Anybody else's accuracy hurt with bipod?

[Steelhead]

I have found that my .308 Texan groups using a bipod are never as good as when I'm using soft rests. I recently tried to do some really tight NUAH groups and used a table with a bipod and also the bench leg on my Mad Dog stock. My groups were a little erratic and the gun just didn't feel right. It seemed to 'jump' or 'hop' on the shot from the recoil.

I don't want this to be plug for my shooting chair, but I think the rests make a difference. I get the same good results if I used front and rear bags off of a bench. Frankly the same effect can be done with a something as simple as a jacket on pickup hood. I have a leather owl-ear bag front rest and a leather fork that cradles the rear stock (sling stud right in front of the fork)  This somewhat 'soft' rest system seems to absorb a lot of the recoil and I'm wondering if that has something to do with the noticeable increase in accuracy 

All I know is that if I put a bipod on and shoot off of a bench my groups stink. I feel like it's just me as everyone seems to use bipods on their big bores without issue. I'd like to know if this is something real or am I just 'bipod handicapped'?

[dapoun]

Loading the bipod and squaring my shoulders made my groups more consistent off the bench. I use a lead ingot or the backpack straps of my tank bag to load against.

[Loren]

You are not alone, I get better results shooting from a solid bench rest support or a large front bag than from a bipod. 

[SAGERAT NITEMARE]

Depends on how and where the pod is attached and how the barrel is attached to the receiver/stock.  The AF forend/stock and barrel are interactive through the two barrel centering parts and the whole thing is screwed together and fairly rigid, but a pod can apply pressure depending on how you hold/shoot and can affect accuracy...you just have to work out HOW to use the pod or bag/bench rolled up jacket, etc.

I used pods on most of my guns with wood or heavier synthetic stocks and free-float the barrel...the pod doesn't affect accuracy and the guns shoot with equal accuracy either on a bench, bag or with/without the pod...whatever.  I tried using a pod on my two 25 cal AF's but didn't like the mounting point out on the end and did cause elevation changes, so I removed the pods and just shoot over some kind of soft padding or in/on my hand when out in the field.

Each type of gun reacts differently so you just have to try and see...the pod itself doesn't cause the problem but the system itself altogether does the dirty.

Good Luck

[c_m_shooter]

The Air Force guns are known to be hold sensitive, so it isn't a surprise.  Try without the rear leg first and see what that does.

[JBinCO]

For me and my HP Gauntlet with HP installed Bi Pod.....same troubles at first until I got some great advice and tips at PA Cup this summer....as noted below square up and lean in or (load) the Pod.....I also was setting up way to high and staying low and loaded made all the difference.....that said....my HUAH and 100 Yard Match entries are mostly off bench rest with two points.....cause I'm not so good when the pressure is on and need all the confidence I can get....LOL


PS....what does it mean if a rifle is Hold Sensitive?  What would make it so?  Does this have to do with AF recoils?   Sorry still lots to learn for sure!

[c_m_shooter]

The Air Force guns have a little bit of a double recoil because of the backwards hammer, though not as bad as a spring piston gun.  They are also flexible at the rear of the frame. Changing the pressure of your cheek weld effects poi (even in the Mad Dog stock), and then all this get combined with the bullet being in a 30" barrel for a relatively long time.  When I stated messing with my Condor I joked that it combine the worst of both worlds, the hold sensitivity of a springer with the air support that a PCP requires.

[JBinCO]

Thank you...that makes perfect sense now....love this place!

[dyotat100]

Problem with bipods is they have rubber feet. Gun needs to be able to recoil. If your shooting from a surface that is not smooth enough for it to slide it's going to hop.

I went to a shooting place we have where they built one shooting bench. It is made of wood but they coated it with a roll on bed liner. I usually just shoot of my own table. But I arrived early and  was first there. So I sat up on that table.

I couldn't get anything to group that day. I always shoot off bipods on my airforce but I have a custom mount that screws on the bottom of the frame. Then the bipod fits on it perfect.

The only gun that shot somewhat desent was my fully shrouded 257. It has very little recoil. So I went home scratching my head.

I didn't figure what was up until a few days later while driving on the freeway. There was a guy there watching me shoot and some how it finally sank in. He kept saying that my gun is trying to hop off the table. I was shooting my 375 which has quiet the recoil.

