GTA
All Springer/NP/PCP Air Gun Discussion General => European/Asian Air Gun Gates => German AirGun Gate => Topic started by: kzz1kaw on January 17, 2024, 05:49:01 PM
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👋🏾sup
Recently bought used 48 in .20 caliber. Didnt know Diana made a 48 in .20 ! I own the 177 & 22 48 but not the .20 till now. Contacted Diana to get information and specifically mention the .20 caliber in the 48 and got a response the my 48 with the to5 trigger was made in 2003 and then Diana said they don’t make a .20 caliber. I m waiting for a reply back about the .20 caliber because the gun wasn’t modified. Question does anyone here own a 48 in .20? I’m curious as to when was the production run in .20 caliber. Gun with Vortek kit is stacking pellets @ 30 yards
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I believer that our very own Hector Medina had a special batch custom made a few years back.
Maybe only 20-30 were made.
-Yogi
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Yogi is correct on that. Check with Hector Medina, he can probably give you more information on that particular gun. I believe he ordered them with Lothar Walther barrels as a special buy.
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I believer that our very own Hector Medina had a special batch custom made a few years back.
Maybe only 20-30 were made.
-Yogi
Really🤔 I hope Hector will chime in because I have a shooter😉👊🏾😎
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He had model 54 in .20 made the 48 were factory made.
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👋🏾sup
Recently bought used 48 in .20 caliber. Didnt know Diana made a 48 in .20 ! I own the 177 & 22 48 but not the .20 till now. Contacted Diana to get information and specifically mention the .20 caliber in the 48 and got a response the mod 48 with the to5 trigger was made in 2003 and then Diana said they don’t make a .20 caliber. I m waiting for a reply back about the .20 caliber because the gun wasn’t modified. Question does anyone here own a 48 in .20? I’m curious as to when was the production run in .20 caliber. Gun with Vortek kit is stacking pellets @ 30 yards
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He had model 54 in .20 made the 48 were factory made.
[/quote]Diana replied : As already mentioned we have no information about the production of DIANA MOd. 48 in cal. 5.0
I got in contact with the seller that stated he bought the gun from original owner that bought the gun new🤷🏽 gun was made in November of 2003 and Diana said the model 48 went into production in 1991 until now. Conflicting information here🤔🧐
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Confusing. Did giving them the serial number help?
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Confusing. Did giving them the serial number help?
Yes serial # given🤷🏽
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Diana said the model 48 went into production in 1991 until now. Conflicting information here🤔🧐
Whoever gave that answer didn't know their Diana history. The D48 was introduced in January 1987, or years before 1991 - that's when the D54 came available.
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Diana said the model 48 went into production in 1991 until now. Conflicting information here🤔🧐
Whoever gave that answer didn't know their Diana history. The D48 was introduced in January 1987, or years before 1991 - that's when the D54 came available.
🤔 interesting! The person at Diana is giving me the wrong information 😳🤬 I was hoping someone on here would chime in with the correct information! Thank you!
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When we were talkin BB guns the other day I forgot about your screen name. My commuter is a Z900rs.....
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When we were talkin BB guns the other day I forgot about your screen name. My commuter is a Z900rs.....
👋🏾sup brah! Hey Cliff! Ken here! I mentioned you in the above messages about the Diana I bought from you. If you have been reading, Diana claims they never made a .20 caliber 48😳. Just trying to get more information above the production run since .20 caliber isn’t that common in the D48 braddah👊🏾😎
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While extremely rare, I have heard about .20 cal D48's, mostly in a c. 2010 - 2014 context.
I do have a .20 cal D54, one out of 30 ever made, from 2012, and I know that a little earlier, similarly small batches of D430's and D34's were made in .20 cal.
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While extremely rare, I have heard about .20 cal D48's, mostly in a c. 2010 - 2014 context.
I do have a .20 cal D54, one out of 30 ever made, from 2012, and I know that a little earlier, similarly small batches of D430's and D34's were made in .20 cal.
I’m going to take a picture where it says 5.0mm and the serial # and send it to the same email
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I remember Dr. Beeman was promoting 5mm but I got a .22 48 and a .22 52 . They were accurate and the mainsprings broke on them . Almost the power of a m350 .
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Blue book Air Guns 48/48A/48B/48SL .20(dis.2006) page346 Eleventh Edition.
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I remember Dr. Beeman was promoting 5mm but I got a .22 48 and a .22 52 . They were accurate and the mainsprings broke on them . Almost the power of a m350 .
Do you still have them?
