GTA
All Springer/NP/PCP Air Gun Discussion General => PCP/CO2/HPA Air Gun Gates "The Darkside" => Topic started by: acornscout on September 04, 2020, 02:00:12 AM
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So I can’t decide on what one to get I know it’s going to be a puncher breaker. I mostly hunt nutters and trapline dispatching. Coons and such. Would like to try on yotes at some point. 22 can do it all but would a 25 be better?
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Are you looking for a springer or PCP???? I think .22 would cover all the bases in either type gun choose. ;D Craig
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Puncher Breaker is a PCP:
https://www.pyramydair.com/product/puncher-breaker-silent-walnut-sidelever-pcp-air-rifle?m=4294 (https://www.pyramydair.com/product/puncher-breaker-silent-walnut-sidelever-pcp-air-rifle?m=4294)
See specification tab.
For the animals mentioned a .22 would be adequate. More pellets available at lower cost, so one is more likely to practice. If Coyotes are primary, then a .25 is probably a better choice.
That said, the .25 seems a little "wimpy" in this platform at 32 ft.lb. What I do not know is if it can be tuned up:
https://www.pyramydair.com/product/puncher-breaker-silent-walnut-sidelever-pcp-air-rifle?m=4294 (https://www.pyramydair.com/product/puncher-breaker-silent-walnut-sidelever-pcp-air-rifle?m=4294)
See specification tab.
(https://www.pyramydair.com/images/PY-4294_Kral-Arms-Puncher-Breaker_1483550584.jpg)
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for what you want a 25 would be the only choice.the 22s just don't have it to dispatch coyotes.i know some folks will come in and say this and that but the fact is you need a little more power for larger game.i have taken over 100 bandits this summer with the 25 shooting the 33.9 pellets from 35-45 yards.i have a 22 but do not reach for when going after bandits or coyotes...I know nothing of the rifle you intend to buy but I have hunted many years and found the 25 having more fpe to be better at humane kills at longer distances...my rifle shoots 33.9 pellets at 860 fps over 30 shots(855 fps to 865 fps).
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my rifle shoots 33.9 pellets at 860 fps over 30 shots(855 fps to 865 fps).
That is 55 FPE, Mark.
The .25 Puncher Breaker is listed at PA at 32 FPE. Quite a difference. This while the same platform in .22 is listed at 28 FPE. The latter is pretty close to the "standard" of 30 FPE for .22. While 32 FPE is quite far from the "standard" 40 FPE for .25.
I would assume that penetration is paramount after shot placement. A larger holes is better, but only if it goes through vital organs. Are you confident that a 32 FPE .25 caliber PCP has the penetration required for coyotes, Mark? Perhaps if the range is limited.
I may be wrong, but for coyotes you will need head shots at this sort of power level. Yes, a heart or lung shot may kill a 20 to 40 lb coyote, but will do it fast and reliably?
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I have three Marauders, as you can see.
The first was a .22 and it is great fun.
Then I heard about this silly game, Field Target.
Motorhead did his magic on the .177 and if someone other than me is behind the trigger, it will win it all.
We progress...
The aforementioned Motorhead built a .25 on a Bam 51 chassis.
He let me shoot it.
I bought another Marauder.
As stated the .22 would probably suffice for your needs but, remember the adage, “carry enough gun”.
The sound of a .25 caliber pellet impacting on flesh is a sound to behold.
Expensive to shoot?
Yes.
Fun factor?
Can’t measure it.
I think after the bugs are worked out of the new Crosman rifles, a nice .25 bullpup will suit you fine...
Good luck..
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While coyotes are extreme the .25 for me is better than the .22. In both rifles HW95L and HW80 the .25 OUTPERFORMS the .22. I know I've said I like my .22 R9 (HW95L) but I like the .25 BETTER! And this is NOT PCP velocity! They are ACCURATE to a fault, the .25s, in ANY pellet I feed them whereas the .22 seems a bit more picky to hit with just like the smaller .177.
I like my .20 HW98--but if the range is going to be around 30 yards the .25 wins for SLAM and repeated accuracy.
Long live the NEW HW95Ls and R9s! ::)
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Puncher Breaker, then .25. I wouldn't bother with the .22 if racoon AND coyote are both potential targets.
I shoot mostly squirrel, HOSPs, and Starlings now, yet I've jumped to .25 in my Leshiy. My upper end is north of 50 FPE without any problem,, but I keep mine about 35 FPE right now for shot count. Lemme tell yah, a .25 wadcutter (supplied by Matt AKA Insanity) is overwhelming brute force on a nutter.
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A .25 will always be able to do what a .22 do
a .22 will not always be able to do what a .25 does.
