eloquently explained here it's the same as saying accuracy doesn't matter.

"And the beginning of that thread is about diminishing returns of overpumping."

AND it's about (and another quote here, from the original post in said thread):
"... using my gun to eliminate a combination of squirrels/birds/rabbits raiding our garden ... "
 Again, why don't the squirrels/birds/rabbits in his garden deserve the same consideration the creatures that Railbuggy may draw down on do? You neglected to help them out.

" Is that cool with you? "
 Hey whatever floats your boat. I freely admitted where I was wrong. 22 pellets don't rise as much after the first few yards crossing LOS as faster projectiles.
 Like I said quote me all you like. Putting words in my mouth, especially going off on some tangent that I condone wounding game is not cool with me. That's "where you went wrong".

[lillysdad621]

go on john. there is not a worst deaf that the one who will not listen. do what ever. you prove no point. you just came off as rude and antagonistic. hence my reaction. And please, when you try to justify something, dont quote, go out and try it first, theory cowboy.

[pistolero]

go on john. there is not a worst deaf that the one who will not listen. do what ever. you prove no point. you just came off as rude and antagonistic. hence my reaction. And please, when you try to justify something, dont quote, go out and try it first, theory cowboy.

 Whatever. The only part early in the thread where I could be considered "rude and antagonistic" was AFTER your reply #9 where you said noone could hit by varying pumps and lecturing about "dead is dead, hit the kill zone" to which I replied " If they they "hit the kill zone", using a different method than you, are they wrong?"
 To which you replied you wouldn't get in a ^*%$#@ match. Which you then did immediately by stating that what I said equals condoning wounding game.
 Here's a little advice, for your own good.
 1. Like YOU posted earlier in the thread. "If you don't have anything constructive to say, then please say nothing at all."
 2. If you come in and say you don't want to get in a ^*%$#@ match - DON'T START A ^*%$#@ MATCH.
 3. If you do start a ^*%$#@ match, get more help, from friends with a higher IQ.

   TimmyMac1 says 2+2=4 = "decades of experience...bla bla blah respect each other's opinion bla bla bla"
   pistolero says 2+2=4 = " is not and has never been a reliable way to hit a target, inhumane, theory cowboy, blah blah blah ...."

You got owned, period. Don't get mad, it wasn't really a fair match.

Now THAT was rude and antagonistic.

[pistolero]

you prove no point.

I HAVE NO POINT TO PROVE.
OP asks about varying pumps .... I say "TRY IT AND TELL US WHAT HAPPENS"
You say "you can't hit like that, and you just want to wound critters"
So, prove YOUR point.

[lillysdad621]

There you go giving advice again where you dont know your head from other spots... I guess that is why you came so"rude and antagonistic". Owned? what are you, 10 years old? Mad? Your pettyness makes me pity you. If i thought Timmy at mac 1 deserved me telling him how wrong he is about something, i dont need your permission or approval. But since he is more of a gentleman than you have proven yourself to be, it's not necessary. Lets do this. Go out and get a pumper, try your/Mac1 idea, get some results and then come back and post all you want. Till then, all you say means absolutely nothing. And do please PM me with your results... If what i said is incorrect, let me know.

[lillysdad621]

and no, did not said that you wanted to wound critters... but it will be very likely if you use that technique for pesting...

[BenjiHunter]

What ever works to hit the target you are aiming at is my philosophy.
Why make it harder than you have to.

[lillysdad621]

+1 to benji hunter...

[pistolero]

One more time hardhead, and I'm typing slowly for you.
 I became rude and antagonistic after you said telling the OP to try his idea out was condoning wounding game. I never said I've done it myself. I never said it was sure to be awesome. I said "TRY IT AND LET US KNOW HOW IT WORKS OUT. Why is that so hard for you to wrap your head around???
 And how do you know it wouldn't work? You've never said you've tried it. You hate even the idea of it because it's "multiple trajectories". If indeed you haven't, WHO is the real "theory cowboy" here? All I said is TRY IT. You are the one who KNOWS it won't work!
 Being gentlemanly would be fine and dandy with me. You threw that out when you said I was telling everyone it's OK to shoot at game and not know where your pellets are going.