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Blue book Air Guns 48/48A/48B/48SL .20(dis.2006) page346 Eleventh Edition.
Thank you for the information! Is there a start production date with the .20? You sir have been more helpful than Diana on their airguns👊🏾😎
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He had model 54 in .20 made the 48 were factory made.
Diana replied : As already mentioned we have no information about the production of DIANA MOd. 48 in cal. 5.0
I got in contact with the seller that stated he bought the gun from original owner that bought the gun new🤷🏽 gun was made in November of 2003 and Diana said the model 48 went into production in 1991 until now. Conflicting information here🤔🧐
[/quote]
That's funny, my 48 was made in 1987.
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He had model 54 in .20 made the 48 were factory made.
Diana replied : As already mentioned we have no information about the production of DIANA MOd. 48 in cal. 5.0
I got in contact with the seller that stated he bought the gun from original owner that bought the gun new🤷🏽 gun was made in November of 2003 and Diana said the model 48 went into production in 1991 until now. Conflicting information here🤔🧐
That's funny, my 48 was made in 1987.
[/quote]
👋🏾sup brah! Whoever is working at Diana doesn’t know anything about the 48😳😡
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I remember Dr. Beeman was promoting 5mm but I got a .22 48 and a .22 52 . They were accurate and the mainsprings broke on them . Almost the power of a m350 .
Do you still have them?
Yes I have them and want someone (not me) to put a new spring in both 48 and 52. If I had a place to hunt squirrel I would shoot them.
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There were a few factory guns made in .20cal, Thier was an old air gun tuner name Rich who use to use to re barrel Diana 48 ETC for people years ago, I had a few of them made myself in .20cal the 48, they are awesome in .20cal! you might check in the search eng to see if you can pull up this info! 8)
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https://www.gatewaytoairguns.com/airguns/index.php?topic=10173.0
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There were a few factory guns made in .20cal, Thier was an old air gun tuner name Rich who use to use to re barrel Diana 48 ETC for people years ago, I had a few of them made myself in .20cal the 48, they are awesome in .20cal! you might check in the search eng to see if you can pull up this info! 8)
Is he in Michigan ? If so I heard he was very 🤒
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https://www.gatewaytoairguns.com/airguns/index.php?topic=10173.0
Great story! Will be taking my .20 caliber to a farm permission very soon to do some pesting of sparrows pigeons and starlings 👊🏾😎
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I remember Dr. Beeman was promoting 5mm but I got a .22 48 and a .22 52 . They were accurate and the mainsprings broke on them . Almost the power of a m350 .
Do you still have them?
Yes I have them and want someone (not me) to put a new spring in both 48 and 52. If I had a place to hunt squirrel I would shoot them.
If you were in Michigan I can install a new spring no problem 😉👊🏾😎
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OK, since I have been invoked....
First off, the "new" DIANA has nothing to do with the "Original" of olden times.
The Old Diana kept a "library" of ALL the prototypes and models ever made. They never got to order them and set a museum, but then the Owner till the end of that era had no real interest in Airguns and he was only milking the cow till it was time to send it to the slaughterhouse.
Enter the German government and they came up with a salvage program that "sold" the company's assets for €1-00. Gov't took over the labor liabilities and the company got the rest.
The company was bought by two original shareholders that were interested in the RF/Repro/Airsoft market and had become very rich as a result. A big group put up the structure and away it went. Factory had to be moved to the northern section of the country and that implied that anything that was not essential had to go.
Inclluding the "library".
So, asking the new DIANA about older models is quite useless. They do not have the data and the younger persons do not have the memories.
Is this why DIANA is still "looking for itself"? Maybe. But it is just what it is.
SO, don't take it too rough on the people there. They came on board almost fresh out of college, most of them are under 45, some of them barely over 25. Worrying about what happened half a century ago is simply not in their logical universe.
Now, the matter at hand:
DIANA has made FOUR rifles in 0.20" cal. One of them, was a short test run of M 48's using In-House made barrels. Not bad, actually more than reasonably good. If you run a pellet through the bore and recover it (or shoot into a Dacron pillow and recover the pellet you will see the normal DIANA rifling that is sort of "star shaped". I've repaired a few, some of them outside the US.
The rifles did not sell as DIANA had hoped, probably because at that time the foremost proponent of the "Twenty Cal" decided to pick a fight with DIANA. It didn't help that RWS was also changing hands and the new owners wanted to "gobble up the world in a swallow", PLUS they were friends (German friends) of the Mayer family. So RWS kicked Beeman out and Beeman got a chip on the shoulder, he never forgave the issue and started demeaning what one year before were the "best and greatest". The short memory of marketing people completed the whole thing and the "test" run of 0.20" cal 48's was never repeated.
