GTA
Airguns by Make and Model => Hatsan Airguns => Topic started by: lefteyeshot on October 11, 2015, 08:16:41 PM
-
Can you still get Woodfield replacement triggers for a Webley Valuve Max or Striker 1000's? And if so is it worth the trouble?
-
I got the Welsh Willy replacement for the Striker and it is REALLY worth getting it. So much easier to fire than the old one. It took maybe 20 minutes to replace the old one, and anyone with a little experience could probably do it faster. I thought this replacement was no longer available, though. I'd check to see if he's making them again.
Dennis
-
Dennis, you ordered it directly from Welsh Willie/Woodfield in the U.K. or a U.S. vendor and how much $?
-
I ordered it from his website, I think maybe it was $45 or so. He was very helpful and easy to deal with. But I thought I read somewhere he'd stopped making them.
Dennis
-
Unfortunately, I read the same thing. :( I was wanting one for my Webley Spector. Actually, after shooting quite a bit I don't find it's trigger all that bad.
Ed
-
I contacted them back in the spring and they said it would be available by late August. Still don't see it listed on the site though.
Scotty
-
Thanks, guys. I'll have to keep checking WW's site.
-
Hey Guys,
So, are they available?
-
I e-mailed him about the Welsh Willy triggers maybe a week or so ago and there's some turn around time (14 days?) but as of my e-mail, they were available, I think it's about $38.60 US, but you might want to try e-mailing him to see how much shipping to the States is.
Sent him the e-mail because I've been looking for a fix for the trigger on my Hatsan Edge .25 which from the little I can find, is a less expensive version of the Striker and has the same trigger set up. I posted with pics of the trigger in the Welcome section if you want to take a look and compare yours to mine.
-
I e-mailed him about the Welsh Willy triggers maybe a week or so ago and there's some turn around time (14 days?) but as of my e-mail, they were available, I think it's about $38.60 US, but you might want to try e-mailing him to see how much shipping to the States is.
Sent him the e-mail because I've been looking for a fix for the trigger on my Hatsan Edge .25 which from the little I can find, is a less expensive version of the Striker and has the same trigger set up. I posted with pics of the trigger in the Welcome section if you want to take a look and compare yours to mine.
Interesting, especially since another member here posted about a month ago that Wil said they weren't going to be available anymore because of some problem. ??? Can't find the post now of course. I've got a Webley Spector (made by Hatsan) that has the same trigger as the Striker. I don't find the trigger all that terrible but it certainly isn't like the Tuna triggers in 3 other rifles I have. Did WW actually say they were available now? Did you order one? Looked for that trigger pic you mentioned but maybe you couldn't post it yet.
Ed
Oh, WELCOME aboard! ;D
-
I went looking for the original reply he sent me and can't find which folder I buried it in, but I do remember him saying it should work on my Edge which led me to figure they were available. The only reason I didn't order and kept looking for more info was because I figured if the shipping prices to Canada and the US were roughly the same, it works out to almost $39 for the trigger and close to $45 for the shipping and I only paid $89 for the rifle. Love the rifle and definitely want a better trigger, but the cost for now is something I'm still in serious debate about, which is why I suggested e-mailing him to ask about US shipping fees and something I had a brain fart on and didn't do and should have.
Here's the pics of my trigger and thanks for the welcome to the group!
-
I went looking for the original reply he sent me and can't find which folder I buried it in, but I do remember him saying it should work on my Edge which led me to figure they were available. The only reason I didn't order and kept looking for more info was because I figured if the shipping prices to Canada and the US were roughly the same, it works out to almost $39 for the trigger and close to $45 for the shipping and I only paid $89 for the rifle. Love the rifle and definitely want a better trigger, but the cost for now is something I'm still in serious debate about, which is why I suggested e-mailing him to ask about US shipping fees and something I had a brain fart on and didn't do and should have.
Here's the pics of my trigger and thanks for the welcome to the group!
Thanks a bunch for taking the time to post the pics-appreciate it. Your Edge trigger group looks to be identical to the one in my Webley Spector (closet Hatsan). I wouldn't be surprised if the rest of the rifle isn't the same other than the stock. I fully understand what you're saying about cost. The Spector sells for $149 at Pyramyd Air although I doubt they've sold many for that price. I stole mine for $57 from Amazon, last I looked it was up to $107.xx there. It's list price in the U.K. is 149 British Pounds which translates to something like $240 US. That's INSANE! FOR THE PRICE I PAID I love mine. It twangs and the trigger......well, you know but it's powerful and very accurate out to the 45 yards I shoot at. Probably the same as your 95 and Edge springers.
