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All Springer/NP/PCP Air Gun Discussion General => PCP/CO2/HPA Air Gun Gates "The Darkside" => Big Bore AirGun Gate => Topic started by: Dan H on July 16, 2021, 04:39:24 PM
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I just pre ordered the AEA Challenger .357 32inch barrel bullpup side lever 500cc air tank " BIG 9 " gun ! ;D ;D ;D ...
I really like my AEA .30 32 inch barrel .30 bullpup it is a real power house for a .30 cal , and after seeing the power difference between the 24 inch barrel and 32 inch barrel in .30 , I decided to get the longer 32 inch barrel .357 bullpup ....
I have the AEA Challenger .357 with 24 inch barrel and really like it , but I am thinking the 32 will push the 100 plus g stuff a lot better - my thinking is pushing a 125g to 150 g in to the 900 to 1000 fps range , and Bin says you can turn the .357 in to a .45 with a few parts /barrel ... not that I will do that but it is, and option ....
I have a Hatsan BT65 Carnivore that I was going to modify / tune but I am thinking I may just sell that gun to help pay myself back for the new AEA gun , I have the .30 Hatsan carnivore ,and I will not sell that one it shoots hole threw hole at 50 yards all day long with jsb 44.75 or NOE 46 g pellets at 900 fps ...
I think these long barrel bullpups are the way to go for off hand shooting , they are a lot better balanced than the standard rifle shooting off hand in hunting situation's ,and the cool thing is they bench shoot really well also with the stock design they have in the AEA bullpup line up ....
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I've been keeping an eye on this bullpup. Eager to hear your thoughts once it arrives. It sounds like it may be a bit heavy for ideal offhand shooting, probably around 12 lbs with a scope mounted.
Did you find out if the magazines have been revised to hold longer slugs with the new side lever versions?
I'm curious as to what speeds this bullpup with the 32" barrel can sling the NSA 142gr and 178gr slugs.
Are you planning to test them?
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500cc is HUGE. Still trying to figure out how they do that in just 12 lbs and a bullpup for $600. Breaking all the norms here.
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I am looking at NOE bullet molds from 129g to 155 g range , I might try the .358- 129 g mold first, that style of bullet shoots fantastic in my xp Badger .40 ,and that is about 36 g more than what I have currently for casting in .357 , and have been shooting out of my 24inch barrel Challenger .357 ...
I think that 129 g should be close in FPS with the longer barrel to what I was shooting with the lighter stuff with the 24 inch barrel , testing well tell how this pan's out , looking at the number's it should be pretty close ...
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I am looking at NOE bullet molds from 129g to 155 g range , I might try the .358- 129 g mold first, that style of bullet shoots fantastic in my xp Badger .40 ,and that is about 36 g more than what I have currently for casting in .357 , and have been shooting out of my 24inch barrel Challenger .357 ...
I think that 129 g should be close in FPS with the longer barrel to what I was shooting with the lighter stuff with the 24 inch barrel , testing well tell how this pan's out , looking at the number's it should be pretty close ...
Dan those are what I'll be using in my AEA Challenger during deer season, they're plenty accurate in hollow point plus heavy enough for a good heart shot as long as I get a good shot at a deer.
(https://i.imgur.com/yfm4RVr.png)
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Ahhhh this talk about deer hunting with .357 warms my heart,....my favorite caliber :)
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I am looking at NOE bullet molds from 129g to 155 g range , I might try the .358- 129 g mold first, that style of bullet shoots fantastic in my xp Badger .40 ,and that is about 36 g more than what I have currently for casting in .357 , and have been shooting out of my 24inch barrel Challenger .357 ...
I think that 129 g should be close in FPS with the longer barrel to what I was shooting with the lighter stuff with the 24 inch barrel , testing well tell how this pan's out , looking at the number's it should be pretty close ...
Dan those are what I'll be using in my AEA Challenger during deer season, they're plenty accurate in hollow point plus heavy enough for a good heart shot as long as I get a good shot at a deer.
