GTA
All Springer/NP/PCP Air Gun Discussion General => Air Gun Gate => Topic started by: oldnamvet on June 27, 2021, 01:43:14 PM
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Looking through a catalog and noticed that the Cometa Indian Air Pistol, with only 7 lbs of cocking effort generates 492 FPS. One page previous the Browning Buck Mark air pistol requires 19.8 lbs of cocking effort which results in only 360 FPS. More cocking effort but less velocity? Is that due to the longer barrel of the Cometa or a longer cocking lever since it is an overlever rather than a break barrel? Obviously I spend too much time looking at details.
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Some manufactures dont believe in truth in advertising. dont know if that is the case here. Would be nice if a member here owns one and would share numbers and pellet weight of their shooter
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Peak cocking force does not predict pellet foot.pounds. Peak cocking force depends a lot on leverage. That Cometa has a long and more complex cocking lever, with the effective fulcrum and opposing hinge points arranged to reduce the peak force. This, while the higher average force and long travel enable storing more energy.
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I have the Buckmark and the cocking effort is much less than 20 lbs.
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Going on the assumption that all info is truth, it still doesn't mean much.
Different is different. Stroke length, size spring . Ammo in testing, and just too many apples to aardvarks comparisons.
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Having cocked and shot one….think the ad copy is total BS.
But with a gain of truth….Archimedes worked out some lever rules something like 2400 years ago.
Cometa is a long more complicated cocking lever….but it’s not likely to get it down to 7 pounds of force.
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Here is the Pyramyd Air review:
https://www.pyramydair.com/blog/2012/09/cometa-indian-spring-piston-air-pistol-part-1/ (https://www.pyramydair.com/blog/2012/09/cometa-indian-spring-piston-air-pistol-part-1/)
https://www.pyramydair.com/blog/2012/09/cometa-indian-spring-piston-air-pistol-part-2/ (https://www.pyramydair.com/blog/2012/09/cometa-indian-spring-piston-air-pistol-part-2/)
https://www.pyramydair.com/blog/2012/09/cometa-indian-spring-piston-air-pistol-part-3/ (https://www.pyramydair.com/blog/2012/09/cometa-indian-spring-piston-air-pistol-part-3/)
This pistol has a very long cocking travel. I can see the peak cocking force being a lot lower than other pistols of that power level. That said, peak force is only part of the picture. Comfortable ergonomics reduce the perceived effort. Poor ergonomics will cause the cocking effort to feel harder than the measured value.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F30QqiaRq8s (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F30QqiaRq8s)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yufaf25L_N4 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yufaf25L_N4)
May 9 2011
My review of the Cometa Indian Indian spring-piston air pistol.
Also known by it's earlier version as the RWS-9, the Indian is unique as an over-cocking pistol
air pistol. It is differentiated from other over-cockers in that it's barrel is not a part
of the cocking lever (as it is in the Beeman P1, or Webley Tempest). Like the RWS-9 it comes
in two finishes: black, and nickel-plated. It is only available in .177 caliber.
It is cocked by first pushing the manual safety to on; forward towards the barrel. This will
disengage it from the cocking lever, which it will hold in place when it (the safety) is moved
rearward to the "fire" position. Then the lever can be lifted upward, and swung forward, over the top
of the pistol, then downward in a total arc of about 300 degrees. The lever is hinged at the
front of the pistol. NOTE: The lever is connected to a rack and pinion, and the rack is visible when the pistol is
cocked. It can be seen extending from the front of the pistol. This feature greatly reduces cocking effort.
Once the lever is lifted, it releases the sring-loaded breech closure. This
reveals the breech tray where the pellet can be laid prior to shoving it into the breech. The
breech closure is made of plastic but it has a metal probe with an O-ring on it. This probe can be
be used to shove the pellet in. The O-ring probably acts as compression seal. When bringing the
cocking lever back to it's firing position, the breech closure must be held in place, as it
is spring-loaded to make the closure "pop" open once the lever is lifted. Taking the safety off holds the lever
in place for firing.
Quite quirky, imo, but in actual use, it's surprsingly simple, and loading a pellet is quickly
done. Of note is if you've loaded pellets in to an under lever or side lever rifle, loading a
pellet into the Indian can be similarly a fumble-fingers issue. Sometimes there is some fidgeting to get the
.177 pellet into the loading tray. A .22 pellet would be easier to handle. Be agile of fingers! The cocking
effort is only eight pounds. The pistol weighs only 2.5 pounds.
The sights are very basic, and plastic. The rear sight is only adjustable for windage; a major
drawback to an otherwise great little pistol.
The pistol has a one-stage trigger that breaks crisp, and smooth after it's worn in. It can be vey
stiff when new, and it will effect accuracy either way, but you get so much better results
once it's broken in.
The grips are somewhat ergonomic, if a bit narrow. There is a nice shelf of a thumb rest.
It only comes with right-hand grips, iirc.
Accuracy is surprsingly good. I can make ragged single holes at close to ten yards. The barrel
is cold-forged, and crowned. I've also hit 12oz plastic bottles at 30 yards. The pistol is as
accurate as I am.
Power is advertised as being between 400 and 500FPS. I chronographed mine using Crosman
Destroyer-EX pellets @7.9 grains. The Indian averaged 480FPS/4FPE, with a low of 475FPS,
and a high of 486FPS. I was surprised, and not expecting it to do more than 400FPS, really.
Not too bad for a quiet pistol with relatively low recoil. No wonder no one wants to
sell the older RWS-9s. Sweet-shooting pistol.
A few things to be aware of with the Cometa Indian: The cocking lever has some sharp edges that
really need to be rounded off or they can really hurt the unsuspecting hand. Pay aprticular
attention to that area of the lever that engages the safety; really pointy edge there. Also,
the lever can move about a bit, coming in contact with the receiver. This caused scratches,
and a small gouge in the receiver I only discovered too late. Mine is the black pistol,
and I need to buy some metal-black to cover the scratches. In the meantime I've used black
elctrical tape to provide protection to the rub areas.
I also have a Browning 800_Mag. Comparatively speaking, the Indian is much lighter and easier
to cock. It's more accurate too, and far less pellet-picky. So I reach for the Spanish-made
Cometa Indian far more than I reach for the Browning. It's accurate, relatively quiet. I've
Modified the rear sight by adding a notched rear sight from a broken unit taken from my
Browning 800_Mag. I drilled and slotted it to make it elevation-adjustable. It is held in place
by a bolt; I drilled a hole into the rear of the plastic rear sight and let the bolt serlf-thread
it's way in. I ground down the original rear notch. The design needs some refinement, but the concept works like a charm!
I've included two pictures that show the Browning and the Indian, both cocked and not. You can see the rack
extending from the front of the Indian.
That's my review. Thanks for reading!
Darryl
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Mr. B.B. Pelletier himself claims the 7lbs cocking effort and it is not an ad. Why should he make up this number if it would be fake ?
It concerns the long lever indeed and maybe the Indian has a little bit less rough internals compared with a Buckmark and is maybe better lubricated and there you go, 7lbs of cocking effort.
Seems like a nice solid air pistol though. I like the nickel one.
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It is light to cock...whole lot of motion to cock it (probably close to 300degrees of a circle)....didn't feel like 7 pounds to me at it's peak, but it is spread out over a long-long travel. Won't see the owner again until October (he's 5 states away)...but I'll as him to put it on luggage scale before that.