Happy shooting!
Ed
-
I have 2 Edges, one springer, the other a Vortex and my 95 is a walnut stock Vortex, all of them .25 caliber. Love the stock on your Webley (I couldn't resist, had to look it up..lol), kinda wish the Edges were more like that instead of just hollow synthetic stocks. Most of the twang in mine is the echo in them which is now way less as I removed butt pads and filled them with spray foam insulation...much quieter.
You might wander the Turkish gate, I did come across a couple posts about ways to modify that trigger to work better and since I have 2, I'm planning to try on the springer.
-
Yeah, I keep thinking I should fill 'er up with some foam. Re. the trigger, I have searched for fixes in the Hatsan gate but the only thing I've seen was using an adjustment screw that is a bit longer. I couldn't see any such screw on mine, took the stock off to see if there was one that wasn't visible with it on. None there. ??? If you come up with anything that makes a marked improvement and one doesn't have to be a gunsmith to do it please let me know. Other than just a trigger replacement, I sure wouldn't want to take the trigger pack apart.
Ed
-
Found the link to the other post I saw, pretty in-depth, but worth reading maybe?
http://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=84653.0 (http://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=84653.0)
The screw on mine took a flashlight to find, it's seriously small and tucked in at the very base of the trigger on the backside...never did try getting a screwdriver on it.
-
Found the link to the other post I saw, pretty in-depth, but worth reading maybe?
http://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=84653.0 (http://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=84653.0)
The screw on mine took a flashlight to find, it's seriously small and tucked in at the very base of the trigger on the backside...never did try getting a screwdriver on it.
Hey Steve, you are right! There IS a screw in there! I looked all over, mostly in front of trigger to no avail. They sure hid that little sucker. No way I'll try to adjust or replace 'til I pull the stock off again, can't mess with it right now but I will. Thanks also for that link. I searched a couple of times and never came up with that. Don't know that I'm gonna try that one.....you go first! ;)
My trigger isn't gritty like my Benjis and Crosman were out of the box and it's actually smooth. Compared to them stock this one's ok. It's just that L O N G squeeze before she fires that I'd like to shorten. If I can get a SLIGHTLY longer screw in there without getting a hair trigger or having the barrel let go when it's cocked that'll be great. If not I'm ok with it as is. It hits what I aim at and it does it with authority with cheap CPHPs.
Ed
-
I was actually planning to try replacing that screw first, I'm not quite THAT ready to go nuts with a new rifle mod...lol. The local hardware stores should carry something and I can get it down to the 9-10mm that post said to try for. Also decided I'm just gonna do it and order the GRT III trigger and see what happens, although I did have quite the brain fart reading the pricing on the Welsh Willy trigger....it's not another $45 to ship it, that's the price WITH shipping.....also why I decided to try the GRT, it's $12 cheaper at $33 shipping included. I'll have to private message you if that's ok and let you know how it turned out as it will be 2 weeks or so before I get it here although I plan on posting to the forum which way things worked out.
-
I'm pretty sure the GRT ain't gonna work. I've seen quite an extensive post explaining that you'd have to somehow modify the trigger--the length & shape of it. There were pics that showed the trigger would be too short to be functional. Don't know how one would accomplish that with that pretty anodized gold trigger. I've got 2 of them. I'll try to hunt down that post & send you a link IF I find it. NO problem sending me a pm.
Ed
http://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=61233.msg593005#msg593005 (http://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=61233.msg593005#msg593005)
Here ya go.
-
Good thing I haven't ordered that trigger yet! Not sure I could get my finger on that and what happens when you pull back? Kinda looks like your finger ends up coming off the trigger at some point and although I could find a few places to have an extension tig welded, they'll probably charge me more than I paid for the trigger. I might have to reconsider getting the Welsh Willy....oh well, probably should head for the hardware store and see about that screw....lol
-
I think (?) I've come up with an outstanding solution. I'm gonna take a tie wrap and run it around the hand grip, then around the front of trigger when it's half way to firing. With a bit of experimentation maybe up to 3/4 back? ??? A BLACK zip tie of course, for that hard core tactical look. Only draw back, pun intended, is you need to cut the tie after each shot, then cock the rifle, pull the trigger back again and zip 'er up. I bet a guy could get fast at doing this, probably cinch that sucker up with his teeth. Not to mention how flat out hard core menacing it'd look............Heck, think what our forefathers had to go through to fire their muskets. This'll be cake compared to that! ;) ;D ::)
Hey, I wuz bored...........lol.
Let me know how the screw fix goes!