(https://i.imgur.com/yfm4RVr.png)
Wayne what FPS did you get out of these ? , I think I will order that mold , I will cast them in flat nose not hollow point because they do better hydraulically smashing threw bone ,and not being deflected off the wound channel line that I am after , for big game use just the straight flat nose bullet - not a hollow point bullet ... Charlie = roachcreek uses these bullets to kill deer and elk with , in fact 51 elk kills he has using flat nose bullets , trust me he is a wealth of bullet knowledge / casting ,
Charlie taught Mike = knifemaker , and I about a decade or more ago all about casting /sizing / designs of bullets he has been 1000 yard shooting champion of Oregon several times , if I ever have a question about the bullet stuff I don't hesitate asking him LOL ! he has tested every thing out in the field where it counts ... when we were on the Talon forum he posted up a bunch of hunting kill pics ...
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i agree, i like a RNFP slug for deer and hogs.
hp's tend to walk around and fragment when finding bones.
and much easier to cast too.... ;)
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try the 357 163-FN-AX1. It drops at .358 and 142 gr in hp.Ive been using that in my Badger 357 barrel swap and my Texan ! Its been super accurate and a hoof knocker on deer!
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Hey Dan H,
Has your 32 inch barrel big 9 come in yet?
I have been looking at getting one of these as well, and I will be very curious to hear what kind of power and max projectile length/weight you are able to use in it..with and without the magazine.
I heard a rumor that there may also be a new valve design in it as well, but not sure if that is true or not.
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Hey Dan H,
Has your 32 inch barrel big 9 come in yet?
I have been looking at getting one of these as well, and I will be very curious to hear what kind of power and max projectile length/weight you are able to use in it..with and without the magazine.
I heard a rumor that there may also be a new valve design in it as well, but not sure if that is true or not.
Not yet ... Bin told me there was a delay in shipping from a storm a while back but the gun's should be getting over here pretty quick we hope ...
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Is that one of the first ten to be air freighted over, or the full shipment?
I figure I will wait and see a few reviews on it, then grab one.
From the first bunch of them, it should be quite good- but always good to see what folks say before jumping.
Do you know if it has the capacity to take longer projectiles than the previous one; or still the same?
Cheers,
Pat
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I got a shipping notice from Bin today for the 25 backpacker I ordered on Aug 6th said in stock when ordered ,evidently in stock doesn't mean in the store ,anyway I also have a .45 challenger bullpup pre-ordered so maybe the backpacker was in the same shipment with the challengers ,one can always hope.
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Any idea when the big shipment is coming in?
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Any idea when the big shipment is coming in?
not sure when the shipment with the new challengers will arrive, but one thing that will probably impact it is the hurricane sitting just off the coast of Massachusetts, my FedEx notice shows the package at a town just west of Boston ,just my luck.
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I just ordered the 24 inch barrel 357 today... I'm looking forward to dusting off all my molds from the powder burner days and experimenting.
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I got a shipping notice from Bin today for the 25 backpacker I ordered on Aug 6th said in stock when ordered ,evidently in stock doesn't mean in the store ,anyway I also have a .45 challenger bullpup pre-ordered so maybe the backpacker was in the same shipment with the challengers ,one can always hope.
Good ! to hear cross our finger's the new side lever's are in this shipment ... ;) i will test Bin in the morning ...
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Has anyone here gotten their .357/9mm with the 32 inch barrel yet?
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I just texted Bin so maybe in the morning we will know some thing ....
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UPDATE = I called Bin he said the the plane with the side lever gun's is leaving today ! ;D ;D ;D so it shouldn't be to long before the gun's ship out to us here in the USA !
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Ok another update Bin texted me today and said the gun's are on the way from LA to Boston ... so he is waiting for the shipping to complete , and then he will ship out the gun's ....
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Has anyone figured out how to make the triggers better on these rifles, I've had 3 different ones ones the power and accuracy was good but the triggers are way to heavy for me so I sold them.
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Has anyone figured out how to make the triggers better on these rifles, I've had 3 different ones ones the power and accuracy was good but the triggers are way to heavy for me so I sold them.
