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All Springer/NP/PCP Air Gun Discussion General => PCP/CO2/HPA Air Gun Gates "The Darkside" => Topic started by: Mike-Nashville on May 06, 2021, 12:30:28 AM
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Looking to purchase my first BullPup and want to keep it at a really low price. I am left handed but know I will not find a BullPup that is ambidextrous unless I spend a lot or go with the Walther Reign. I have looked at several but have no idea as to the quality of build or value. Your thoughts between these or others will be appreciated, Walther Reign, Benjamin Akela, Hatsan FlashPup, Hatsan BullBoss, Kral Puncher. I do want a .25cal and the Akela is only produced in .22cal right now but I like the design.
Thanks for any help.
Mike
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How are you planning to fill it?
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Throw the Bullboss out of that list. The newer ones are pigs, and full of trouble. The Flashpup can make just as much power with a lot less weight. I'd think the Walther would be a no brainer, given you're a lefty? Of course, the others are good guns too. The Flashpup will probably make the most power, but the Walther and the Akela are probably a bit better in quality. Many like their Krals too. If you want light weight, the the Walther or the Flashpup will be the way to go.
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The gun should be internally on par with the Chief, which has really been improved, but since it's so new not much personal experience I'm betting. On the cheapest end I would think the Beeman Under lever would fit your description.
https://www.pyramydair.com/product/beeman-under-lever-pcp-air-rifle?m=5191 (https://www.pyramydair.com/product/beeman-under-lever-pcp-air-rifle?m=5191)
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I have three Flash guns two in .25 and a pup in .22 they have been good performers. They all did receive some attention to get them where they are today however.
I would really look into the new Flash with the side lever. I think for me anyway the side lever would be worth the wait.
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I have a Yong Heng as well one that works off 12V car battery. They both work but have their issues. I have been waiting for a good used one to come along but that has just not happened yet. I have not looked at the Beeman underleaver because of the decrease in the Beeman quality in the past years. Most of my rifles and pistols happen to be right handed as not many are made for lefties. You just go with what you can find.
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Each brand has good and bad points and I guess it is just a choice as to which one to try. As long as I can get a decent group at 50 yards and it continue to work without too much tinkering with, then I'm good.
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Here is another BP to consider.
https://www.aeaairgunus.com/collections/aea-challenger-series/products/challenger-bullpup (https://www.aeaairgunus.com/collections/aea-challenger-series/products/challenger-bullpup)
(https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0444/7774/3262/products/CHALLENGERBULLPUP_1024x1024@2x.jpg?v=1616435333)
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I've got the flashpup with the side lever. I really like it but you can't switch sides on the lever and the ,magazines can only load from one direction (the right), and the lever appears to be held in place with a screw and a rivet at two points of contact. The screw connects the lever to the frame and the rivet connects it to the pellet probe.This is unfortunate because it makes removal of the lever difficult (by difficult I mean I haven't been able to do it). which is necessary to remove the pellet probe and the the guide. You can still get the hammer out. Then again, I'm new and I could just be an idiot :L
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I think the Walther Reign is the only one that is designed to be lefty friendly. The magazine can be loaded from either side and the side lever can be easily moved to the left side of the gun.
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I think most of the Krals can be switched to left hand use. I know my Empire X can switch easily, but the other's in the Puncher line should do the same. Just a note, Empire and Empire X are probably going to stay at the 30fpe spec. that is listed. Discussion with Troy Hammer says there are some oddities with the way they did the cocking that limits the transfer port. There may be other restrictions in there too. It is new enough to me that I haven't even looked at what they have done and how I might squeeze a slight amount of power out of it. I say slight because I want 25 to 30 grain pellets up to around 830fps, right now I can only get this with 20 grain pellets which limits ammo to about one brand and design.
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So far as I know, currently there are two bull pups under $350….the Flashpup and the Beeman under leaver (not sure who actually manufactures that one) There may be more I’m unaware of (not being a bull pup fan)….and there are air gun makers that never seem to get US importation.
There is only one poster here that seems to have bought a Beeman bull pup (or at least only one that posted about it)...that’s a big unknown. Am pretty sure the under leaver would tick-off bench rest shooters, but at least it would be a more lefty-friendly bull pup.
There should be more inexpensive bullpups….likely will be….that’s the way of any market, not just airguns.
PCP’s once were the “hot snit” and all that were offered were comparatively expensive. Pretty much filled up the high prices market, then started working on the low price market.
Compressors…..chronographs….they all followed the same pattern of filling the upper end market, then the lower end market.
It’s the way the world works….big screen TV’s...microwaves….GPS units…etc.
Really seems to tick-off the folks with the expensive versions when you “join the club” with a cheaper version. Always looked at that knee-jerk defensive reaction as their problem, not mine.
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I'm a lefty too, and I have a Flashpup (older version) at first I thought it would be difficult to cycle being meant for a right handed shooter, but it's not that hard to cycle for a lefty, and mine is a laser shooting 750 fps with JSB MKll .25's, it originally was set higher (850) but I lowered it for more shot count, it shoots as accurate as my Weihrauch HW100's, it's super light too, 6-1/2 lbs, I would recommend a Flashpup.