Fast forward to 2011 and yours truly was looking for something to do with his life in the USA, till he gave up trying to find a job and started CT Custom Airguns (CCA).
Under that umbrella, we asked the "connoisseur market" (members of the Network 54 DIANAWERK community) what they would like to see/buy and back came the answer: "A nice 20 cal German DIANA"
At that time, the 430 had just come out of the prototype phase to replace the 46 and in a meeting between DIANA, Lothar Walther, and CCA, it was decided to launch a limited series of 430 Stutzen (the full length Mannlicher style stock) with Lothar Walther barrels. So 30 were made with L-W 20 cal barrels (to CCA specs), and 5 were made with L-W 0.177" barrels (L-W specs).
https://www.ctcustomairguns.com/hectors-airgun-blog/how-a-semi-custom-gun-is-made
Once these guns were made, customized and sold, the idea for a 34 came up, but not "just another 34" . This 34 was designed as a carbine/short rifle, and so it was the only "34k" ever made:
https://www.ctcustomairguns.com/hectors-airgun-blog/two-caliber-rifle
And again after the 34's were gone, we decided to launch a run of 54's. Why not the 48?
Well, those that were ready to invest enough money in a semi-custom limited series gun wanted the "top of the line" and so the 48 was bypassed in favour of the 54.
This is an excellent writeup on the potential of the guns:
https://www.ctcustomairguns.com/hectors-airgun-blog/the-020-cal-diana-54-project
And that's it. No other 20 cals have ever been made by DIANA. And getting another "run" made will require, by Group policy, to consist of at least 300 guns.
Unless we can get a financial backer to come up with a cool $150,000, that ain't happening any time soon.
And, to be impolitely honest, I don't know if I would tackle the project with OPM's given the very bad experience of the last run of 54's. The users backed out at the last minute and the company was brought almost to bankruptcy by that.
Anyway, we moved to Maryland and we are still in the Airgun community.
All the 20 cals I have tested (well ver 100) have been very accurate. And the 20 cal is a pleasure to shoot in the wind. For years I shot my 20 cal 54 in FT and did quite well, till the rules changed and ONLY 12 ft-lbs was allowed.
IF JSB accepted to make the 20 cal "medium" pellet in tin, then we could use it in FT, but without that, the 20 cal has been in the closet for quite some time.
The 20 cal is the 7 mm's Rem Mag of the airgun world. It can do anything and everything with the right projectile. It is not too common, and it is just a darned good setup.
Congrats on having found "hens teeth", hope you enjoy it for many years.
BTW, all the notes that Steve has on the 54 (except for those that apply more to the sled system than to the powerplant), also apply to the 48.
Keep well and shoot straight!
HM
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Yes, he was in Michigan, and he did excellent work! he no longer works on air guns he retired many years ago, installing a spring in a 48 is nothing to do, simple, and yes you can do it! if I were you I would also install a new breech seal and piston seal!
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OK, since I have been invoked....
First off, the "new" DIANA has nothing to do with the "Original" of olden times.
The Old Diana kept a "library" of ALL the prototypes and models ever made. They never got to order them and set a museum, but then the Owner till the end of that era had no real interest in Airguns and he was only milking the cow till it was time to send it to the slaughterhouse.
Enter the German government and they came up with a salvage program that "sold" the company's assets for €1-00. Gov't took over the labor liabilities and the company got the rest.
The company was bought by two original shareholders that were interested in the RF/Repro/Airsoft market and had become very rich as a result. A big group put up the structure and away it went. Factory had to be moved to the northern section of the country and that implied that anything that was not essential had to go.
Inclluding the "library".
So, asking the new DIANA about older models is quite useless. They do not have the data and the younger persons do not have the memories.
Is this why DIANA is still "looking for itself"? Maybe. But it is just what it is.
SO, don't take it too rough on the people there. They came on board almost fresh out of college, most of them are under 45, some of them barely over 25. Worrying about what happened half a century ago is simply not in their logical universe.
Now, the matter at hand:
DIANA has made FOUR rifles in 0.20" cal. One of them, was a short test run of M 48's using In-House made barrels. Not bad, actually more than reasonably good. If you run a pellet through the bore and recover it (or shoot into a Dacron pillow and recover the pellet you will see the normal DIANA rifling that is sort of "star shaped". I've repaired a few, some of them outside the US.
