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All Springer/NP/PCP Air Gun Discussion General => PCP/CO2/HPA Air Gun Gates "The Darkside" => Big Bore AirGun Gate => Topic started by: Rizen 1 on July 09, 2015, 07:29:25 PM
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In the heat of some research the other day I ran across something that caught my eye... It was these polymere tips that are inserted into the hp cavity of a bullet to make it a pointed tip to increase performance....And since I like to be different, I had to know if these could be used in our cast bullets... so I ordered some closest to the size I could find for my 40cal BBT .
My hp was a little to small for these to push in like they should so I bored a damaged bullet out and fitted one in... and here is the result.
The cool thing is, I think with a small mold adjustment and a new pin from Eric these would fit perfectly... Not only that, you could use one bullet as a hp or a pointed tip!
The other thing I noticed is the shape of the hp cavity in the pics is a shape that Eric offers in his pin styles........
Let me know your thoughts.
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Neat idea.... If the Ogive of the bullet was adjusted slighty to match the Ogive of the tip, the shape would be smoother.... At subsonic speeds, the drag actually won't change much, but you will need a faster twist for the longer OA length with the tip.... At supersonic speeds, the difference in the drag would be huge.... If you lengthened the Ogive on the bullet to match the tip, the (longer) bullet would have a bit less drag in both regimes.... but again need a faster twist....
Bob
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Dang it Bob! All My excitement just went out the window! :-[ Why do you have to be so intelligent? LOL ;D
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Sorry.... :-[
Bob
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Hey, regardless, those are pretty neat and you definitely get an A+ for effort, ingenuity and flare.
Where did you get those tips from?
Joe
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A company called Cutting Edge Bullets. They use state of the art Swiss style lathes to make lead free bullets.....
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A company called Cutting Edge Bullets. They use state of the art Swiss style lathes to make lead free bullets.....
Thanks Mike.
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Bob will give you a head ache if you let him. I have just about learned to read his post and actually learn something some time. He's not bad for someone living north of the border running a 2 room motel in a town with one pay phone LOL. Just funning Bob, you are a wealth of info.
Bob
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I see them possibly helping with expansion on a bone hit and making a larger wound channel. Maybe off a rib with a heart/lung shot. Would probably reduce the chance of a pass through in that scenario, though. Should do awesome damage on a skull shot.
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They look good Mike, just for grins give them a try...there's a fellow down south that uses the polymer tip in .457 and many of his customers like them, I'm curious to see how they group...kind regards, Allen
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You are welcome Joe.
Allen- I think I will have another mold made with the small adjustment and send Eric one of the tips to make the hp pin.. It may be a few weeks before I do this though... I wouldn't be able to sleep at night if I didn't test this out. ;D
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R-1, You may very well find that you wont want to use both HP and HP with insert once you try them!
The tip will help the HP expand faster, and not get clogged with hair or other expansion limiting trash that can enter the cavity. And I wouldn't worry about needing much more twist yet.
I learned some time back, (As did Tofazfou), that although the calc's say that I can't shoot some of the bullets that I, (We) do, The gun doesn't seem to know it! LOL!!! ;)
With the tip material adding very little weight, I would be surprised if it effects things at all as long as held tight enough to b perfectly centered.
Knife
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Thanks Knife. I am thinking that also... my reasoning behind this is the 275gn bullets I shoot are longer than the 230gn and they still shoot very similar in my gun out to 75-100 yds, which is about all the farther that I shoot in a hunting situation to stay within MY ethical boundaries. I am going to have to test these.
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Eric at Hollow Point molds is doing the tip for the Hollowpoints and yes they do work it really aids in expansion of the hollowpoints at our fps for sure accuary wise I did not see any difference very little if any.
I only tested out to 150yds which is my max hunting distance for where I hunt. So yes the concept works on papere maybe no but I dont live in books and computer I just try in the real world and get results good or bad its the only true way. I have couple of mold I had done by Eric and all is well and really well on the NOE 257 Ranch Dog mold flying ash tray and devastating as well.
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You only need "enough" twist, more doesn't do any good, and may hurt accuracy.... When I say you may "need a faster twist", that only applies if the original bullet was marginal to start with.... The caluclators are only a rough guide.... fortunately they tend to err on the side of being conservative from what I have seen.... It a twist calculator says it's stable, it would be rare for it not to be....
As always.... In theory there is no difference between theory and practice.... in practice, there is....
Bob
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Sniper M- Are you saying that you have tested the "HEX-PIN" hp? or the plastic tip on your bullets?
Bob- Most of us know that there are certain variables when it comes to these things.. I know you wasn't saying "this won't work", you were simply giving the details according to the calculations.... I value and very much appreciate your input.
Thank you
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Yes I have. I do not claim to know all that Bob does he has vast knowledge on bullets and thats a good thing, but me I more of the try it type sometimes it works somtimes it simply does not. But along the way I gain know of the real world results both good and bad and yes there is a price for knowledge one way or another. Yes they do work at least for me and my guns buts thats not saying it will work for all.
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That's great news Sniper! Thanks for the reply. I'm still not clear on if you are using the hex pins OR the Plastic tips???? OR BOTH..
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The one I am using are fitted for the hollowpoint and when pressed in it locks them in place a little machining and engineering but in the end it just works. Nothing comes easy or cheap.
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Thanks Sniper....That's my plan... I will order another mold with the adjustment made to match the tip, and then send some tips to Eric to make a hp conversion that the tip will press into and lock in.