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I've had a synthetic flashpup for about 2 yrs now. It's been a great gun straight out of the box. Get the refurbs and save some cash. Mine is 22 and though not as smooth shoots as well as my dreamline. A used dreamline pup usually goes for about 700$ and is a great gun with a ton of adjustability.
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I like that Walther a lot. (from its description.) I have a Flashpup myself (wood stock) and love it for the price, but that rear-located bolt keeps me from recommending it unless someone is really strapped for funds. I thought I could get used to that location, but it still fights me every day.
Also, the bolt system has no mechanism to stop you from double-feeding, which just plain happens once in a while.
The Walther has a cocking lever. - And it's near the trigger, which is rare in that price range.
(I don't see anything written about an anti double-feed system, but hopefully it has that.)
It also fills to 3,000 psi, so a lot more shots for a given cylinder volume. And that probably also means that the internals are beefier than in lesser guns. If you regulate it down a bit, it will probably last a long time.
The Walther also has a nice low cheek rest area, which IMO is critical on a bullpup.
And of course it's almost a no-brainer if you're a lefty.
And best of all - The Walther has a long barrel yet is surprisingly short, overall. At only 34", it might still be a great slug gun.
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The negatives:
1: I hate synthetic stocks.
2: No shroud, and the suppressor isn't removable. Which means there are no threads to either add a short 2nd unit, or replace it all with a larger unit.
I have a serious problem with this. If not for this problem, I'd consider this to be the ultimate "starter" gun for further modifications. (Like adding an external, inline regulator, for which there is plenty of available room.)
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...and I still think a nice inexpensive CO2 bullpup repeater would sell like hotcakes...
(but only in summer)
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Might not qualify as cheap ,but the SPA ,or Diana P15 has worked great for me , 3 years ago I think I paid around 600.00 for the P15 , the Diana comes with a better stock and both are regulated.
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Make a move to big bore and the Benjamin bulldog is left friendly. I sure wish they'd make a small bore version on this format.
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Regaring "left friendly" -
You might also consider which side you really want the cocking arm on. As a righty, I think i'd prefer it on the left side, as I'd rather not take my hand off the trigger. With a bullpup. you can still balance the gun with just your right, so a left side arm has advantages, as long as it's located up by the trigger.
In fact, several higher-end pcp bullpups are being made that way right now.
So as a lefty.....
Just make sure the magazine can be loaded from either side.
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Oh and I mis-typed, above. The Walther fills to 3300 psi, not 3,000, which is why I mentioned it will give more shots per cc than most low-priced guns.
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Thanks Guys this is a lot of info for me to consider. As of right now I am totally confused on which one to get. But I am usually that way about everything. I always want the $1500 item but only pay $500 for it. I have found you usually get what you pay for. I do like the Walther but agree that it needs a wood stock or a more substantial synthetic stock. I would also like the ability to add a suppressor of my choice. Thanks again and I have a lot to take in and consider.
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Thanks Guys this is a lot of info for me to consider. As of right now I am totally confused on which one to get. But I am usually that way about everything. I always want the $1500 item but only pay $500 for it. I have found you usually get what you pay for. I do like the Walther but agree that it needs a wood stock or a more substantial synthetic stock. I would also like the ability to add a suppressor of my choice. Thanks again and I have a lot to take in and consider.
Here's an idea:
Get the synthetic Flashpup, for now. It's a great rifle for the money, and very popular, and if / when you resell it, you won't lose much at all.
Get that 10-stage aftermarket baffle off Ebay for the stock QE shroud, and it will be almost as quiet as a Donny Shogun. (trust me on this.)
You can put the extra money into a better scope.
You can see if you like cocking on the right. (Of course, it will also be at the back, which changes things...)
And then you can save until you have enough to buy that $1500 gun. ;D
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This the one you're talking about? https://www.ebay.com/itm/333276251950?hash=item4d98d0072e:g:JKgAAOSwryheGl12 (https://www.ebay.com/itm/333276251950?hash=item4d98d0072e:g:JKgAAOSwryheGl12)
There's another right above it when I looked claiming to be a drop in 13 stage but it only vents on stages 10-12:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/303950737931?hash=item46c4e0320b:g:4BgAAOSwocZgblnx (https://www.ebay.com/itm/303950737931?hash=item46c4e0320b:g:4BgAAOSwocZgblnx)
Yes, I have a Flashpup and why I'm asking...lol
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That's the one.
It makes a huge difference over the stock QE innards.
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Regaring "left friendly" -
You might also consider which side you really want the cocking arm on. As a righty, I think i'd prefer it on the left side, as I'd rather not take my hand off the trigger. With a bullpup. you can still balance the gun with just your right, so a left side arm has advantages, as long as it's located up by the trigger.
In fact, several higher-end pcp bullpups are being made that way right now.
So as a lefty.....
Just make sure the magazine can be loaded from either side.