The rifles did not sell as DIANA had hoped, probably because at that time the foremost proponent of the "Twenty Cal" decided to pick a fight with DIANA. It didn't help that RWS was also changing hands and the new owners wanted to "gobble up the world in a swallow", PLUS they were friends (German friends) of the Mayer family. So RWS kicked Beeman out and Beeman got a chip on the shoulder, he never forgave the issue and started demeaning what one year before were the "best and greatest". The short memory of marketing people completed the whole thing and the "test" run of 0.20" cal 48's was never repeated.
Fast forward to 2011 and yours truly was looking for something to do with his life in the USA, till he gave up trying to find a job and started CT Custom Airguns (CCA).
Under that umbrella, we asked the "connoisseur market" (members of the Network 54 DIANAWERK community) what they would like to see/buy and back came the answer: "A nice 20 cal German DIANA"
At that time, the 430 had just come out of the prototype phase to replace the 46 and in a meeting between DIANA, Lothar Walther, and CCA, it was decided to launch a limited series of 430 Stutzen (the full length Mannlicher style stock) with Lothar Walther barrels. So 30 were made with L-W 20 cal barrels (to CCA specs), and 5 were made with L-W 0.177" barrels (L-W specs).
https://www.ctcustomairguns.com/hectors-airgun-blog/how-a-semi-custom-gun-is-made
Once these guns were made, customized and sold, the idea for a 34 came up, but not "just another 34" . This 34 was designed as a carbine/short rifle, and so it was the only "34k" ever made:
https://www.ctcustomairguns.com/hectors-airgun-blog/two-caliber-rifle
And again after the 34's were gone, we decided to launch a run of 54's. Why not the 48?
Well, those that were ready to invest enough money in a semi-custom limited series gun wanted the "top of the line" and so the 48 was bypassed in favour of the 54.
This is an excellent writeup on the potential of the guns:
https://www.ctcustomairguns.com/hectors-airgun-blog/the-020-cal-diana-54-project
And that's it. No other 20 cals have ever been made by DIANA. And getting another "run" made will require, by Group policy, to consist of at least 300 guns.
Unless we can get a financial backer to come up with a cool $150,000, that ain't happening any time soon.
And, to be impolitely honest, I don't know if I would tackle the project with OPM's given the very bad experience of the last run of 54's. The users backed out at the last minute and the company was brought almost to bankruptcy by that.
Anyway, we moved to Maryland and we are still in the Airgun community.
All the 20 cals I have tested (well ver 100) have been very accurate. And the 20 cal is a pleasure to shoot in the wind. For years I shot my 20 cal 54 in FT and did quite well, till the rules changed and ONLY 12 ft-lbs was allowed.
IF JSB accepted to make the 20 cal "medium" pellet in tin, then we could use it in FT, but without that, the 20 cal has been in the closet for quite some time.
The 20 cal is the 7 mm's Rem Mag of the airgun world. It can do anything and everything with the right projectile. It is not too common, and it is just a darned good setup.
Congrats on having found "hens teeth", hope you enjoy it for many years.
BTW, all the notes that Steve has on the 54 (except for those that apply more to the sled system than to the powerplant), also apply to the 48.
Keep well and shoot straight!
HM
Thanks for this history, Hector. I learned something important about the company's history. Sorry to hear a 54 buy hit you so hard because folks backed out. I wasn't in the buy, but care anyway.
Never even shot a .20 let alone owned one. But I would start with a 48 in .20 if that were an option. Love that model.
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OK, since I have been invoked....
First off, the "new" DIANA has nothing to do with the "Original" of olden times.
The Old Diana kept a "library" of ALL the prototypes and models ever made. They never got to order them and set a museum, but then the Owner till the end of that era had no real interest in Airguns and he was only milking the cow till it was time to send it to the slaughterhouse.
Enter the German government and they came up with a salvage program that "sold" the company's assets for €1-00. Gov't took over the labor liabilities and the company got the rest.
The company was bought by two original shareholders that were interested in the RF/Repro/Airsoft market and had become very rich as a result. A big group put up the structure and away it went. Factory had to be moved to the northern section of the country and that implied that anything that was not essential had to go.
Inclluding the "library".
So, asking the new DIANA about older models is quite useless. They do not have the data and the younger persons do not have the memories.
Is this why DIANA is still "looking for itself"? Maybe. But it is just what it is.
SO, don't take it too rough on the people there. They came on board almost fresh out of college, most of them are under 45, some of them barely over 25. Worrying about what happened half a century ago is simply not in their logical universe.
