GTA

All Springer/NP/PCP Air Gun Discussion General => PCP/CO2/HPA Air Gun Gates "The Darkside" => Topic started by: GadgetX on February 14, 2013, 06:59:53 PM

Title: M-Rod Tuning
Post by: GadgetX on February 14, 2013, 06:59:53 PM
I have read my manual several times.  From the factory M-Rod was set to Hammer Stroke full out, and the Preload was 5 turns.  The book says to increase striker CCW for more energy but it is maxed out already so I left it alone.  I tried to decrease the preload but i lost FPS.  I tried to increase to 6 turns (max) with no change in FPS after about 5 1/4 turns.  So I am guessing that I need to adjust metering screw if I want more energy.  Anyone know what the default for the metering screw is?  Can anyone direct me to the M-Rod tuning basics 101?

I have used 300 pellets already.  So I ordered 2800 more pellets today.  PCP is a lot of fun.  And of course there is no cost involved...   ::)

Mike
Title: Re: M-Rod Tuning
Post by: Motorhead on February 14, 2013, 07:06:26 PM
This should help
Title: Re: M-Rod Tuning
Post by: GadgetX on February 14, 2013, 07:15:49 PM
THANKS !!  So do folks tell what settings work best for FPE?  I know every AG is different, but got to be a good starting point .  I am using JSB Exacts pellets, which most folks said work best for .25 MROD.

Mike
Title: Re: M-Rod Tuning
Post by: Motorhead on February 14, 2013, 07:19:24 PM
THANKS !!  So do folks tell what settings work best for FPE?  I know every AG is different, but got to be a good starting point .  I am using JSB Exacts pellets, which most folks said work best for .25 MROD.

Mike

Not a .25 cal user ... Hang tough for someone who is  or just use the sites SEARCH and use "M-rod .25cal Tuning" as a search criteria. ( or mix the words around )
Title: Re: M-Rod Tuning
Post by: PakProtector on February 14, 2013, 07:35:53 PM
hey-Hey!!!,
For the 25 cal, open the metering screw all the way. The passages are just not all that big. Put the travel about 3 turns CW from max and dial up preload. I assume you're looking for a two clip tune at 42-44 FPE. You're heading for a velocity of 840-850 from the first shot at a 3k fill. Velocity should increase to 860-870 and then back down to where you started from.
cheers,
Douglas
Title: Re: M-Rod Tuning
Post by: GadgetX on February 14, 2013, 08:19:50 PM
hey-Hey!!!,

Thank you !!


Mike

BTW - what is travel?
Title: Re: M-Rod Tuning
Post by: PakProtector on February 14, 2013, 08:46:19 PM

BTW - what is travel?

Hammer travel. Maximum is with the 1/8" allen screw at full CCW...so CCW 'til it stops and 3 turns CW.
cheers,
Douglas
Title: Re: M-Rod Tuning
Post by: GadgetX on February 14, 2013, 09:11:39 PM
Thank you sir.  Which way does the metering screw bottom.  CW or CCW?

I just noticed it is CW.  Sorry for the post.

Mike
Title: Re: M-Rod Tuning
Post by: GadgetX on February 14, 2013, 09:21:28 PM
This is exciting !!

Ok Metering Screw is at 4 turns.  Pre-load is at 5 1/2 turns. 

Why do we set stroke at 3 turns, when max is 0 Turns?

Mike
Title: Re: M-Rod Tuning
Post by: Motorhead on February 14, 2013, 09:27:09 PM
This is exciting !!

Ok Metering Screw is at 4 turns.  Pre-load is at 5 1/2 turns. 

Why do we set stroke at 3 turns, when max is 0 Turns?

Mike



Because we WISH to have guns tune more self regulating having a close velocity spread over enough shots to make POI consistent for a couple magazines.

Now if you just want MAXIMUM POWER and don't care about velocity consistency or air usage ? .... YUP full hammer travel, Max spring preload and a wide open port restriction setting  :P
Title: Re: M-Rod Tuning
Post by: GadgetX on February 14, 2013, 09:35:30 PM
But will it kill a BIG beaver?

Thanks I appreciate everyone on the this forum!!   At MAX power, how many shot full out?  What FPS can I expect?  Way cool !!

Mike
Title: Re: M-Rod Tuning
Post by: Motorhead on February 14, 2013, 09:52:31 PM
But will it kill a BIG beaver?

Thanks I appreciate everyone on the this forum!!   At MAX power, how many shot full out?  What FPS can I expect?  Way cool !!

Mike

Hit him in the azz or gut shoot em ... NO !!

Title: Re: M-Rod Tuning
Post by: Bill G on February 14, 2013, 10:08:40 PM
Wide open you can get 925-930fpe but they are all down hill from there.  When my rifle was all factory excluding the 10# spring and the B-staley tune method, I had a nice tune of 915-925 over 10 shots with JSB's.  Thats about 48 fpe.  If thats all I can get with factory parts and a upgraded spring, then I'd rather have the 6 extra shots over the 4-6 extra fpe.  Keep the range inside 30-40yrds and bust'em in the noggin.  I don't think that will be a problem at all. 