Ed
-
The screw fix is done on both Edges. That post said to try for 10mm screws and the local Ace Hardware store had M3 x 10 screws, .50 pitch in stainless, plus they had them in allen head which should make backing the new screw out if I need to way easier than trying to get a philips head in there, you just need a long 2mm allen wrench. I'm still working on the stock screw mods so I haven't been able to try shooting them yet...I'll keep you posted...back to work and taking pics of the stock fixes...
Oh yeah...I took a look on Amazon, your Webley is up to 139.37 as of yesterday so you definitely stole a deal and when I zoomed on your stock, your front stock screws look just like my Edge...at an angle up into the bottom side of the barrel, you might want to pull one and see if you have a lock washer against the plastic. Probably could have done a simple fix and just stuck flat washers in then the lockers, but decided to test another idea..almost done and pics to follow if it works....lol
-
Ok, rifle back together, grabbed pellets and went out to test things. The M3x10 screw all the way in won't let you cock the rifle, I had to keep backing it out until I could safely cock it and have it lock open to load, so you might want to look for an M3x8 screw instead, Ace had that size also and since I can take just the trigger guard off if I want, changing from the 10 to the 8 will be pretty easy.
Hopefully I explain the next part decent enough: the initial pull on the trigger at least for mine was about half of what it was. When you hit that part of the pull that you know the rifle is about to fire and you're still pulling waiting for it is gone. Now when I pull back, the trigger just stops and I know it's going to fire and BAM, no dragging feeling at all. Again, I still want to tweak that screw more but it was getting too dark here in NY so I'll be out tomorrow testing and tweaking, but that longer screw definitely makes a difference.
-
Sounds Great! I'll be heading to the local/yocal hardware to see if I can pick up some M3X8 .50 pitch allen head screws. If they don't have 'em there I'll find them some place else. Definitely want allen heads. Really glad to hear of the improvement! Guess I'll snip that beautiful black tie wrap off. ;) Re. the front stock screws-Yeah, mine are the same as yours I bet. A flimsy star lock washer against the plastic, NOT good. Wouldn't take long for the attachment points there to let go. I replaced the screws with allen heads then put the lock washer on followed be a 5mm flat washer, followed by a 6mm flat washer up against the plastic. Blue locktite on the screws of course. I think when I take the stock off again I'm going to "paint" a bit of 2 part epoxy around the holes--inside and out to reinforce that area. Thanks for the update!
Ed
What length would you say the OEM adjustment screw is???
-
The black one is the stock screw, the 8mm is next to it and it was already all the way in when I took it out so the longer screw should work good and still have a little adjustment room if needed. sorry for the lousy pic but the only camera I have is the one in my tablet.
-
The black one is the stock screw, the 8mm is next to it and it was already all the way in when I took it out so the longer screw should work good and still have a little adjustment room if needed. sorry for the lousy pic but the only camera I have is the one in my tablet.
???"the 8mm......was already all the way in" Are you saying the REPLACEMENT screw should be LONGER than 8mm? Like a 10mm to have some adjustment? The longer screw is __mm in length?? Both screws in your pic appear to be black. Sorry, but I is confused. :o
Ed
-
Sorry for my oops...that smaller screw in the picture is the one that came in the rifle and was screwed all the way in. The longer screw is the new 8mm allen head screw I got from the hardware store. I actually got a couple extra ones, they were only .33 cents and being so small was afraid I might drop one and not be able to find it.
I really have to get a better camera....lol
-
Thank you Sir! I got 2 M3X8 & 2 M3X10 allen heads, .50 pitch and a can of insulating foam for the stock. Like you, I always get one or two extra when I buy hardware. Of course then I never need another one or can't find one when I do. The 8mm should be the one then. You must have got the deluxe premium screws, mine were .24 & .27 @ piece. :D Won't be able to mess with it 'til tomorrow.
Oh, I was just wondering how much difference having the Vortex piston compared to regular spring made since you have the Edge in both models. Recoil, twang, etc.?
Thanks!
Ed
-
Probably off on my prices, but I actually bought every screw I might need between trigger and stock fixes, plus different lengths of everything just in case so the bag had something like $16 in hardware considering I was buying for 2 rifles.
Bit more recoil and twang with the spring and they both hit hard, but with no chrony I don't know actual fps numbers. Both are also seriously accurate with the fiber optic sights. The Vortex has a Hawke Sport 3-9x40 HD AO scope on it, the springer once it's finished I got a Vokul Red/Green dot sight for off Amazon...looking forward to trying it out versus the fiber optics.
Hmmm...chrony...