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Thanks y’all this is going to be my 1st pcp so I’m going to try the 22. From what y’all say maybe the 25 puncher breaker is a lil weak and may have to look at a different 25 cal rifle. Time and patience is my thing
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Thanks y’all this is going to be my 1st pcp so I’m going to try the 22. From what y’all say maybe the 25 puncher breaker is a lil weak and may have to look at a different 25 cal rifle. Time and patience is my thing
.22 is a very versatile caliber. However, before giving up on the .25 Puncher Breaker, research this forum for owners tuning their to get more power. You might find it is simple, and requires only twisting a few screws. Or maybe a bit more...
Here are a few videos that might inspire you; or help cement your decision:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ru1akiioTtE (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ru1akiioTtE)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=adsIUaWfPvM (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=adsIUaWfPvM)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DfKY5COevoU (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DfKY5COevoU)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0NioKRmTVkI (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0NioKRmTVkI)
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That's the beauty of PCPs.
Power can be tweeked pretty easily.
The trip in the PCP word will trip you out :)
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You know, that for not a whole lot more money, you could have both .22 and .25 for $299 each if you went with the Avenger. I got my .25 from Randy at RL Airguns and Love it!
My .02
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Where I live in Colorado you have to use at least .25 to hunt coyotes. Might want to check the laws where you live. That might help on your decision.
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For a PCP no question. .25
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Thanks y’all this is going to be my 1st pcp so I’m going to try the 22. From what y’all say maybe the 25 puncher breaker is a lil weak and may have to look at a different 25 cal rifle. Time and patience is my thing
I have my .22 puncher breaker regulated set to 36fpe. These guns are pretty easy to tune up and get power from, it just takes opening up the barrel and valve ports a little, no extra parts to buy at all.
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.25 all day long ! and buy the Avenger .25 it has the FPE right out of the box to to smack that yote down at distance very important ...
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Update. The wife ordered me one with out me knowing and it came this Saturday. It’s the 22cal so maybe I’ll get a 25 cal next year lol. Holly cow is all I can say this thing is nice. Little background about myself army recon sniper / hunted sense age 8. Live on a farm. So I know a little about stuff. Got into air rifles because of a paper I had to do in college before that the only BB gun I ever shot was a red rider when I was a lil kid. Now I have 2 Springer a 1322 and now this. Oh what a rabbit hole I have found. So off to Troy hammer it goes. Thanks guys for all the info.
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Y'all must have some sociable coyotes. In the deserts of SoCal, I've rarely seen one that would let me take a good shot at it under ~100 yds in the past 45 years.
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With my .25 Avenger the way it came set from the box I was getting over 50fpe with my cast 34.5 grain pellets. I'm sure that with the JSB MKII's it will do about the same.
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Y'all must have some sociable coyotes. In the deserts of SoCal, I've rarely seen one that would let me take a good shot at it under ~100 yds in the past 45 years.
I live in the woods and can rarely see 100 yards most times of the year.if I cant see they cant see me if I still and they looking for food roaming the thick cover where most of their meals hide out.
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Update. The wife ordered me one with out me knowing and it came this Saturday. It’s the 22cal so maybe I’ll get a 25 cal next year lol. Holly cow is all I can say this thing is nice. Little background about myself army recon sniper / hunted sense age 8. Live on a farm. So I know a little about stuff. Got into air rifles because of a paper I had to do in college before that the only BB gun I ever shot was a red rider when I was a lil kid. Now I have 2 Springer a 1322 and now this. Oh what a rabbit hole I have found. So off to Troy hammer it goes. Thanks guys for all the info.
Hard to argue with the wife buying you a gun. Congrats.
Perhaps Troy can get it to sling JSB Monster Redesigned in the >850fps range? Then you won't miss too much in it being a .22 vs .25....
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Y'all must have some sociable coyotes. In the deserts of SoCal, I've rarely seen one that would let me take a good shot at it under ~100 yds in the past 45 years.
Fact that !!!
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Y'all must have some sociable coyotes. In the deserts of SoCal, I've rarely seen one that would let me take a good shot at it under ~100 yds in the past 45 years.
I live in the woods and can rarely see 100 yards most times of the year.if I cant see they cant see me if I still and they looking for food roaming the thick cover where most of their meals hide out.
Same here! Here in central VA, the underbrush is often so thick you're within 30 yards of a song-dog before you see it dart away, and their pelts litter the back roads. They're common enough that my girlfriend and I have seen them darting across roads while we cruise on our longboard skateboards, especially in Charles City County. Out there in CA and the Western states, they have much less cover so they are much more skittish.
