GTA
All Springer/NP/PCP Air Gun Discussion General => PCP/CO2/HPA Air Gun Gates "The Darkside" => Topic started by: Bunyboyz on February 12, 2021, 12:19:06 PM
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I’ve been eyeing up the Artemis 750 and chaser/bandit whichever one is the pistol. The Ataman and HW800 are out of my ideal price range. The rex is DQ due to single shot.
But I’m really on search/build quest for a PCP pistol in .22 that will do say close to 30 FPE for one magazine.
I think a Prod is really larger then what I’d consider a pistol.
I’m asking for guys to share what you’ve seen in PCP pistols and pros and cons.
*the prod bullpup kit recently posted looks neat but that price is more then I’d like to spend.
Appreciate the guidance
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my Prod isn't too long, just remove the ldc and stock and it's a nice pistol.
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wont happen on a factory pistol.. not enough air on board.. as to why theres no powerful pcp pistols in pistol format, no idea.. the bandit could be modded to 25 fpe or so , but i dont think youd ever get the full power over 9 shots from 50cc.. youd need a secondary tube below the first one.. What youre proposing is going to be expensive either in machine work or up front for one of the higher end guns.. I do think evanix made a true pistol similar to those requirements. and its still only 22 fpe
https://www.krale.shop/us/evanix-ar6-hunting-master-pistol1-1x/ (https://www.krale.shop/us/evanix-ar6-hunting-master-pistol1-1x/)
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I've been on a quest for a powerful PCP pistol for over a dozen years, unfortunately to get power you have to ad size, weight and length to the point that a pistol becomes less of a comfortable pistol.
That Evanix AR6 is the closest to a powerful small caliber pistol I ever had, it does indeed shoot the 28gr EunJin at around 700 fps for around 30 FPE and the exposed hammer does make it feel more like a true pistol than any out there
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AEA HP Semi-Auto Pistol is listed at 30 fpe in 25 cal.
I don't have any information on the quality of this pistol.
https://www.aeaairgun.us.com/pages/aea-hp-ss-semi-auto-pistol (https://www.aeaairgun.us.com/pages/aea-hp-ss-semi-auto-pistol)
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J.R .
The PP750 will not get you there in stock form. It needs a bigger plenum ( available shortly) and a longer barrel ( custom) but neither of these will be terribly expensive if you machine a barrel yourself. Other wise add another 200$ to the cost of the stock pistol. Then there’s the magazine. You might as well get one of the CARM magazines for it 12 shots . Then you have the poor sights that come with it, add yourself another 60-300$ for a usable sight.
Another option is the Kral NP-01 it’s already based on a rifle , has a 12” barrel already. It should not take more than some hammer spring adjusting and some porting work. The shot count is going to be relatively poor though . Short barrels take a lot of air to get a projectile to speed.
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The quest for this type of PCP pistol pops up every so many months for years. Unfortunately technology hasn’t made the dream a reality. Relying on air has its limits. Can a 1-3 shot wonder cannon be built? Yes but they are more of a novelty item. Not a practical pistol.
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I shoot my PROD like a pistol with iron sights... Yes it's a tad on the long side, but man is it accurate.
It's got more than enough power for a pistol.
If I need to get further out, then I break out the "big guns"... aka rifles.
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Were it not for the multi-shot requirement, a PP700SA can do it in .22. That is, with some modding, of course. I think Thane got some pretty strong numbers from the 750, but it was modded as well. I often wonder what could be done with the Ataman pistols, but they're so expensive, nobody ever gets too crazy messing with them.
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I gave up on the “what’s a pistol” posts….we really can’t draw the line to everyone's satisfaction.
Technically, could put a pistol grip on any powerful rifle, tune it up, then shorten it bit by bit until it ended up at 30 foot pounds. Would be a pistol by strict definition .
Could look at some of the ones sold under the name “pistol” that already make (or exceed) 30 foot pounds, but things like the Talon P or Rex P are not magazine repeaters. I personally don’t think “pistol” when I look at one, but evidently they are.
Not sure if the AR6 is still made….but with your ‘one mag” idea, does have the bonus of only 6 shots for a mag. Likely it could make that 30 foot pounds with some adj sting. Only 75cc’s of air, but are only trying to get 6 good shots. Kind of big and bulky, but even I think “pistol” when I see one.