-
I swapped out the adjustment screw today and am VERY happy with the end results. For ME, I see no need to pursue a different trigger. But I do have a FEW WORDS OF CAUTION---
I replaced the oem screw with a M3X8 allen head screw and initially screwed it all the way in (lightly) then turned it back I/2 turn. Put the stock back and before even firing I cocked it with no problem and proceeded to bang the butt end of the stock a dozen times or so--outside on my deck, safety on/safety off to see if it might fire. NO problem. I then loaded a pellet and was thrilled with the new light trigger pull. I fired about a dozen more times and checked a few more times hitting the end of the stock, checking for safety sake with no problems. THEN for whatever reason after loading a pellet and fortunately with the muzzle pointed skyward, SAFETY STILL ON, IT FIRED! HOLY #%!*!!! I honestly didn't know that that was possible with the safety still engaged but it happened. A very good thing that I never let the muzzle be pointed in any direction that would not be safe if it somehow fired!
I pulled the stock back off (I can't adjust the screw without doing so) and backed the screw out another 1/2 turn + a bit more. Put it back together and did the "butt bumping" thing again, a LOT, and then fired at least 50 rounds with NO problem. The trigger has a nice crisp break once you pull through the "1st stage" or more accurately the initial slack. Again, I couldn't be happier with the end result and I'm confident that the rifle is safe. Just wanted everyone to know to be very cautious if you do this or any trigger modification and KEEP YOUR MUZZLE POINTED IN A SAFE DIRECTION. Thanks Steve, for your input on what size screw to start with. Oh, to be clear the adjustment I ended up with was one full turn out + about another 1/8th turn from lightly screwing in all the way.
Ed
-
Good info. Gonna' get me some of those screws for my two Strikers and VMX and some for my bud with a couple of these guns. Thanks.
-
Good info. Gonna' get me some of those screws for my two Strikers and VMX and some for my bud with a couple of these guns. Thanks.
Yer welcome, it made a big improvement on my Webley Spector (closet Hatsan Striker). Just be careful!
Ed
-
Now you have me searching the memory for posts I've read on triggers, agjustments and any number of other things and I know I've read about the stock thump thing, I just can't for the life of me remember if it was about this whole trigger mod or something else.
I originally had mine totally screwed in then changed my mind and backed it out at least a turn before I took the first few shots, then backed it out another 1/4 after about 5 shots and left it there.
After reading your post, I'm definitely going out and do the stock thump just to be safeand rifle pointed safely is always a given. If mine is pointed, it's at the ground, at a target or at whatever backyard pest is unfortunate enough to have wandered in my sights.
Many thanks for the info, Ed and glad the fix worked out so good on your Webley.
p.s. - I stopped hmmming about that Chrony...mine will be here by Nov 2nd at the latest....lol
-
Sounds like your adjustment ended up just about the same as mine. You probably read about "stock thumping" when reading about the GRTIII trigger. I don't have a scope mounted on the Webley so I could thump a way without worrying about damaging it.
I want to pick up a chrony one of these days too. Shoot safe!
Ed
-
Hey Tim I hope to have My striker done before the fun shoot on the 7th of next month, then we can compare notes so tho speak.
-
I'm going to pick up some screws tomorrow hopefully and try this. I just never shoot my 1000s as the trigger is just so horrible. I'll try just the adjusting screw 1st, then decide if I take it further from there. My stock screw is bottomed out now and the 1st stage is SOOOOO long.
-
I can also see how making a trigger shoe would greatly improve the feel of this trigger. At least for me.
-
"trigger shoe/trigger comfort". I bought an old Gamo Shadow 1000 at a pawn shop way back. It had a simple mod. that made the trigger fell a lot better. A piece of plastic tubing stuck over the end of the trigger. It's about 3/8" long. The trigger is cheap stamped out like the trigger in a 1000/VMX. That and the new longer screw might be the trick. Just food for thought.
-
I was actually thinking of trying a small piece of black heat shrink tubing like they use on electrical wiring on the trigger...maybe 2 depending on how the first piece feels shooting. Any thoughts??
-
The shoe just came to me while shooting my 1000s .22 vortex last night. For me anyway, the curve of the trigger is too great. flatten it out some, perhaps a tad wider I think the feel would be better.
-
Now you have me thinking about the dremel...take the guard off and dremel off some of that curve without having to take the trigger apart.
-
Well where everyone else has a 3 mm x .50 pitch screw, I have a short sheet metal screw. So I guess I'll work on a shoe 1st, then think about going into the deeper mod.
Unless I'm looking at the wrong screw, it is the one directly behind the trigger with a hole in the trigger guard to adjust it.