Now, the matter at hand:
DIANA has made FOUR rifles in 0.20" cal. One of them, was a short test run of M 48's using In-House made barrels. Not bad, actually more than reasonably good. If you run a pellet through the bore and recover it (or shoot into a Dacron pillow and recover the pellet you will see the normal DIANA rifling that is sort of "star shaped". I've repaired a few, some of them outside the US.
The rifles did not sell as DIANA had hoped, probably because at that time the foremost proponent of the "Twenty Cal" decided to pick a fight with DIANA. It didn't help that RWS was also changing hands and the new owners wanted to "gobble up the world in a swallow", PLUS they were friends (German friends) of the Mayer family. So RWS kicked Beeman out and Beeman got a chip on the shoulder, he never forgave the issue and started demeaning what one year before were the "best and greatest". The short memory of marketing people completed the whole thing and the "test" run of 0.20" cal 48's was never repeated.
Fast forward to 2011 and yours truly was looking for something to do with his life in the USA, till he gave up trying to find a job and started CT Custom Airguns (CCA).
Under that umbrella, we asked the "connoisseur market" (members of the Network 54 DIANAWERK community) what they would like to see/buy and back came the answer: "A nice 20 cal German DIANA"
At that time, the 430 had just come out of the prototype phase to replace the 46 and in a meeting between DIANA, Lothar Walther, and CCA, it was decided to launch a limited series of 430 Stutzen (the full length Mannlicher style stock) with Lothar Walther barrels. So 30 were made with L-W 20 cal barrels (to CCA specs), and 5 were made with L-W 0.177" barrels (L-W specs).
https://www.ctcustomairguns.com/hectors-airgun-blog/how-a-semi-custom-gun-is-made
Once these guns were made, customized and sold, the idea for a 34 came up, but not "just another 34" . This 34 was designed as a carbine/short rifle, and so it was the only "34k" ever made:
https://www.ctcustomairguns.com/hectors-airgun-blog/two-caliber-rifle
And again after the 34's were gone, we decided to launch a run of 54's. Why not the 48?
Well, those that were ready to invest enough money in a semi-custom limited series gun wanted the "top of the line" and so the 48 was bypassed in favour of the 54.
This is an excellent writeup on the potential of the guns:
https://www.ctcustomairguns.com/hectors-airgun-blog/the-020-cal-diana-54-project
And that's it. No other 20 cals have ever been made by DIANA. And getting another "run" made will require, by Group policy, to consist of at least 300 guns.
Unless we can get a financial backer to come up with a cool $150,000, that ain't happening any time soon.
And, to be impolitely honest, I don't know if I would tackle the project with OPM's given the very bad experience of the last run of 54's. The users backed out at the last minute and the company was brought almost to bankruptcy by that.
Anyway, we moved to Maryland and we are still in the Airgun community.
All the 20 cals I have tested (well ver 100) have been very accurate. And the 20 cal is a pleasure to shoot in the wind. For years I shot my 20 cal 54 in FT and did quite well, till the rules changed and ONLY 12 ft-lbs was allowed.
IF JSB accepted to make the 20 cal "medium" pellet in tin, then we could use it in FT, but without that, the 20 cal has been in the closet for quite some time.
The 20 cal is the 7 mm's Rem Mag of the airgun world. It can do anything and everything with the right projectile. It is not too common, and it is just a darned good setup.
Congrats on having found "hens teeth", hope you enjoy it for many years.
BTW, all the notes that Steve has on the 54 (except for those that apply more to the sled system than to the powerplant), also apply to the 48.
Keep well and shoot straight!
HM
👋🏾sup brah! Thank you for the history lesson of Diana! It’s definitely looks like the factory .20 caliber barrel. Gun was made in November 2003. Do you know approximately how many were made and approximately the production dates for the .20 caliber?
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Yes, he was in Michigan, and he did excellent work! he no longer works on air guns he retired many years ago, installing a spring in a 48 is nothing to do, simple, and yes you can do it! if I were you I would also install a new breech seal and piston seal!
The previous seller a member here told me he had add the pg4 kit breech seal and piston seal👊🏾😎
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👋🏾sup brah! Thank you for the history lesson of Diana! It’s definitely looks like the factory .20 caliber barrel. Gun was made in November 2003. Do you know approximately how many were made and approximately the production dates for the .20 caliber?
Disclaimer: I am talking here from MEMORY. So I may be wrong.