I polish the contact points on the trigger and sear, helps to get the pull down in the 4lb range, it's never gonna be a target rifle though, but good enough for 70 yrd hunting.
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Ironman482; Thanks for the info with the arthritis in my shooting the heavy triggers don't work well for me to get the accuracy I like.
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I just got back from Surprise Arizona trip to look at property to buy - plus ride my 3 passenger jet ski on the lakes , lake pleasant , and Canyon lake in that area . Both lakes were very nice ,Canyon lake was incredible - it's like being in the grand canyon with a lake in the bottom ;D ;D ... I called Bin , and had him ship my new .357 side lever 32inch barrel bullpup off - since I told him to wait to ship it until I was back from AZ , the gun came in to Bin about the day we were leaving for AZ.... so the final count down begins to get this new gun I pre ordered about 3 months ago ....
a few pics from Canyon lake AZ .... this is a bucket list lake , and there is a big double decker paddle boat you can go on to see it called the Dolly .... This place is just jaw dropping incredible ... ;D ;D ;D ;)
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OK guy's the gun is now here , and WOW ! ;D ;D ;D ;D AEA did some major improvement's to the .357 Challenger design - with this new side lever with cheek rest that has a locking push button that keeps it closed when firing the gun , you push the button to release the side lever , I really like this design for safety for a big bore with this side lever set up ....
The magazines are a completely new with more width more shots 11 instead of 8 shots like my Challenger regular 24 barrel also the new mag will take bullets up to 3/4 inch long a BIG ! improvement over the old mags ....
This gun is built like a tank it's just really beefed up ,and with the bullpup it has the double barrel / air tube bands that keep the barrel very stable , the side lever is the most thick beefed up side lever that I have ever seen on this caliber with a magazine ....
I have not had the chance to shoot it yet so these are just my first impression's of the new .357 big 9 side lever 32 inch barrel Challenger gun , and if it shoots as good as every thing looks so far - we have a winner in the .357 class for sure , and at this price it is ,and out standing deal for sure .... ;)
Scope is the Aimsports alpha 6 ... 4.5 x 27 x 50.... it should work out very well on this gun ... ;D
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more pic's
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Wow. Looks like a tank. Big magazines. Did the twist rate change to shoot the longer bullets? What is the overall weight difference?
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Looks great! I'm sure you will like it.
I'm probably in the minority, but I like my .45 better without the pad.
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I hope they offer a side lever kit to convert the bolt action ,if it was reasonable I'd buy one otherwise I might sell mine and buy the new version.
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looks awesome.. wonder what numbers this will produce in 357..?? mags built for slugs is a first
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I hope they offer a side lever kit to convert the bolt action ,if it was reasonable I'd buy one otherwise I might sell mine and buy the new version.
Ronald keep the .357 Challenger that you have , the new .357 has to much of a design change to swap out to a side lever to the old .357 Challenger gun , plus the 32 inch barrel new side lever weighs quite a bit more also ... The 24 inch barrel bolt action model is great for shooting pellets and smaller bullets ... I think the 32 inch model out of the box will over power pellet's , and I think it will do best with 120 - 150 g bullets ... testing will tell if this play's out like I think it will ..
Myself I will not sell my 24 inch challenger .357 I really like it , and how it shoots the pellets , and smaller bullets really well , and it is pretty light for what it is ....
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Wow. Looks like a tank. Big magazines. Did the twist rate change to shoot the longer bullets? What is the overall weight difference?
Dan the new 32 inch model weighs a lot more when lifting the 2 gun's - although I do have a bigger scope on my 32inch than my 24 inch but the 32 inch is a chuck heavier , I have not weighed them yet on a scale , but you can feel the difference for sure ....
I don't know the twist rate yet , maybe Bin has that info , the mags are a very nice design change for sure especially for this 32 inch barrel model with the longer heavier bullets to match the power increase ...