-
Yep, that veryyyy small one right behind the trigger that you can barely get a phillips head screw driver on. The Tuna GRT III trigger would actually work at least on my Edge, but the trigger blade is too short. I'd have to find someone to Tig weld? some type of short extension on the end of that anodized trigger to make it long enough to pull decently.
Here's the link to show what it looks like installed and how short it is:
http://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=61233.msg593005#msg593005 (http://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=61233.msg593005#msg593005)
-
Yep, that veryyyy small one right behind the trigger that you can barely get a phillips head screw driver on. The Tuna GRT III trigger would actually work at least on my Edge, but the trigger blade is too short. I'd have to find someone to Tig weld? some type of short extension on the end of that anodized trigger to make it long enough to pull decently.
Here's the link to show what it looks like installed and how short it is:
http://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=61233.msg593005#msg593005 (http://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=61233.msg593005#msg593005)
Well that screw on mine is a sheet metal screw, not a metric machine screw.
-
Yep, that veryyyy small one right behind the trigger that you can barely get a phillips head screw driver on. The Tuna GRT III trigger would actually work at least on my Edge, but the trigger blade is too short. I'd have to find someone to Tig weld? some type of short extension on the end of that anodized trigger to make it long enough to pull decently.
Here's the link to show what it looks like installed and how short it is:
http://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=61233.msg593005#msg593005 (http://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=61233.msg593005#msg593005)
Well that screw on mine is a sheet metal screw, not a metric machine screw.
I think you are still not looking at the right screw. It's located immediately BEHIND the trigger itself. I couldn't find it without removing the stock and still didn't the 1st time I looked for it. It's difficult to see. Follow the open space (or "groove") on the rear of the trigger all the way up into the trigger group and I bet you'll see the tiny Phillips head of the very small 3mm machine screw. I'm guessing the oem size is 3mmX6mm and you should replace it with a 3mmX8mm allen head (preferred) or Phillips and back it out at least one complete turn from all the way in. I'm at 1 1/8 turns out, Steve is 1 1/4 out.
Good luck!
Ed
-
Installed the new screws in my .25 Striker 1000 Vortex and .20 Webley VMX springer. The actual threaded portion of the screws was 7.5mm. Checked trigger pull before and after with a Wheeler mechanical trigger pull scale. Before the 1000 5 shot average was 5 lbs 5oz and the VMX 3lbs 8oz.
Cocked and loaded the guns, on safe. Laid guns across my lap pointed in a safe direction. Removed trigger guard installed new screw. Put safe on fire and screwed in until it fired and backed off 1 1/2 turns.
On the 1000 the screw went in all the way without firing. Left it all that way in. New trigger pull average 4lbs 3oz. Going to get a longer screw.
VMX fired, backed of 1 1/2 turns. New trigger pull average 2lbs 10oz. Pretty nice. Green plastic stock vibrated so bad stung my cheek. Going to fill it with old used pellets and .45cal round ball. Maybe a barrel weight/muzzle break.
FYI: 1000 shot Norica .25 Pointed Avg. 533fps. No pellet weight on the can. Rest of my .25 ammo hasn't arrived.
VMX pushed Beeman H&N Match W/C 10.03grs avg. 937 and JSB Exact Diabolo domed 13.73grs avg. 783fps. JSB's tight fit
Hope that was informative. If not, sorry. Later, Tim.
-
I just ordered 3x8mm and 3x10mm screws to tryout.
-
The VMX is good but maybe a 10 or 12mm for the 1000.
Check out my post on zeroing one of my old chinese guns on the fun shoot thread. It was fun. I did that before messing with the turkey guns.
-
Got a 10mm screw. To remind you the 8mm went all the way in without firing on the Striker 1000 Vortex but reduced the trigger pull average from 5lbs 4oz to 4lbs 3oz The new 10mm screw caused the gun to fire and I backed it out 1 1/2 turns and reduced it 3oz more to 4lbs even. Not great but better than 5lbs 4oz. The VMX I got down to 2lbs 10oz. And that's the rest of the story.
-
I adjusted mine in until it would not cock then backed it out 1.25 turns. I don't know what the pull weight is but I know it's not 4lbs. Can you bring a gauge on the 5th so we can check it? I like how light it is now, I even did the bump and bang tests to make sure it wasn't unsafe.
-
10-4, always bring it. I tried one turn and dropped the butt stock down on the deck of the back porch and it went off. one and a half was safe and I blue lock tight it. You shot my VMX at the fun shoot after I put the new screw in it and that was 2lbs 10 oz.
-
My vortex striker feels about like that one.