Those 48's were planned in the year 1999, then started to be made in the 2000's
The "Original" DIANA used to make runs of 300's, and they were not all finished at the same time. Orders of a 100 rifles of one specific model were thought as "very good orders", so it could be that the mechanisms tubes were made in the 2000, but the final gun assembled in 2003 and then it was so stamped.
According to my workshop notes, I have not seen any 48's in 20 cal with dates later than 2004, but my workshop notes are just a sliver of a sample.
Sorry I cannot give you more info.
Keep well and shoot straight!
HM
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👋🏾sup brah! Thank you for the history lesson of Diana! It’s definitely looks like the factory .20 caliber barrel. Gun was made in November 2003. Do you know approximately how many were made and approximately the production dates for the .20 caliber?
Disclaimer: I am talking here from MEMORY. So I may be wrong.
Those 48's were planned in the year 1999, then started to be made in the 2000's
The "Original" DIANA used to make runs of 300's, and they were not all finished at the same time. Orders of a 100 rifles of one specific model were thought as "very good orders", so it could be that the mechanisms tubes were made in the 2000, but the final gun assembled in 2003 and then it was so stamped.
According to my workshop notes, I have not seen any 48's in 20 cal with dates later than 2004, but my workshop notes are just a sliver of a sample.
Sorry I cannot give you more info.
Keep well and shoot straight!
HM
So does that mean the m48 .20 caliber is a rare desirable gun to have ?
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👋🏾sup brah! Thank you for the history lesson of Diana! It’s definitely looks like the factory .20 caliber barrel. Gun was made in November 2003. Do you know approximately how many were made and approximately the production dates for the .20 caliber?
Disclaimer: I am talking here from MEMORY. So I may be wrong.
Those 48's were planned in the year 1999, then started to be made in the 2000's
The "Original" DIANA used to make runs of 300's, and they were not all finished at the same time. Orders of a 100 rifles of one specific model were thought as "very good orders", so it could be that the mechanisms tubes were made in the 2000, but the final gun assembled in 2003 and then it was so stamped.
According to my workshop notes, I have not seen any 48's in 20 cal with dates later than 2004, but my workshop notes are just a sliver of a sample.
Sorry I cannot give you more info.
Keep well and shoot straight!
HM
So does that mean the m48 .20 caliber is a rare desirable gun to have ?
Common gun, still made today, just in an uncommon caliber that appeals to a certain niche of airgun enthusiasts.
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So does that mean the m48 .20 caliber is a rare desirable gun to have ?
It is NOT common. But it is not "rare". Furthermore, yours has already been altered, so there is really very little "collector value" in it.
You DO have an UNCOMMON rifle and therefore it may sell for a bit more than a common one, especially if you find the right client.
BUT, my idea is that it has far more value in your enjoyment of it.
The powerplant can be tuned to the 13.7 or the 15.90 pellets, slightly different springs and components. It is accurate and powerful enough to hunt badgers, raccoons, groundhogs and other largeish prey. It can be a "one gun" battery if you find the the right tune that will shoot well the FTT (light for caliber), the Predator (expanding hunters), and the two domes by JSB.
It can also use most accessories for the 48 / 54, peep sights, Harmonic Tuners, reinforced seals, etc.
So, just enjoy it for what it is: a great example of the spring-gun world.
Keep well and shoot straight!
HM
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So does that mean the m48 .20 caliber is a rare desirable gun to have ?
It is NOT common. But it is not "rare". Furthermore, yours has already been altered, so there is really very little "collector value" in it.
You DO have an UNCOMMON rifle and therefore it may sell for a bit more than a common one, especially if you find the right client.
BUT, my idea is that it has far more value in your enjoyment of it.
The powerplant can be tuned to the 13.7 or the 15.90 pellets, slightly different springs and components. It is accurate and powerful enough to hunt badgers, raccoons, groundhogs and other largeish prey. It can be a "one gun" battery if you find the the right tune that will shoot well the FTT (light for caliber), the Predator (expanding hunters), and the two domes by JSB.
It can also use most accessories for the 48 / 54, peep sights, Harmonic Tuners, reinforced seals, etc.
So, just enjoy it for what it is: a great example of the spring-gun world.
Keep well and shoot straight!
HM
. Furthermore, yours has already been altered, so there is really very little "collector value" in it.
