GTA
Airguns by Make and Model => Weihrauch Airguns => Topic started by: T-Higgs on April 04, 2015, 01:55:35 AM
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OK, if you look real close, never mind all the other holes n stuff (called flyers) there is a group that measures almost (.53 inch) 1/2 inch. Shot with my R1 at 50 yards.
Seriously, I don't know how you guys do it. The lightest wind makes huge changes. I'm really having trouble hitting the 5 shot - 1/2 inch group. Having fun trying though...
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When you see it done, at a match, in person.... Until then some people can do it some times.
I don't want to be difficult, or in trouble, but I think seeing it is believing it. Springers are hard. There are all kinds of people who will tell you that half an inch at fifty yards is something they do every day. Maybe but they don't post those groups every day. I see it this way, my PCP might be able to do that, there are probably two or three people in this forum who can do that. The rest of us are mortal.
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Seriously, I don't know how you guys do it. The lightest wind makes huge changes. I'm really having trouble hitting the 5 shot - 1/2 inch group. Having fun trying though...
That's a very good observation. It is extremely challenging to shoot 1/2" groups consistently at 50 yards. From pellet to pellet inconsistency to the recoil of the spring piston rifle to the vagaries of the wind, it is well nigh impossible to shoot such groups consistently at 50 yards with a springer. Shooting one 1/2" group can be done. But to be more than a statistical aberration it needs to be repeatable. It's possible with a PCP, but with a springer...?
Let anyone using a springer who at 50 yards can shoot five five-shot groups that are 1/2" or better (or even covered with a dime) post his results. Just the five groups on the target sheet and nothing else.
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When you see it done, at a match, in person.... Until then some people can do it some times.
I don't want to be difficult, or in trouble, but I think seeing it is believing it. Springers are hard. There are all kinds of people who will tell you that half an inch at fifty yards is something they do every day. Maybe but they don't post those groups every day. I see it this way, my PCP might be able to do that, there are probably two or three people in this forum who can do that. The rest of us are mortal.
LOL....years ago at a field target match I was squaded with a shooter using a highly modified TX200. The TX200 shooter asked me how accurate my R9 was at 50 yards. Well....I told him that I really don't shoot good enough to know from "bucket and sticks" but I'm satisfied with about 1" ctc. Well......that started a 15 minute lecture on how accurate HE was at 50 yards with his TX. He actually said (quote) "If I'm not putting 20 out of 20 pellets into a 1/2" group at 50 yards I know something is wrong with my gun!" Well......I was in awe with his self proclaimed prowess with his TX200 till I noticed at the end of the match that I scored higher with my R9 shootin' from "bucket and sticks"!
When I first started shooting a Beeman R10 (decades ago) I was a bit discouraged because it seemed EVERYBODY (except me) was posting 1/2" 50 yard groups.....but the BEST I could do was 1 1/4" ctc at 40 yards! After a couple years of shooting the R10 I learned that I too could shoot 1/2" 50 yard groups once in a while, and these groups are the ones that I like to "cherry pick" for posting to show everybody that I'm actually Daniel Boone incarnated! :o
For example, here are a couple 5 shot 1/2" 50 yard groups shot back to back using my old .177 R9 shootin' from "bucket and sticks" that I like to post to make folks think I do this ALL the time. LOL......this thread actually gave me an excuse to post 'em again! ;D
(http://www.snapagogo.com/uploads/source/2352014/1408919774_1744796446_fts50yds2.jpg) (http://www.snapagogo.com/photo.php?id=56425)Uploaded at Snapagogo.com (http://"http://www.snapagogo.com")
The first group was shot aiming at the bull where the second group is located. I was so pleased with myself after the first group that I rezero'd the scope and shot the second group. Here is a more recent target where 4 out of 5 JSB Exacts flew into a 3/8" ctc group at 50 yards but the second shot opened up the group to 5/8" ctc......
(http://www.snapagogo.com/uploads/source/3142014/1415743451_1738447830_50yardNov112014.JPG) (http://www.snapagogo.com/photo.php?id=61840)Uploaded at Snapagogo.com (http://"http://www.snapagogo.com")
Now here is a "real world" target I shot when checking the trajectory of a R9 tune shooting from "bucket and sticks"........
(http://www.snapagogo.com/uploads/source/2992014/1414414071_1682521968_175ShotsHFTStyleSept82010.jpg) (http://www.snapagogo.com/photo.php?id=59989)Uploaded at Snapagogo.com (http://"http://www.snapagogo.com")
Though it may be true at times................take what you read with a grain of salt, or a whole salt shaker when someone claims that "if they can't put 20 out of 20 pellets ina 1/2" circle something is wrong with my TX200!
LOL....that even includes the stuff I post on occasion!
Anywhoo......don't get discouraged, simply shoot to improve and have fun doing so!
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Sweet shooting Tim!!!
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Ed, I had to laugh! You reminded me of a photography clinic I went to 30 years ago. The speaker said to everyone " The only difference between you and a professional photographer is that the professional throws away his bad pictures". LOL, I think he may have talking about airguners too.