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In my younger years I'd hunt with a big ole 58 cal muzzle loader however carrying something that weighs that much will wear me down these days. There's a lot of options if you have a 4 wheeler you can drive out to where you're going to hunt, especially if you have permission to hunt private land. When carrying a very heavy gun around you might want to know exactly where you're going to hunt and how(make a blind if you can) on state land in Mich it's possible to do a makeshift blind/treestand from available dead timber, use your imagination when it comes to planning out things like this. A good example is deer blinds already standing that nobody is using are a great option, I know exactly where I'll probably be hunting deer this year(old blind that's been there a long time), get there very early before sunup and you may have some luck.
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Pretty sure I’ve seen video of the 24” 357 shooting 125 gr over 900?
Have you ever tried any of the Seneca .356 size slugs? Do they work well?
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If I got one of these for Sonja, I'd get my M25 back.
Once some more details are up about shooting performance, I'll have some decisions to make.
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As soon as it stops raining like cats and dogs here I will start putting up test results , sorry it is taking me a while I just have had a bunch of stuff to deal with getting ready to move to AZ ...
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well done for your new toy.
I have purchased the 35 cal big bore challenger from fox air power (not yet delivered to my country) and the specs says 30" and not 32" barrel.
https://foxairpower.com/collections/aea-air-guns/products/aea-50-caliber-challenger-bullpup
Can you confirm yours is 32"?
also the mag seems to be 10 rounds and not 11.
I would like to get the bore size and twist rate if you can check that. It would help me buying the right bullet mold before the gun come in.
have fun
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well done for your new toy.
I have purchased the 35 cal big bore challenger from fox air power (not yet delivered to my country) and the specs says 30" and not 32" barrel.
https://foxairpower.com/collections/aea-air-guns/products/aea-50-caliber-challenger-bullpup
Can you confirm yours is 32"?
also the mag seems to be 10 rounds and not 11.
I would like to get the bore size and twist rate if you can check that. It would help me buying the right bullet mold before the gun come in.
have fun
LOL ! you are right it is a 10 shot mag ,and 30inch barrel ... Bin told me on the phone it was a long barrel like the .30 bullpup I bought from him that does have a 32inch barrel , he didnt tell me it was missing 2 inches LOL ! ::) oh well for the price he gave me I guess I can't complain ...
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Dan I had my Challenger SL 357 out in the woods yesterday to make sure it was sighted in good before Monday (opening day here), first shot went right through the heart of a fox squirrel and the second shot touched the bull on a target I pinned up, it knocked the target down so I called it a day, I'm ready 8)
(https://i.imgur.com/doYv98Y.jpg)
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Dan I had my Challenger SL 357 out in the woods yesterday to make sure it was sighted in good before Monday (opening day here), first shot went right through the heart of a fox squirrel and the second shot touched the bull on a target I pinned up, it knocked the target down so I called it a day, I'm ready 8)
Good luck Wayne and happy hunting.
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Thanks Bob, there's been a lot of bow hunters this year and I haven't been seeing the deer this year like I normally have there in the past several years. It might just be me though because I spend more time looking up in the trees than I do looking at the ground ???
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Thanks Bob, there's been a lot of bow hunters this year and I haven't been seeing the deer this year like I normally have there in the past several years. It might just be me though because I spend more time looking up in the trees than I do looking at the ground ???
Wayne, I don't think that you will find a deer in up in the trees so just think that it is a big long legged ground squirrel. I have faith that you will bag one and I wish that I could be there to help you drag it out.
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Bob right now the fox squirrels, black and gray squirrels are spending more time on the ground so I'm sure that I'll still get opportunities to bag a squirrel once I'm out there til mid day and the deer are all in the swamps. We've got a little snot on the ground right now and it's supposed to snow some more today so tomorrow with be a good opening day probably with trees dripping water and the deer will be moving around.
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Bob right now the fox squirrels, black and gray squirrels are spending more time on the ground so I'm sure that I'll still get opportunities to bag a squirrel once I'm out there til mid day and the deer are all in the swamps. We've got a little snot on the ground right now and it's supposed to snow some more today so tomorrow with be a good opening day probably with trees dripping water and the deer will be moving around.
Wayne good luck on the deer hunt , looks like you have your .357 dialed in pretty good ..