How so? The seller I purchased from bought from original owner who bought it new from a sporting goods store 🤷🏽
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A collector grade gun is in its untampered state new in the box! so, to speak, and those guns are not that sought after, except to some 1 who may want 1, and again it's a snitch gun, there are plenty of .20cal offerings out there and a lot of people don't want them! there's very little pellet selection for the .20cal and its way more expensive to shoot this caliber vs a .177cal or a .22cal rifle! I own a lot of .20cal guns, but I also have a ton of pellets for them that were purchased when pellets were not as expensive as they are today! so that's the downside to a .20cal rifle, in today's world, but if you only own 1 .20cal then it's worth buying pellets for it, unless you have deep pockets and can afford to own a lot of them and the ammo to feed them! and if your barrel doesn't like the pellets that are offered out there today as far as accuracy then it is what it is!
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Now, the matter at hand:
DIANA has made FOUR rifles in 0.20" cal.
There are .20 cal D45's out there, as well. Or is this part of the Old Diana that is beyond the scope of today?
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Factory had to be moved to the northern section of the country and that implied that anything that was not essential had to go.
Including the "library".
I take this to mean that detailed model / manufacturing data covering c. 120 years of history was simply destroyed. If this is so, it's just horrendous.
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So, asking the new DIANA about older models is quite useless. They do not have the data and the younger persons do not have the memories.
There's quite a bit of difference between not knowing an answer, and telling what the answer is when not knowing it. The problem is the latter, not the former.
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I don't know if this might provide useful context for you about the mixed views of the desirability of .20 cal. Check out this thread, specifically Hoosierdaddy's post. He got a great deal on a .20 cal and was very excited about it, meanwhile when he asked the seller what was wrong with it, the answer was that it was .20 cal.
https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=211701.280
Not stating .20 cal is a bad thing, it's just not as common and as such some of us don't want to deal with it, like it's limited pellet options. It has some great projectile performance characteristics though. So some people are thrilled and others have no interest.
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Let's go beyond the "myths" and look at realities:
From the Internal ballistics standpoint, piston airguns have a limit of shootability at around 22-24 ft-lbs. More than that, materials and shooter suffer and it becomes impossible to perform well in the long run, impossible for the shooter and impossible for the gun.
On top of that, pellets, due to their shape, have a stability limit around 875 fps, depending on the barrel geometry and quality, it may be a bit more or a bit less, but the limit will never be too far off.
So, if you put those TWO reasons together, you get to a pellet weight in the range of 14 grains region
If you make a 14 grs. pellet in 0.177" you need a longer barrel race under pressure, and spring-piston airguns cannot deliver that.
If you make a 14 grs. pellet in 0.22" then you can reach the proper expansion ratio, but the pellet is relatively "fat & squat"
Make it in 0.20" and you have the best possible combination of everything.
Because MOST airgunners are NOT concerned with really long range endeavours, those who want to hunt, prefer the 0.22" and those who like to target shoot, prefer the 0.177"
BUT that does not mean that the 0.20" is not, technically speaking, the best combination, it just means that the market has preferences.
In many ways I like to think of the 20 cal as the 7 mm Rem Mag. Try to sell a 7 RM to an East Coast shooter, LOL!
As PCP's have become more prevalent, the present long range king is the 0.25" out of PCP's, and that has eclipsed the 20 cal further. Within the 20-24 ft-lbs region, the 20 cal is the best.
Now, that region does not include many HW's, so it is restricted and possibly the reason why not many use it.
There are few pellets in the caliber? Maybe, I can think of 5 VERY WELL MADE pellets:
JSB 13.7
JSB 15.8
H&N Baracuda
H&N FTT
Predator PolyMags
With these 5 there is no argument at least one, if not three or four, will shoot well out of most quality 20 caliber barrels.
IMHE, the D48's with the DIANA barrel shoot well the FTT's when tuned down to around 16 ft-lbs, in the Lothar Walther barreled DIANAS, the JSB 13.7's are ideal; a few rifles that have been specifically setup for the heavies do very well out to 100 yards in the 21-22 ft-lbs region.
Are the pellets more expensive? NOPE, as long as you are comparing apples to apples. If you want to compare to the Crosman Premier HP's from the tins in blister packs that are sold at $5.00 in WalMarts, then it is not an apple to apple comparison. Where is the difference? You MAY get an outstanding batch of Crosman's that shoot real well, and when those are gone, the next batch/tin may be terrible. With JSB and H&N you can be fairly confident that dimensions and weights will be kept under tight control. Still, when the batch changes, you may need to re-sight in, but it will not be DRASTICALLY different.
I LOVE the 20 cal, but by the rules of the WFTF I am forced to shoot under 12 ft-lbs; in that power region, the 0.177" DOES have external ballistic advantages.