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Oh and I mis-typed, above. The Walther fills to 3300 psi, not 3,000, which is why I mentioned it will give more shots per cc than most low-priced guns.
This forum is awesome. I love it so much :D
I'm still a long-ish while from buying my first PCP, but bullpups are where my head is for my first one. I was following for that reason and ignoring the left-hand element.....then this little gem pops up and I feel like I'll never be the same...that feels "correct" to my brain/body even though I've never experienced it. Thanks, that's very helpful to me as I get deeper...
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While checking out the possibilities available I noticed several videos on the Walther Reign do not have the factory fixed suppressor. The videos were posted in 2019 and 2020 but did have a screw on end cap. I was wondering if these models were shipped to other countries or did Walther just make a change. Does anyone have any comments concerning this question? Thanks
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While checking out the possibilities available I noticed several videos on the Walther Reign do not have the factory fixed suppressor. The videos were posted in 2019 and 2020 but did have a screw on end cap. I was wondering if these models were shipped to other countries or did Walther just make a change. Does anyone have any comments concerning this question? Thanks
I think Europe got the removable suppressor and a regulator. In the US we get the fixed suppressor and no reg.
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You just might be correct on Europe getting those without factory LDC's but wish they have given us the option. The rifle I am looking for does not have to be left handed or have a changeable cocking mechanism. I do think I need the cocking lever up by the trigger and that would work. To have it back where my chin will be setting would be a little difficult. It is doable but not convent. Again thanks for everyones help and suggestions.
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I have an FX Wildcat in .22 and a Flashpup in .177. I'm with all the other Flashpup owners; it's a great gun, but you have to go through something to get to the point it's a work horse. I have one of the early ones with the difficult magazines, however, they have always performed and never bothered to upgrade. The only problem I really had was the power of the gun would throw the bolt back after every shot. Eventually, the corner where the bolt sits forward wore down and the bolt would no longer seat forward sealing the barrel. My mechanic friend removed the stock and welded a small piece of steel there to "remake" the corner. Now the bolt never flies back after a shot and the gun is near perfect. For a .177 that is pushing about 18 fpe by shooting a 7.9 CPHP at around 1000 fps. At 30 yards, it is almost hole in hole. Super impressed with how quiet, how strong, how light and good this little bullpup feels. It is my go to back yard gun. I bought mine when it first came out and they had a deal on a wood stock, .177 Flashpup for $249. Couldn't pass it up. Totally worth it.
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Well I did not get a cheap bullpup nor did I get a left handed friendly one. I bought a Cricket in .25cal and glad I did. The cricket is just so nicely built and feels perfect in my hands. I paid twice what I want to but do think I will be glad I did in the long run. Maybe not but at this point I think I will. I do want to find a wooded stock or a custom wooden stock for it. The synthetic works great but I am just a sucker for old school beautiful wood. Eventually I will upgrade to a Cricket II and that will work better being a lefty.
Thanks for everyone's suggestions
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Might I suggest you look at the Beeman Underlever Cocking Bullpup in .177 caliber (Model 1357) or .22 cal. (Model 1358)?
(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/51bIzgvGP-S._AC_SL1200_.jpg)
Let's take a look at the list of features:
- Includes Scope (4x32mm).
- Wood Stock.
- Comes with two rotary magazines.
- Includes single shot tray.
- Ambidextrous.
- Powerful.
- Small (32")
- Lightweight (7.6 LBS)
- 3K PSI Fill
- Under $350 US.
Here is Airgun Angie putting it to work.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4qLCxOOcPx8# (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4qLCxOOcPx8#)
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I just bought a few weeks ago the AEA Challenger bullpup .30 with 32 inch barrel it's a real power house for under 600 bucks , on high power it will shoot NOE 46g pellets at around 1200 fps , and I have the power selector turned down to 910 fps when shooting those pellets , ...
Bob - Mr. Hollow point just did some 4500 psi testing with the gun in none bullpup with about identical parts he hit 214 FPE shooting a hollow point 82g bullet 1084 FPS ...with the right bullet it might be possible to hit the 240-250 FPE range..
I don't think there is any other bullpup in .30 putting out this kind of power to date that is available off the shelf with this kind of power ....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Y6z6BQOdgs (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Y6z6BQOdgs)
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I just bought a few weeks ago the AEA Challenger bullpup .30 with 32 inch barrel it's a real power house for under 600 bucks , on high power it will shoot NOE 46g pellets at around 1200 fps , and I have the power selector turned down to 910 fps when shooting those pellets , ...
Bob - Mr. Hollow point just did some 4500 psi testing with the gun in none bullpup with about identical parts he hit 214 FPE shooting a hollow point 82g bullet 1084 FPS ...with the right bullet it might be possible to hit the 240-250 FPE range..
I don't think there is any other bullpup in .30 putting out this kind of power to date that is available off the shelf with this kind of power ....
X2 IMO the best bang for the buck guns on the market ATM.
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The Cricket is a nice choice, they are very nice guns, have fun with it and happy airgunning. ;)