GTA
All Springer/NP/PCP Air Gun Discussion General => PCP/CO2/HPA Air Gun Gates "The Darkside" => Topic started by: Gabpan on May 30, 2021, 04:16:53 AM
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Are there any rifles out there that use a refillable co2 system other than the Benjamin discovery?
How about a refillable co2 cart? Anybody try those?
I bought a maximus but it is air only. Need a co2 rifle.
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Are you sure about that?
Seems to me I bulk filled my Maximus a couple times before I bought a compressor... but I may be wrong (again).
First ones that come to mind are the Daisy 887 / 888 models. You can still get a new 887 from CMP.
You can buy an adapter for the Beeman QB-78 (AR2078) or the Xisico XS60-C. I got mine from Mike M. at Flying Dragon Airguns.
Dennis Baker sell an adapter for Crosman 22XX but you will need to change the top of the valve to his "Max Flow" units.
I think AlchemyAirwerks has something similar.
Also check vintage, I am really enjoying my old Crosman 114
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The Daisy Avanti 887 is a 2.5oz refillable match grade gun. Airgun Depot currently has them.
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Moved to the PCP/Co2 Gate.
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Skinny and low volume (2.5 oz of co2?)...those Daisy-Avanti tanks are quite good tanks that couple up for refilling/shooting to a paintball type thread.
Not that a paintball shop is going to want to refill them....but you can work out a worth while fill system from a 20-24oz paint ball tank...and then go get 2 or 3 20-24oz paintball donor tanks refilled.
Direct bulk fill is possible, has gotten harder to get all the "ship" you need over the years to do it.
But if you really-really want a bulk fill co2....at a reduced speed/energy, would look at the Croamsn 2K air fills.....Disco/Maxi....have never run co2 (which is mostly liquid co2) though a regulator.
At one time or another, have run nearly every non-regulatged PCP with bulk fill Co2....not many of them gave tyhe OK for that kind of thing, but I did it anyway)/ The higher the PCP air rating, the harder it was to down-tune to a reasonably co23 use.....the lower the fill prtessure, the easier to just adjust it to the co2 consumption level.
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There is another Rifle that could be run on CO2. Airgun Depot had a dedicated Video to convert the Umarex Gauntlet to CO2.
Here is the link on YouTube:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tqz4uRtmdd0 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tqz4uRtmdd0)
Have fun.
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A while ago I used to have a 88 gram to 12 gram co2 adapter for the 1077. I wish I would've never gave it away.
I keep my eyes open on here for one. I haven't done much looking online.
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Got a QB79 with refillable 88gram cart..you'll need a on/off valve plus fittings to bulk fill it. The 79 is now HPA to shoot all season. CO2 is only good when the weather is warm/hot unless you're shooting indoor.
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The few times I've tried I've had a problem with over consumption even after tuning trying to convert hpa guns to co2. Granted those were all tube guns, i have pondered ideas for a simple mod keeping shot gas mostly vapor....ie some type of expansion device or very light check valve....so far I haven't tried making anything.
Oh, well actually I had a .25 AF Condor I ran with a co2 adapter that was quite an amazing co2 shooter. I'd imagine the same would go for a talon/ss/ the original AirForce offerings
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But if you really-really want a bulk fill co2....at a reduced speed/energy, would look at the Croamsn 2K air fills.....Disco/Maxi....
Did you catch that GABRIEL? ;)
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Big co2 information/idea dump:
Did run a talon SS with co2 for a good long while. Various barrels got swapped back and forth. Pretty good for a co2 rifle. Now it would be the cost of the AirForce rifle and the $113 adapter. Bought new, would be $750-$800…..not too many co2 fans want to spend that.
Hard to find QB79’s now. They did run with the 9 oz tanks or the smaller 3.5oz tanks that were once popular. Was the easiest way to deal with it if you had a local paintball shop to fill paintball tanks. The odd stuff we got them to run on (like refillable 88gr.) were a fill it yourself at home kind of thing.
Thinking and figuring. Can roughly estimate the bulk fill co2 by thinking 43cc’s per ounce. Was bulk filling the converted AirSource tanks. Air volume of a Disco/Maxi would allow about the same amount of co2. Can’t detach the tube like you can an AirSource, but same basic fill.
Only Crosman DID mentioned dual-fuel, all the others strictly forbid Co2. Crosman no longer mentions it with the Maixi...and the co2 bulk fill they do still sell is listed as specific to the Discovery. By inference, they gave up on co2 bulk fill too.
Most of the other non-regulated PCP’s tried on co2 were tethered for the tests. Same results as bulk fill that wasn’t tethered.
Never tried gagging a regulator with co2….didn’t see any advantage to doing so and suspect injecting partly liquid co2 into a regulator would not be a good idea….but never tried.
A lot of my shooting tends to be testing from a bench. At one time, had a 6 POUND tank strapped to the bottom of the bench and a tether line up though the bench.
Am sure they have reasons for forbidding co2 use.
Having been inside them, know the o-rings I use when I reseal them are the same and the poppet material was the same. But just because I got away with co2 use with no damage I can detect doesn’t mean you will. Will certainly PO the maker if you let it be known you did.