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZsHHbDWCAfk (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZsHHbDWCAfk)
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZsHHbDWCAfk (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZsHHbDWCAfk)
I like the chart at the end. The washers give a close approximation of a regulator for three shots. I noticed that you can get six decent power shots per fill, but I like to fill to peak power and shoot three times before refilling. This week looks to be &^^& for weather, but I'd like to do some testing with the washers on my .45 soon.
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So adding washers moves the power band up in pressure but doesnt really add anymore power or much in shot count. What is the point of raising the powerband like this? I only see negative results like needing a higher fill pressure and probably being louder. Am I missing something? If it was adjustable as the pressure went down itd be great like on my discovery with hammer spring adjuster.
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So adding washers moves the power band up in pressure but doesnt really add anymore power or much in shot count. What is the point of raising the powerband like this? I only see negative results like needing a higher fill pressure and probably being louder. Am I missing something? If it was adjustable as the pressure went down itd be great like on my discovery with hammer spring adjuster.
I was thinking the same,.....no thanks no washers for me :)
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So adding washers moves the power band up in pressure but doesnt really add anymore power or much in shot count. What is the point of raising the powerband like this? I only see negative results like needing a higher fill pressure and probably being louder. Am I missing something? If it was adjustable as the pressure went down itd be great like on my discovery with hammer spring adjuster.
It makes the middle of the powerband more consistent at the cost of max power. All of the shots in the string are also more consistent with a higher average velocity and FPE.
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So adding washers moves the power band up in pressure but doesnt really add anymore power or much in shot count. What is the point of raising the powerband like this? I only see negative results like needing a higher fill pressure and probably being louder. Am I missing something? If it was adjustable as the pressure went down itd be great like on my discovery with hammer spring adjuster.
I was thinking the same,.....no thanks no washers for me :)
So Manny you bought 1 of these gun's ? , and did you actually look at the video ? because very simple math shows that you have a bigger more even shot count with 3 washers added LOL ! ;D
Trust me there is a reason Jerry would be sending washers to add more pressure to the hammer when fired ...
I am adding the 3 washers in my gun , no question after seeing Bin's video that it makes a big difference ...
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I can't decide if I want to deal with the shims or not for my .45
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So adding washers moves the power band up in pressure but doesnt really add anymore power or much in shot count. What is the point of raising the powerband like this? I only see negative results like needing a higher fill pressure and probably being louder. Am I missing something? If it was adjustable as the pressure went down itd be great like on my discovery with hammer spring adjuster.
I was thinking the same,.....no thanks no washers for me :)
So Manny you bought 1 of these gun's ? , and did you actually look at the video ? because very simple math shows that you have a bigger more even shot count with 3 washers added LOL ! ;D
Trust me there is a reason Jerry would be sending washers to add more pressure to the hammer when fired ...
I am adding the 3 washers in my gun , no question after seeing Bin's video that it makes a big difference ...
On the video less peak power and more pressure needed, it only takes one shot to take down game I would stick to the more powerful shot at less pressure.
And no, there's no appeal to me for those guns, If I wanted to get a powerful Big bore I would get an American made Texan
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I can't decide if I want to deal with the shims or not for my .45
The good thing is you can always remove the washers , looking at Bin's video it is defiantly a lot better shot string with average FPE much higher over 8 shot's , in fact if you just go to 3800 psi it looks like you will have 6 shots with very high pretty even FPE/FPS , that is like is 3- 4 more shots than I get with my badger .40 running the same air pressure plus the AEA has a 10 round mag , the advantage with the badger is it weighs just 7lbs ,and change ,and when you test with the badger you are better off to tether to a large tank since the air tube capacity is not that large ... I think most people the majority of their shooting will be at targets none hunting where you would want to have that more even shot count with more shots , the peak FPS single shot on either tune is so very close that it makes more sense to to have the larger shot string with the higher pressure ...
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I put the 3 washers in today ,and adjusted the alpha 6 scope a bit ,set up a new table to shoot off since my large tile saw is sitting on the table I normally use ,and i am in the middle of doing a job with it ... I am hoping to test fire this gun tomorrow , I just have not had the time to shoot lately , so tomorrow I will have 115g stuff ,and under to test, and now that I have seen Bin's test with a 152g bullet ... I will buy new mold mold's close to that weight ....
