GTA
Airguns by Make and Model => Vintage Air Gun Gate => Topic started by: 45flint on September 30, 2020, 10:05:11 AM
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My current Crosman mania has caused me to take a closer look at the stock transitions of the 1960’s. Crosman followed the trends of the time and created their Monte Carlo stock. Below is a summary I found of the Monte Carlo online:
“Monte Carlo
The Monte Carlo stock is characterized by a high comb that drops to a lower line near the butt. A former ruler of Monte Carlo popularized this shape in the mid-20th century when scopes came into widespread use. This shape has an advantage for scope use because it raises the cheek and eye up to better alignment with the scope. Though it’s less common than it was in the 1950s, it is still possible to have a Monte Carlo stock profile without a raised cheekpiece. The stepped comb is what makes it a Monte Carlo.“
My two recent purchases have given me the exact same rifles to compare stock: the old profile and the new:
(https://i.imgur.com/jdXyWnP.jpg)
What I find in shooting them both is the old style seems to align with the iron sights more naturally. The Monte Carlo causes my eyes to align higher and I have to press my cheek into to stock to align. As said above these stocks would be an advantage if the rifle was scoped. Not sure this was Crosman’s intention at the time? To me it just looks “sexier”, newer, was in vogue so they made the change? The early rifles are not easy to scope and I can see why the last ones with scope rails are such a prize.
Though not as pretty I think my made up long barrel 180 may be the iron sight shooting favorite? The Monte Carlo leaves me wanting to try to scope it. I’ve got one of those early Crosman clamping mounts around here some place. Time to dig it out for try?
PS: the Beaver Tail forearm on the Monte Carlo is very nice to hold, no question a positive to the design.
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It's difficult to shoot a scoped rifle accurately without a good cheek-weld. The Monte Carlo comb helps with that. Good to see that Crosman knew that way back when.
I recently came across some nice walnut. Thinking of making an adjustable comb for my 160-clone with it as the current comb is about an inch too low for my 32-mm scope. Wishing I had a piece big enough to make a complete stock.
I like the wide fore-end too. It makes leveling the rifle on sand-bags a tad easier.
Be safe,
J~
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It's difficult to shoot a scoped rifle accurately without a good cheek-weld. The Monte Carlo comb helps with that. Good to see that Crosman knew that way back when.
I recently came across some nice walnut. Thinking of making an adjustable comb for my 160-clone with it as the current comb is about an inch too low for my 32-mm scope. Wishing I had a piece big enough to make a complete stock.
I like the wide fore-end too. It makes leveling the rifle on sand-bags a tad easier.
Be safe,
J~
Wonder if Crosman was even thinking about scopes at that time? Monte Carlos were the rage in 1950’s. Air rifle Makers try to copy cartridge rifles of their day.
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I love the old stocks because of the nice grain patterns under the original finish. These are 160 stocks I modified to fit Discovery builds. I get them from Gun Parts Inc. then open up the trigger area for the Disco trigger pack, move the opening forward to fit, then fill a small space behind the unit with a matching piece of wood. Just stripped the stock on top getting ready to put it on a Disco carbine. I my opinion they beat the heck out of the plain Jane later stock for Disco and 2260. The Monte Carlo type works great with the higher mounted Williams open sight and ramp style front sight.(http://)
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If I am not mistaken, the Beaver Tail forearm was a Sears / J.C. Higgins / Ted Williams exclusive design you could not get from Crosman.
I agree the transition to the Monte Carlo cheek rest was an improvement, even if not scoped.
My 160 Var 2 on top was a reclaim to my childhood, but the Var 3 in the second pic fits much better.
Both are equipped with factory "Peeps".
The "DROP" or heel of the stock position in the Variant 3 is much more suited to my face structure.
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It's difficult to shoot a scoped rifle accurately without a good cheek-weld. The Monte Carlo comb helps with that. Good to see that Crosman knew that way back when.
I recently came across some nice walnut. Thinking of making an adjustable comb for my 160-clone with it as the current comb is about an inch too low for my 32-mm scope. Wishing I had a piece big enough to make a complete stock.
I like the wide fore-end too. It makes leveling the rifle on sand-bags a tad easier.
Be safe,
J~
Wonder if Crosman was even thinking about scopes at that time? Monte Carlos were the rage in 1950’s. Air rifle Makers try to copy cartridge rifles of their day.
Interesting info here, I had not idea this stocks were called "MonteCarlo"
Anyone knows in what year Crosman introduced the Super Scope 410 Kit ?, one of my kits came with a flyer using the Crosman 180. this mounts work better on the 180 than the 140 model, the barrel is thicker, best to use a piece of electrical tape under the mount, I like the vintage look of these better than using other clamp mounts, but sometimes they slip off and loose Zero .
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I love the old stocks because of the nice grain patterns under the original finish. These are 160 stocks I modified to fit Discovery builds. I get them from Gun Parts Inc. then open up the trigger area for the Disco trigger pack, move the opening forward to fit, then fill a small space behind the unit with a matching piece of wood. Just stripped the stock on top getting ready to put it on a Disco carbine. I my opinion they beat the heck out of the plain Jane later stock for Disco and 2260. The Monte Carlo type works great with the higher mounted Williams open sight and ramp style front sight.(http://)
Beautiful work, I like it!