One way of looking at the PCP guys who try Helium vs. Air is that it shows that a lite/thin gas shoots faster at the same pressure. Co2 is a heavy/thick gas, and will shoot slower at the same pressure as air.
A co2 paintball tanker Gauntlet would work. Would be slower and sensitive to cold temperatures, but could swap tanks back to regulated HPA . Still have a couple of the little 3.5oz paintball tanks (once popular with the LD shooters) and had considered a Gauntlet.
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A while ago I used to have a 88 gram to 12 gram co2 adapter for the 1077. I wish I would've never gave it away.
I keep my eyes open on here for one. I haven't done much looking online.
No longer available.....
https://www.amazon.com/Crosman-AirSource-1077-adapter-upgrade/dp/B001UNPROA (https://www.amazon.com/Crosman-AirSource-1077-adapter-upgrade/dp/B001UNPROA)
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I like the gauntlet on co2...but if you want decent performance (I assume that you will compromise that as co2 isnt usually sought out by power mongers) I would say open everything up a fair bit. That block will help choke back alot of liquid, making a slightly more efficient gun
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I like 12g shooters:
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49899124657_4b03449bae.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2j2q4it)DSCN2724 (https://flic.kr/p/2j2q4it) by Robert Dean (https://www.flickr.com/photos/144930793@N07/), on Flickr
Best price (in bulk) I can get (n bulk) is about $.40 power 12gr…..so it’s more like $.93 per ounce.
Best price in AirSource is more like $1.70 per ounce.
With already paid for 20 pound tank and a place that will fill it (that’s a real PIA), works out to something between $.32 and $.44 per ounce. The maintenance and hydro testing on me, so maybe closer to $.53 per ounce.
No matter how you look at it….normal folks can’t create home made liquid co2, it’s always going toy cost more than air.
Being really really cheap, noiticed that I can get dry ice for $2.00 a pound….should still be a pound once it’s melted (ok contained, and partly liquid and partly gas once it gets up to temp), if I can find a way to contain it whilke it transforms from solid...to liquid...to gas...should still be 16oz.
Which would work out to like $.12 an ounce.
Dude….I’m cheap….but I’m not that dry-ice type cheap.
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Converting dry ice to gas is rather dangerous since you can inadvertently create a pipe bomb. It should be liquid at 1100 PSI up to around 90 degrees Fahrenheit, I would suggest if anyone wants to try converting dry ice to CO2 gas you use a vessel with a pressure release valve incase the temperature gets too high.
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I like 12g shooters:
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49899124657_4b03449bae.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2j2q4it)DSCN2724 (https://flic.kr/p/2j2q4it) by Robert Dean (https://www.flickr.com/photos/144930793@N07/), on Flickr
Best price (in bulk) I can get (n bulk) is about $.40 power 12gr…..so it’s more like $.93 per ounce.
Best price in AirSource is more like $1.70 per ounce.
With already paid for 20 pound tank and a place that will fill it (that’s a real PIA), works out to something between $.32 and $.44 per ounce. The maintenance and hydro testing on me, so maybe closer to $.53 per ounce.
No matter how you look at it….normal folks can’t create home made liquid co2, it’s always going toy cost more than air.
Being really really cheap, noiticed that I can get dry ice for $2.00 a pound….should still be a pound once it’s melted (ok contained, and partly liquid and partly gas once it gets up to temp), if I can find a way to contain it whilke it transforms from solid...to liquid...to gas...should still be 16oz.
Which would work out to like $.12 an ounce.
Dude….I’m cheap….but I’m not that dry-ice type cheap.
Well illustrated. I got used to bottle bulking with the AF and I figured it was cheap as it got.....but after you really look at the numbers cartridges are perfectly adequate, and can be made into a variety of different targets afterwards 👍
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A while ago I used to have a 88 gram to 12 gram co2 adapter for the 1077. I wish I would've never gave it away.
I keep my eyes open on here for one. I haven't done much looking online.
No longer available.....
https://www.amazon.com/Crosman-AirSource-1077-adapter-upgrade/dp/B001UNPROA (https://www.amazon.com/Crosman-AirSource-1077-adapter-upgrade/dp/B001UNPROA)
Yeah, no kidding.. I know it's not available. That's why I keep hoping I see one here in the classifieds...
Long story short, pops gave it away to a kid who he rebuilt a 1077. He said he was gonna get me another one, but that didn't happen. It's also not on my radar all the time...
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A while ago I used to have a 88 gram to 12 gram co2 adapter for the 1077. I wish I would've never gave it away.
I keep my eyes open on here for one. I haven't done much looking online.
No longer available.....
https://www.amazon.com/Crosman-AirSource-1077-adapter-upgrade/dp/B001UNPROA (https://www.amazon.com/Crosman-AirSource-1077-adapter-upgrade/dp/B001UNPROA)
Yeah, no kidding.. I know it's not available. That's why I keep hoping I see one here in the classifieds...
Long story short, pops gave it away to a kid who he rebuilt a 1077. He said he was gonna get me another one, but that didn't happen. It's also not on my radar all the time...
I was actually giving anyone who has never seen them and example. I had two of them I picked up in and old discount store a few years ago.. I let them go in a trade.
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Ahh, ok. lol
I need to keep this item on my radar more often. I know I've seen them kicking around, but never thought about it, then I need it. haha