If I want good groups I shoot out of my shooting rest. With my 50 cal it struggle with  bipod just because of how much recoil it has.

[kcatx]

I had been thinking of posting basically the same question over the last couple of days.  I noticed my .457 LSS is VERY hold sensitive and can shoot sometimes 2 inches off depending on if it's on bipod or on bags rested in various areas.     Now that I've got the new CF tank it was worse as the LOP is even shorter so I hacked up a few terrible butt stock extensions.  I hack sawed a 3D printed Texan stock and drilled a hole in it to fit on the butt plate, and also pulled a similar hacked up buttstock off my old Chinese AK type side cocker.  These work, but the problem now is with them on I cannot fit the LSS in my case!   So now I'm having to pull the stock off each time which is a hassle.  Need to get some type of quick connect attachment I guess. 
I'm hoping somebody comes up with a better solution for the now shorter length of pull...

[ShakySarge]

One thing a lot of folks don’t realize is that a bipod will react to the surface it’s sitting on even with pcp much like a springer resting on a hard surface. A hard surface will cause bounce and generally a higher point of impact especially with an airgun and even more so with the higher calibers. There are more factors involved as well, such as “load”(the amount of forward pressure on the bipod or lack thereof), and where and how it’s mounted to the airgun.

With the contact surface considered, it’s a good idea to use some type of pad where the legs touch the surface either by placing down a thin mat or as some guys did overseas when shooting from hard surfaces, add foam padding to the end of the legs to minimize bounce. I prefer the latter as it doesn’t require remembering to put a pad down on your shooting platform before starting.

[SAGERAT NITEMARE]

Good examples of the old adage that EACH gun, each shooting situation and EACH shooter has to be evaluated INDIVIDUALLY .

GOOD SHOOTING

[VaporTrail]

I used a bipod on my Boss, and the POI didn't really change all that much. Granted, it was at 20 yards, but it's up to you how you want to filter that. Minute changes being more pronounced at longer distances and such.

What I did notice was that there was a little more wiggle with the bipod vs. a soft bag. The soft bag seems to support the rifle better...I guess it may have something to do with the support. Kinda like trying to balance a coffee cup on a saucer vs a plate. Dunno if that makes much sense.

I'm a little spazzy, so the soft bag works out pretty good, but if I really concentrate I can get almost the same results with a bipod.

[KnifeMaker]

I went to the aut parts store and purchaced rubber LARGE bacume type plugs. The type that slip over a pipe. I put them on the feet of both the Atlas and the Accutac. Instant improvement.


For the AF Talon?Dor, U put a piece of shoe soul leather between the bottle and the mad dog stock. Once I had it working well, I screwed it to the stock. A huge among of  theflex was stopped. The bottle acts like a fulcrum adding torque to the frame. It has to be controlled.


I see that Mad dog is offering such a mod from his shop.


Knife 

[subscriber]

If the bipod legs (or hinges) are a bit flexible, and lean forward at the top from you pushing forwards, then as the gun recoils, the legs rotate to a more vertical position.  This results in the front of the gun kicking up, as the effective leg length increases slightly due to the change in angle.

The solution is to make the bipod legs assume no more than a vertical position when loaded in your shooting position.   Leaning the top of the bipod leg back slightly is preferable to leaning them forwards.  Then when the gun recoils, the legs flex with their top end further back from the feet, thus the legs becoming a little "shorter", rather than a little "longer".  This stops the bipod from kicking up the front of the gun so strongly.

[Steelhead]

Thanks to everyone for these great responses. It confirms what I've been sensing and it's good that it's real and not just perceived. 99% of the time I don't use a bipod because I already use a comfortable and highly accurate shooting chair with built in rests. Once in a while I use a bipod with extremely long telescoping legs in the field when turkey hunting so I can take a 150-200 yard shot accurately, but other than that not at all.

I wasn't aware of the input required to correctly use a bipod; the 'loading', 'leaning in to', etc.  That's great info to have so thank you. I think for accuracy's sake I'm going to stick with my shooting chair for my continued paper-punching/bench shooting. If it ain't broke, don't fix it.