[pistolero]

and no, did not said that you wanted to wound critters... but it will be very likely if you use that technique for pesting...

" When you dont give importance to giving an animal a humane end by not using the most efficient shot possible, well then, that speaks volumes."

[lillysdad621]

no john, but advise that is not based on someone trying it may be taken by a less experience shooter and therefore end up in a bad situation. I have tried the idea i wrote above. And have tried to get a pumping scale to work for me with very poor results. All i tried to do was to share all that wasted lead and pumping to someone else. And no, you did not "become" rude after that exchange... judging by your other posts and others in the forum, it seems to be your M.O. I do not "hate" the idea, again, is someone elses opinion. in this case yours. you just have not tried it to see if it works. even the original poster realizes it is a bit complicated, or at least is harder than just memorizing 1 trajectory. Come on, you proved up top you were good at math (something, at least...), so you can tell that memorizing 1 trajectory is easier than 2, or 3, or yes john... 4.

[lillysdad621]

 I became rude and antagonistic after you said telling the OP to try his idea out was condoning wounding game.

and no, did not said that you wanted to wound critters... but it will be very likely if you use that technique for pesting...

Pal, the more you argue, the less sense you make...lol.

[pistolero]

 I'm done.

[pistolero]

Double post, sorry. Now I'm really done. STICK A FORK IN ME!

[bocomomark]

Meh, I had to skim some of the above posts, so forgive me if this has been discussed...   But with my 1377 I've noticed that it's not as accurate at the lower range of pumps.  She generally shoots pretty consistently at 10 pumps, but at 3,4 and 5 she really shotguns  (5 isn't too bad, but she will still often produce flyers that never occur at 10).  I'm not talking just trajectory changes.  Anyone else experience this?  Cause for shooting at 9 yards, at paper, in my basement, I sure would rather just pump her 3 times.   (I'm guessing that my barrel just isn't broken in yet)

[Bill in SC]

Meh, I had to skim some of the above posts, so forgive me if this has been discussed...   But with my 1377 I've noticed that it's not as accurate at the lower range of pumps.  She generally shoots pretty consistently at 10 pumps, but at 3,4 and 5 she really shotguns  (5 isn't too bad, but she will still often produce flyers that never occur at 10).  I'm not talking just trajectory changes.  Anyone else experience this?  Cause for shooting at 9 yards, at paper, in my basement, I sure would rather just pump her 3 times.   (I'm guessing that my barrel just isn't broken in yet)

That is a point to ponder, Mark. My accuracy is struggling at 3 to 5 pumps. I need to try some 5 shot 10 pump groups.

[lillysdad621]

That is peculiar. I tried mine at 3 then at 5 and then at 7 and got consistent strings... Make sure when you pump you do it as similar as the pump before. not 3 fast, then 3 slow. I have developed muscle memory so my pumps are pretty much equal. But if i pump fast sometimes i close the arm before it opened all the way up, allowing for less air to be drawn on that stroke. Also remember that those are not target trigger, so pulling becomes a real issue with the 13xx guns.

[K.O.]

Meh, I had to skim some of the above posts, so forgive me if this has been discussed...   But with my 1377 I've noticed that it's not as accurate at the lower range of pumps.  She generally shoots pretty consistently at 10 pumps, but at 3,4 and 5 she really shotguns  (5 isn't too bad, but she will still often produce flyers that never occur at 10).  I'm not talking just trajectory changes.  Anyone else experience this?  Cause for shooting at 9 yards, at paper, in my basement, I sure would rather just pump her 3 times.   (I'm guessing that my barrel just isn't broken in yet)

Check lead in and for burrs at port and obviously the crown.

If you take a nail (or any thing the right size) and bend it to the right length so it seats the pellet just past the port  it seems to help fliers and will give a slight fps boost...

When the pellet is going slow form does become more important...

[drewciferpike]

When the pellet is going slow form does become more important...

^This

Yeah, some of those "slow" SSPs are crazy-consistent, but it still takes a lot of work to keep the shooter consistent at those velocities, too... haha

I keep telling myself it's like using a 20' straw to shoot spitwads: The slightest movement, and I'll be way off.