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I ordered 3 new molds a 105g / 125g / 158g .358 sized all in flat nose bullet design , that should be here with in a week ... as soon as they get here I am going to cast a chunk of each size around 200 of each then start doing the testing of this gun , so I will have 6 different bullets , and 3 to 4 pellets if I choose to test those , I am more interested in the bullets of course with this 30 inch barrel , but it will still be interesting to see how fast and accurate this gun shoots pellets , I am thinking this gun will crack the speed of sound with 105 g , and below testing will tell the story on that one .... I just have not had the time to test the last weeks but now it looks like I have enough cleared out of my schedule to do some testing coming up ....
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I ordered 3 new molds a 105g / 125g / 158g .358 sized all in flat nose bullet design , that should be here with in a week ... as soon as they get here I am going to cast a chunk of each size around 200 of each then start doing the testing of this gun , so I will have 6 different bullets , and 3 to 4 pellets if I choose to test those , I am more interested in the bullets of course with this 30 inch barrel , but it will still be interesting to see how fast and accurate this gun shoots pellets , I am thinking this gun will crack the speed of sound with 105 g , and below testing will tell the story on that one .... I just have not had the time to test the last weeks but now it looks like I have enough cleared out of my schedule to do some testing coming up ....
Assuming you can get enough hammer strike, I wouldn't be surprised if you are able to go supersonic with a properly sized 125gr. The 105's should easily go supersonic, again assuming enough hammer strike. The Challenger's high pressures and that 30" barrel should do the trick. As a reference, with 29" barrel and 3800PSI my mod bulldog can send 130gr just over 1100fps.
Based on what I've seen in videos, etc the Big 9 appears to have pretty big porting, so I think it really boils down to how much hammer strike/dwell can be developed to take advantage of those high pressures and 30" barrel.
Looking forward to seeing how things progress.
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I ordered 3 new molds a 105g / 125g / 158g .358 sized all in flat nose bullet design , that should be here with in a week ... as soon as they get here I am going to cast a chunk of each size around 200 of each then start doing the testing of this gun , so I will have 6 different bullets , and 3 to 4 pellets if I choose to test those , I am more interested in the bullets of course with this 30 inch barrel , but it will still be interesting to see how fast and accurate this gun shoots pellets , I am thinking this gun will crack the speed of sound with 105 g , and below testing will tell the story on that one .... I just have not had the time to test the last weeks but now it looks like I have enough cleared out of my schedule to do some testing coming up ....
Assuming you can get enough hammer strike, I wouldn't be surprised if you are able to go supersonic with a properly sized 125gr. The 105's should easily go supersonic, again assuming enough hammer strike. The Challenger's high pressures and that 30" barrel should do the trick. As a reference, with 29" barrel and 3800PSI my mod bulldog can send 130gr just over 1100fps.
Based on what I've seen in videos, etc the Big 9 appears to have pretty big porting, so I think it really boils down to how much hammer strike/dwell can be developed to take advantage of those high pressures and 30" barrel.
Looking forward to seeing how things progress.
Yep that is pretty close to what the math is telling me also Mike , Bin's test showed 348 fpe with the 152 g bullet , I am thinking the 158g should push it over 350 fpe , and that would be right with my .401 XP badger in stock form which to me is very impressive for a stock .357 with a 10 round mag ... AEA is making these big bores so hot out of the box there is not much to gain from tuning- Jerry is sending them out already maxed tuned which is cool with me so all I have to do is work on casting bullets, and pulling the trigger ;)....
I need to figure out some .30 bullet's for my AEA 32 inch barrel bullpup ,and the Hatsan carnivore .30 not to much available that looks like what I would want ... there is a 65g accurate flat nose mold that looks identical to my 196g accurate flat nose .401 that I use in my badger .... LOL ! IT just never ends does it .. ;D ;D ;D ;D
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Any updates on the big 9?