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It's difficult to shoot a scoped rifle accurately without a good cheek-weld. The Monte Carlo comb helps with that. Good to see that Crosman knew that way back when.
I recently came across some nice walnut. Thinking of making an adjustable comb for my 160-clone with it as the current comb is about an inch too low for my 32-mm scope. Wishing I had a piece big enough to make a complete stock.
I like the wide fore-end too. It makes leveling the rifle on sand-bags a tad easier.
Be safe,
J~
Wonder if Crosman was even thinking about scopes at that time? Monte Carlos were the rage in 1950’s. Air rifle Makers try to copy cartridge rifles of their day.
Interesting info here, I had not idea this stocks were called "MonteCarlo"
Anyone knows in what year Crosman introduced the Super Scope 410 Kit ?, one of my kits came with a flyer using the Crosman 180. this mounts work better on the 180 than the 140 model, the barrel is thicker, best to use a piece of electrical tape under the mount, I like the vintage look of these better than using other clamp mounts, but sometimes they slip off and loose Zero .
I believe these came out in '63 or '64. I've used a few of them, they came with shims for use on older, skinnier barrels.
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It's difficult to shoot a scoped rifle accurately without a good cheek-weld. The Monte Carlo comb helps with that. Good to see that Crosman knew that way back when.
I recently came across some nice walnut. Thinking of making an adjustable comb for my 160-clone with it as the current comb is about an inch too low for my 32-mm scope. Wishing I had a piece big enough to make a complete stock.
I like the wide fore-end too. It makes leveling the rifle on sand-bags a tad easier.
Be safe,
J~
Wonder if Crosman was even thinking about scopes at that time? Monte Carlos were the rage in 1950’s. Air rifle Makers try to copy cartridge rifles of their day.
Interesting info here, I had not idea this stocks were called "MonteCarlo"
Anyone knows in what year Crosman introduced the Super Scope 410 Kit ?, one of my kits came with a flyer using the Crosman 180. this mounts work better on the 180 than the 140 model, the barrel is thicker, best to use a piece of electrical tape under the mount, I like the vintage look of these better than using other clamp mounts, but sometimes they slip off and loose Zero .
I believe these came out in '63 or '64. I've used a few of them, they came with shims for use on older, skinnier barrels.
If these mount came out 4 years after the new stock you have to doubt Crosman’s intention was to create a rifle that would scope better? I think it was just keeping up with the times and giving the stock a more modern look.
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Most raised cheek pieces on Monte Carlo stocks are too low for me, so I learned to shoot well without them. I also checked on the continued availability of the Ron Robinson mounts at that website I usually post. Out of stock for some time now.
https://www.kwiksitecorp.com/product/reversible-see-thru-grooved-receiver-mount/ (https://www.kwiksitecorp.com/product/reversible-see-thru-grooved-receiver-mount/)
Darn shame. Quick and handy mounts. Here they are on my 160 variant one, 1955-56 I restomodded with Winchester 4x32AO scope that ranges down to 15ft;
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/640x480q90/923/yam0M2.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/pnyam0M2j)
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Yes, if Crosman had wanted to make guns more scope-friendly, they could have simply cut dovetail grooves in the barrel/receiver like they did with so many Sears guns.
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I recently scoped my second model 1400. I find the modest rise of the monte carlo stock to be helpful but honestly there isn't much difference between the second model stock and the straight line third model stock. The straight line stock has less drop to begin with. IMO those sixties and seventies era Crosman stocks had some of the best wood ever put on an American made air rifle.
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I recently scoped my second model 1400. I find the modest rise of the monte carlo stock to be helpful but honestly there isn't much difference between the second model stock and the straight line third model stock. The straight line stock has less drop to begin with. IMO those sixties and seventies era Crosman stocks had some of the best wood ever put on an American made air rifle.
Elm is pretty unique and can have some interesting grain patterns. I think Crosman during that period was taking advantage of the Dutch Elm Disease that killed so many Elms in the 1950’s. To try to stop the destruction they cut down infected trees producing I’m sure a load of elm lumber. The Elms now are mostly gone.
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For me the height is just fine for irons, and they just look so much better that the older ones.
Granted I only have a '65 180 and a '65 140 and have never even held one of the older stocks.
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If you read about the history of the Monte Carlo stock it was really not designed for scope use but for shotguns. It was felt this stock gave a most consistent hold on a quickly raised rifle. They had a high end clay pigeon field behind the casino in Monte Carlo.
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Coming from Skeet leagues back to to airguns... that makes sense.
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Crosman used elm and some beech and maple. I have heard ash mentioned. Cheap substitutes for walnut, to keep cost down. Some of the old Crosman stocks do look nice but, walnut simply can't be beat for a gun stock.
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Crosman used elm and some beech and maple. I have heard ash mentioned. Cheap substitutes for walnut, to keep cost down. Some of the old Crosman stocks do look nice but, walnut simply can't be beat for a gun stock.
Agreed if you look at the stats on the strength of walnut it wins by a pretty good margin. Crosman always made sure they had the best margin they could. Probably why they survived?
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One of the nice attributes of the first stock is the thinner wrist. Very noticeable if you go back and forth between the two styles.
(https://i.imgur.com/Zn2V9Uy.jpg)