Most of us fond the P-Rod kind of big for a pistol-pistol, but it is a pistol by nearly everyone’s definition. With only 65cc’s of air and needing 8 shots to make it to a mag-full of shots….going to be kind of “iffy”.
The other direction is starting with something like a P-rod and growing it larger.....longer barrel, maybe longer air tube. Seems counter to the idea of a pistol, very much like starting with a rifle and cutting it down....but by definition, it would be a pistol so long as it doesn't have a shoulder stock.
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https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=180012.0 (https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=180012.0)
This guy got 4 shots at 75fpe out of an 8 inch .357 MROD. You might be able to get a full mag at 30 fpe out of a cut down .22 marauder rifle. That would require some serious modding skills though!
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I was getting 57 FPE from the Marauder .25 Pistol Lloyd made for me, it had the twin tube set up,
but still never felt right as a pistol.
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https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=180012.0 (https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=180012.0)
This guy got 4 shots at 75fpe out of an 8 inch .357 MROD. You might be able to get a full mag at 30 fpe out of a cut down .22 marauder rifle. That would require some serious modding skills though!
that would actually do the job , especially with the larger diameter air tube .
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A shortened Benjamin Bulldog is where I would start on a powerful air pistol.
The full rifle when ported and restrung lands in the middle of cast bullet38 spl velocities.
It requires the barrel and tube cut to 8 or 10 inches, then a way to move the trigger assembly under the front of the receiver, then you have a 5 shot air pistol in between the power spectrum of a S&W black powder break top and a Rex 38 pistol.
Regards,
Roachcreek
Regards,
Roachcreek
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Evanix AR6
Hatsan AT P1 in .25
Hatsan Sortie in .25
That is where you need to limit your search to and toss between those three...
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https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=180012.0 (https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=180012.0)
This guy got 4 shots at 75fpe out of an 8 inch .357 MROD. You might be able to get a full mag at 30 fpe out of a cut down .22 marauder rifle. That would require some serious modding skills though!
that would actually do the job , especially with the larger diameter air tube .
With the right valve high energy and decent ES across 1300psi or so pressure range is possible. But the only recipe I have requires buying a $150 Cothran valve and then making significant modifications to it....can be done but requires a pretty big leap of faith.
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https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=180012.0 (https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=180012.0)
This guy got 4 shots at 75fpe out of an 8 inch .357 MROD. You might be able to get a full mag at 30 fpe out of a cut down .22 marauder rifle. That would require some serious modding skills though!
that would actually do the job , especially with the larger diameter air tube .
With the right valve high energy and decent ES across 1300psi or so pressure range is possible. But the only recipe I have requires buying a $150 Cothran valve and then making significant modifications to it....can be done but requires a pretty big leap of faith.
yea, you were able to tune for more shots than most would expect from that volume and a cothran valve
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I got my 1322 pcp up to 27fpe with a fairly short (7.6" barrel) I recon it could do 30 with a bit more barrel, but I wanted to keep it short and quiet (it's detuned to 11fpe)
It has a regulated 220mm airtube that has about 145cc capacity. But I do have another 290mm tube that is unregulated (for high power) that has about 210cc capacity. So, will likely make a longer barrel at some point.
Good luck finding the pcp conversion parts I have anywhere, though.
I have a pp800 in 25 caliber that I did get to 30fpe with 9" barrel. But it really only would do about 3 shots at that power level. However I did detune it to 28 fpe, and get about 7-8 useful shot for hunting. No magazine on that gun, though.
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I just got my ugly parts 2260 up to over 50 FPE for 6 shots but it has a ~.37 caliber smooth bore barrel and is a longer barrel (pretty light for caliber=ok center of gravity). Although some people dont regard the 2260 as pistol length. Not sure there are many .30 cal or .357 repeaters out there but you obviously gain FPE with larger caliber. Not sure what you are shooting for the 30 FPE either.
664 - 70 FPE
758 - 91 FPE
723 - 82 FPE
690 - 75 FPE
645 - 65 FPE
602 - 57 FPE
514 - 42 FPE
482 total fpe