Bill
Title: Re: M-Rod Tuning
Post by: GadgetX on February 15, 2013, 08:40:03 AM
Thanks Bill !!

I think 850 - 900 FPS is plenty.  Going to find the best tune which maximizes the number of shots in that range.

The highest FPS so far with spring stoke (SS) at 0, pre-load (PL) at 5, meter screw (MS)at 3 (the way it came) was 832 fps at 2250 psi.

I'll get the chrony out and check the current settings at ss=0, pl=5, ms=4  this morning.

Mike
Title: Re: M-Rod Tuning
Post by: PakProtector on February 15, 2013, 09:13:22 AM
I think you'll do better with more preload. The A-team tuning guide makes mention of hammer bounce air wasting at low preload, and I have found similar. So I reduce travel 3-4 turns CW and dial up preload to get velocity I seek. It turned out this was enough to make installation of an HDD un-necessary; shot count did not go up, and it still gave me all the issues like difficult mag removal and grind-on-cocking they're famous( infamous? ) for.

At the 42-44 FPE level, 30-40 yards and noggin shots, the rifle is more than enough for yotes; beaver should pose no issue with a carful shot to their computer.
cheers,
Douglas
Title: Re: M-Rod Tuning
Post by: GadgetX on February 15, 2013, 09:39:16 AM
Do you have a link to the A-team tuning guide?   I have seen reference to it but all links are broken that I have tried.

Thanks,

Mike
Title: Re: M-Rod Tuning
Post by: CitySniper on February 15, 2013, 10:46:37 AM
(http://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=42851.0;attach=55463;image)
This should help

In the picture The stroke adjustment is incorrect. (it should show counter-clockwise for hammer stroke MAX length
Title: Re: M-Rod Tuning
Post by: rsterne on February 15, 2013, 02:41:07 PM
Yeah, totally BACKWARDS on the hammer stroke on that diagram.... MAX is fully CCW until it stops turning.... I personally don't see why you would use anything else, and just adjust the hammer strike with the preload if you are going for anything other than a very mild, low pressure tune where you can't dial it down enough with just the preload.... However, I don't have an MRod, just lots of other PCPs, where I have found reducing the stroke redundant.... IMO the stroke adjustment on the MRod was to allow the gun to be tuned for low pressure (eg. 2000 psi) fills....

Bob
Title: Re: M-Rod Tuning
Post by: Motorhead on February 15, 2013, 02:52:29 PM
Funny ... That DIAGRAM is from Benjamin itself best I know  :o

Never really payed much attention being I knew what screws do what turned which ever way .... OUPS !!!

Good catch  ;D
Title: Re: M-Rod Tuning
Post by: ezman604 on February 15, 2013, 03:01:01 PM
Here it is...
Title: Re: M-Rod Tuning
Post by: GadgetX on February 15, 2013, 06:49:16 PM
Thank you sir !!

I shot 200 pellets through the chrony today.  Stoke made a difference, best when al the way ccw..  preload made a difference, best when it was ~ 6-6 1/2 turns.  But the metering valve only made a difference if it was completely shut to off cw.  No change from 2 - 4.5 turns.  Going to find someone to setup the gun.  I obviously don't have a clue.  The best FPS was 829 FPS.  Same as the factory settings.

Mike
Title: Re: M-Rod Tuning
Post by: GadgetX on February 17, 2013, 09:34:13 PM
Ok ended on the H=6.5 S=.25 V=4.25.  I have 40 shots (5 clips) from 3000 psi, JSB exact 25.4 gr.  Lowest FPS 742, highest 858.  I have 2200 psi left.  Not exactly what I wanted (800-900 FPS), but I think I could shot 60-70 shots.  BTW - all shots were .7" at 30 yards.  I actually ruined my back stop made of 2x4 treated.  Come on Mr Beaver !!

Mike
Title: Re: M-Rod Tuning
Post by: GadgetX on February 21, 2013, 08:51:30 AM
Seems everyone has a heavier # 10 spring.  I suspect that spring will help at higher psi (2500-3200).  Does that hurt at lower psi (1500-2300)?  Is it a basic mod that a journeyman can do or is it a pro gunsmith mod?  Would still like the bulk of shots to be 850-900 fps with JSB Exact 25gr pellets on the mrod.  I can live with 25 shots.  Now I am getting 40+ shots.

Mike
Title: Re: M-Rod Tuning
Post by: aack73 on February 21, 2013, 11:18:16 AM
the heavier spring will help you achieve the higher velocities at higher fill pressure. if your happy with what you got, then i would leave it be.

  changing that spring out is pretty simple. in my opinion the entire gun is pretty simple to disassemble and work on. if you have enough mechanical skills to disassemble it, you should be able to put it back together just fine. print out the diagram and pay attention when taking it apart. ;D
Title: Re: M-Rod Tuning
Post by: GadgetX on February 21, 2013, 11:51:43 AM
thanks, Im thinking about a new spring...

Mike