It is a pity that the HW's are generally restricted to lower power levels they are the ones that would benefit the MOST from JSB making Tin pellets in the 13.7's dies. They would come out at 9 grs. and they would be ideal for the 12 - 16 ft-lbs region.
Anyway, keep us posted about your DIANA 48 in 20 cal.
HM
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Let's go beyond the "myths" and look at realities:
From the Internal ballistics standpoint, piston airguns have a limit of shootability at around 22-24 ft-lbs. More than that, materials and shooter suffer and it becomes impossible to perform well in the long run, impossible for the shooter and impossible for the gun.
On top of that, pellets, due to their shape, have a stability limit around 875 fps, depending on the barrel geometry and quality, it may be a bit more or a bit less, but the limit will never be too far off.
So, if you put those TWO reasons together, you get to a pellet weight in the range of 14 grains region
If you make a 14 grs. pellet in 0.177" you need a longer barrel race under pressure, and spring-piston airguns cannot deliver that.
If you make a 14 grs. pellet in 0.22" then you can reach the proper expansion ratio, but the pellet is relatively "fat & squat"
Make it in 0.20" and you have the best possible combination of everything.
Because MOST airgunners are NOT concerned with really long range endeavours, those who want to hunt, prefer the 0.22" and those who like to target shoot, prefer the 0.177"
BUT that does not mean that the 0.20" is not, technically speaking, the best combination, it just means that the market has preferences.
In many ways I like to think of the 20 cal as the 7 mm Rem Mag. Try to sell a 7 RM to an East Coast shooter, LOL!
As PCP's have become more prevalent, the present long range king is the 0.25" out of PCP's, and that has eclipsed the 20 cal further. Within the 20-24 ft-lbs region, the 20 cal is the best.
Now, that region does not include many HW's, so it is restricted and possibly the reason why not many use it.
There are few pellets in the caliber? Maybe, I can think of 5 VERY WELL MADE pellets:
JSB 13.7
JSB 15.8
H&N Baracuda
H&N FTT
Predator PolyMags
With these 5 there is no argument at least one, if not three or four, will shoot well out of most quality 20 caliber barrels.
IMHE, the D48's with the DIANA barrel shoot well the FTT's when tuned down to around 16 ft-lbs, in the Lothar Walther barreled DIANAS, the JSB 13.7's are ideal; a few rifles that have been specifically setup for the heavies do very well out to 100 yards in the 21-22 ft-lbs region.
Are the pellets more expensive? NOPE, as long as you are comparing apples to apples. If you want to compare to the Crosman Premier HP's from the tins in blister packs that are sold at $5.00 in WalMarts, then it is not an apple to apple comparison. Where is the difference? You MAY get an outstanding batch of Crosman's that shoot real well, and when those are gone, the next batch/tin may be terrible. With JSB and H&N you can be fairly confident that dimensions and weights will be kept under tight control. Still, when the batch changes, you may need to re-sight in, but it will not be DRASTICALLY different.
I LOVE the 20 cal, but by the rules of the WFTF I am forced to shoot under 12 ft-lbs; in that power region, the 0.177" DOES have external ballistic advantages.
It is a pity that the HW's are generally restricted to lower power levels they are the ones that would benefit the MOST from JSB making Tin pellets in the 13.7's dies. They would come out at 9 grs. and they would be ideal for the 12 - 16 ft-lbs region.
Anyway, keep us posted about your DIANA 48 in 20 cal.
HM
I will! Upcoming Pesting Video coming soon on my YouTube channel https://youtube.com/@airgunspestingch.8426?si=1F70V6-2HNfh0aO3
Among my .20 caliber arsenal:
Weihrauch HW97
Weihrauch HW95
Weihrauch HW100
AirForce Talonor
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Now, the matter at hand:
DIANA has made FOUR rifles in 0.20" cal.
There are .20 cal D45's out there, as well. Or is this part of the Old Diana that is beyond the scope of today?
It's not beyond the scope and the story has already been posted. Look at the second page of this thread.
HM
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Factory had to be moved to the northern section of the country and that implied that anything that was not essential had to go.
Including the "library".
I take this to mean that detailed model / manufacturing data covering c. 120 years of history was simply destroyed. If this is so, it's just horrendous.
Not destroyed. For a while a TON of truly RARE Diana's came on the market through the auction sites in Germany, meaning that the "Library" itself was pieced out and sold bit by bit.
Like many "historic things" once you remove them from their context, the value diminishes greatly. It is would be almost impossible to piece together a museum now while it would have been medium hard back then.
The realities of the company were what they were.
HM