I am having a great time reaching for the brass ring and you can bet, when I shoot a legitimate 1/2 @ 50, I'm posting that baby ! I think I'll make it the wallpaper on my phone.
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Frame it Tim!!!
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I probably will Joe. I'm sure my wife will let me display it proudly where no one can see it.
I need to find a calm morning to give me a better shot at this. The range I shoot at is large open area and seems to never be without a good breeze. I need all the help I can get. Do you guys use wind flags all the time? The day I shot this target, the wind was gusting 5-25+ and changing direction. Crazy trying to controll a 13 gr. pellet.
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I think most 1/2", 50 yd groups are shot at "about" 50 yards into "about" 1/2". An honest 3/4" group at 40 yards looks a lot like a 14" trout to most of us.
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good shooting .. I think one needs to hold their mouth just right when they shoot and I have not quite figured out how to just yet .. lol
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I probably will Joe. I'm sure my wife will let me display it proudly where no one can see it.
I need to find a calm morning to give me a better shot at this. The range I shoot at is large open area and seems to never be without a good breeze. I need all the help I can get. Do you guys use wind flags all the time? The day I shot this target, the wind was gusting 5-25+ and changing direction. Crazy trying to controll a 13 gr. pellet.
No flags....I watch the leaves! The only time I'll shoot 50 yard groups is in calm wind.
Like your range Tim, winds swirl here too.
I would love to try it indoors!!
We have a beautiful day here today.....with 45 mph winds!! No shooting today!!!
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Nice work!
Wish my R1 did that well. My tx will occasionally.
it did last week with 5 in one elongated hole and a 6th off about 1/2" to the side. I was very lucky with this group as it is not the norm.
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NEVER take a 6th shot into a group like that!!!
That's good shooting.
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NEVER take a 6th shot into a group like that!!!
That's good shooting.
Wiser words have NEVER been spoken!!!
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I'll explain the 6th shot.
My second shot went exactly through the first hole so I thought I missed the target. The third shot it the one off the "group". To confirm I shot three more and the all piled in where the first one went. I most certainly would have stopped at 5 if my third didn't end up where it was . I was tickled none the less!
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When you see it done, at a match, in person.... Until then some people can do it some times.
I don't want to be difficult, or in trouble, but I think seeing it is believing it. Springers are hard. There are all kinds of people who will tell you that half an inch at fifty yards is something they do every day. Maybe but they don't post those groups every day. I see it this way, my PCP might be able to do that, there are probably two or three people in this forum who can do that. The rest of us are mortal.
LOL....years ago at a field target match I was squaded with a shooter using a highly modified TX200. The TX200 shooter asked me how accurate my R9 was at 50 yards. Well....I told him that I really don't shoot good enough to know from "bucket and sticks" but I'm satisfied with about 1" ctc. Well......that started a 15 minute lecture on how accurate HE was at 50 yards with his TX. He actually said (quote) "If I'm not putting 20 out of 20 pellets into a 1/2" group at 50 yards I know something is wrong with my gun!" Well......I was in awe with his self proclaimed prowess with his TX200 till I noticed at the end of the match that I scored higher with my R9 shootin' from "bucket and sticks"!
When I first started shooting a Beeman R10 (decades ago) I was a bit discouraged because it seemed EVERYBODY (except me) was posting 1/2" 50 yard groups.....but the BEST I could do was 1 1/4" ctc at 40 yards! After a couple years of shooting the R10 I learned that I too could shoot 1/2" 50 yard groups once in a while, and these groups are the ones that I like to "cherry pick" for posting to show everybody that I'm actually Daniel Boone incarnated! :o
For example, here are a couple 5 shot 1/2" 50 yard groups shot back to back using my old .177 R9 shootin' from "bucket and sticks" that I like to post to make folks think I do this ALL the time. LOL......this thread actually gave me an excuse to post 'em again! ;D
(http://www.snapagogo.com/uploads/source/2352014/1408919774_1744796446_fts50yds2.jpg) (http://www.snapagogo.com/photo.php?id=56425)Uploaded at Snapagogo.com (http://"http://www.snapagogo.com")
The first group was shot aiming at the bull where the second group is located. I was so pleased with myself after the first group that I rezero'd the scope and shot the second group. Here is a more recent target where 4 out of 5 JSB Exacts flew into a 3/8" ctc group at 50 yards but the second shot opened up the group to 5/8" ctc......
(http://www.snapagogo.com/uploads/source/3142014/1415743451_1738447830_50yardNov112014.JPG) (http://www.snapagogo.com/photo.php?id=61840)Uploaded at Snapagogo.com (http://"http://www.snapagogo.com")
Now here is a "real world" target I shot when checking the trajectory of a R9 tune shooting from "bucket and sticks"........
(http://www.snapagogo.com/uploads/source/2992014/1414414071_1682521968_175ShotsHFTStyleSept82010.jpg) (http://www.snapagogo.com/photo.php?id=59989)Uploaded at Snapagogo.com (http://"http://www.snapagogo.com")
Though it may be true at times................take what you read with a grain of salt, or a whole salt shaker when someone claims that "if they can't put 20 out of 20 pellets ina 1/2" circle something is wrong with my TX200!
LOL....that even includes the stuff I post on occasion!
Anywhoo......don't get discouraged, simply shoot to improve and have fun doing so!
Ed you are lucky you can use a bucket and sticks. I normally shoot with a rope tied to my feet hanging upside down from a tree branch with my back to the target using a mirror. you are a lucky guy lol
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A few points:
To my knowledge, no one has ever posted a pic showing five 5-shot 1/2" groups from 50yds shot with a springer. That's the current challenge, and it has to be 50yds measured or lasered. No pacing off. And all 5 groups on one target. NO PHOTOSHOPPING! ;D
I've shot my share of 1/2" groups from 50yds with springers, but never anything close to 5 of them in a row, all on one target. The variables to overcome to do that are tremendous! That being said, it's most definitely my goal this year. From the small amount of bench time I've had so far, I can see that I'd better get used to disappointment! Very frustrating.
Wind flags...I finally made some flags and have used them every time I've been out this year. It's a real eye-opener...you won't believe what you're seeing when the flags are all pointing in different directions from 10yds to 50yds. Crazy. I think they definitely help...at a bare minimum you'll know when NOT to shoot. I don't think I'd dare try doping for the 5th shot if the first four were one-hole. Might even come back tomorrow!
It's a lofty goal, for sure, but I think we'll all be better marksman for trying it. On the other hand, it might make our shooting sessions as much fun as a round of golf. >:( (sorry, golf fans...I hate the sport with a passion).
-Paul
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Great shooting, keep practicing it will get better. Need to frame that one for sure!
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There's nothing to it really. I can shoot half inch groups at any distance. Here is the secret. Fire your first pellet, then go down range and draw a 1/2 inch circle around that pellet. Then I use my pencil to poke 9 more holes in the paper within the circle. Easy peezy:)
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One good way to show a 5 shot group of a 1/2" at fifty yards would be to drill a 1/2" hole in thick piece of board with a paper target behind it. Get five shots in the hole and call it a day. :)
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Shoot enough 5 shot groups and you will eventually get the one that beats the rest. Display that group as evidence of whatever.
In reality, you should simply chalk that one group up to "luck". The only thing it tells me is that it MIGHT be accurate, or not.
The proper measure for accuracy is the CEP (Circle of Equal Probability).
Do like Ed Canoles does. Shoot at 100 bulls. If 50% of the shots fall inside the 1/2" circle, than that is the CEP. That tells me a lot more than a good group.
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There's nothing to it really. I can shoot half inch groups at any distance. Here is the secret. Fire your first pellet, then go down range and draw a 1/2 inch circle around that pellet. Then I use my pencil to poke 9 more holes in the paper within the circle. Easy peezy:)
And to think I have been wasting all my money shooting through 50 yard lengths of 1/2" pipe! Actually with pipe/tubing improved accuracy is actually cheaper, though straightening 1/4" tube for 50 yards is a LOT of work!
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Hysterical Jeremy!!!
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Well I tried again today. Didn't happen. I just can't seem to get that .5er! Maybe I should concentrate on my 97k instead of the R1, I don't know. I just don't see how anyone could shoot 5 targets 1/2 or under on one piece of paper. Check out some of today's targets. It kills me how many times you will have a great group going and 1 pellet goes rouge, or I get a scant case of cranial rectomus. Wind picks up, pellet has a lead booger, whatever. It's sooo critical. There was an older gentleman at the range today who shoots Competition .22 long rifle. Out to 200 yards! He was intrigued that I was shooting a springer and trying for the .5- group. He said a lot of target 22's have trouble doing that, then proceeded to to shoot 1 inch groups at 100 yards with an older BSA rim fire rifle. He was surprised I came as close as I did.
Edit: I forget to mention all groups were shot at 50 yards except the one clearly marked 25 yards.
Jeremy, I could use about 150 foot of that tube you were talking about...
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Well I tried again today. Didn't happen. I just can't seem to get that .5er! Maybe I should concentrate on my 97k instead of the R1, I don't know. I just don't see how anyone could shoot 5 targets 1/2 or under on one piece of paper. Check out some of today's targets. It kills me how many times you will have a great group going and 1 pellet goes rouge, or I get a scant case of cranial rectomus. Wind picks up, pellet has a lead booger, whatever. It's sooo critical. There was an older gentleman at the range today who shoots Competition .22 long rifle. Out to 200 yards! He was intrigued that I was shooting a springer and trying for the .5- group. He said a lot of target 22's have trouble doing that, then proceeded to to shoot 1 inch groups at 100 yards with an older BSA rim fire rifle. He was surprised I came as close as I did.
Despite what some may say, it is tough to shoot five 1/2" groups on a single target sheet -- even with a .22lr never mind a springer.
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Well I tried again today. Didn't happen. I just can't seem to get that .5er!
Good shooting for sure. Well done.