I'm considering the .30 barrel for my Leshiy and going big on the power specifically for coyote, but they aren't quite a nuisance yet. To expand on what Manny said, you can make a bigger bore do what a smaller one does more easily than making a smaller one do what a bigger one does.
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Update. The wife ordered me one with out me knowing and it came this Saturday.
Sounds like she's a keeper! Make her proud!
Andy
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Down here in Flarda coyotes have no natural enemies except us. They are shy but they just can't resist our garbage cans or our chicken coop. They haven't managed to get into the coop but they regularly turn over our trash. My main coyote deterrent is our 75 lb. Akita mix. I occasionally see a coyote in my security lights at night. The range is rarely more than 35 yards. They are light shy and they move quick when the motion sensor controlled lights come on. A snap shot at a running dog at night is pretty iffy. I'd want a shotgun for that. It's easier to open the door and let Flytrap loose. She loves to chase coyotes. ;D
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HAve a .22 coming.....just get some of the heavier weight pellets to test. May find you aren't going to care if it's a .22 or a .25.
Agree about the 'yotes. Seldom see them in day light, very very seldom at close range,and at night I need to visually identify anything I shoot at night (saves on angry dog owners).
Tend to not-airgun big moving critters,if it's legal to shoot them than I don't care how loud the shot is.
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Carter: The coyotes do get into places they shouldn't be, like samps/marshes....but if the Florida "gartors can snag one, they'll eat it just as well as Louisiana 'gators will.
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HAve a .22 coming.....just get some of the heavier weight pellets to test. May find you aren't going to care if it's a .22 or a .25.
Agree about the 'yotes. Seldom see them in day light, very very seldom at close range,and at night I need to visually identify anything I shoot at night (saves on angry dog owners).
Tend to not-airgun big moving critters,if it's legal to shoot them than I don't care how loud the shot is.
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Carter: The coyotes do get into places they shouldn't be, like samps/marshes....but if the Florida "gartors can snag one, they'll eat it just as well as Louisiana 'gators will.
I agree about the gators. They prefer fuzzy four legged stuff to eat. I just don't think they are much of a check on the coyote population. From what I can see by the side of the road, the principle threat to coyotes comes from Detroit. ;D
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Aligators don't seem a check on the 'yotes...just don't live in the same area. Got a lost/dumb one that wanders too close,am sure a hungry 'gator would snatch him (they aren't noted for being picky eating habits).
On the other hand,I'll eat a 'gator.
Not airgun specific....did have part ownership of a deer hunting lease/camp. Once or twice a year we'd thin out the predators.
Could be lost/abandoned/feral dogs (which always ran in a pack) or coyotes (which ran solo)...but it was't an airgun kind of cull,even though I think the feral dogs were more of a deer-killer.
Just thought of it as a job to do...airguns just weren't the right coyote tools.
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Here is my take:
I have killed two coyotes with a .22 shooting barracuda 21 grain at 33ft lbs.
One shot in the brain between the ear and eye.
Instant drop.
Other shot in between the eyes.
Instant drop
Both 30-40 yards
Yes a .22 can do it but us not really ideal for that size animal.
My .25 caliber at 46 ft lbs I only use it to hunt rabbits,squirrels and never found a yote opportunity yet.
With that said I would not plan a yote trip with either of those guns.
My .22 is my goto plinker and target gun out to 120 yards on a perfect day.I got lucky and my at44 likes cheap Crosman cphp ammo ($7 for 500 locally)but tuned at 26ft lbs.
The .25 Bullboss however only likes JSB which means its pricey to plink with so its a hunter only.($19 per 350 plus shipping).
My .357 bulldog shooting .380 88grain bullets at $56 shipped for 500 rounds will handle all my game needs.Shooting at 160ft lbs
If i need to shoot hog or deer i up the power to 245ftlbs with 158 grain .38 cal I resize to .357(at academy $32 for 300 rounds)
Problem with a big bore........be alot more cautious where you shoot.......whats 200 yards behind your target?
My points are:
.22 is the more economical choice,more ammo choices,uses less air(Not recommended to go looking for yotes)
.25 a true hunting powerplant in the 40 plus ft lb range.Ammo is pricey to waste.Not recommened to go look for yotes but small hogs and yotes are doable.
.357 around 100 ft lbs shooting 10 cent per round 380 bullets would be good,turn the power up for larger game.Treat it like a .22 Long Rifle or a .38 pistol.
Would you shoot either in the area you plan to hunt?
I know a .357 was not in question in this topic but Coyote in my opinion needs a .30 cal and up to ensure a humane kill.I would Not hunt yotes with pellets unless the gun is putting out atleast 150ish ft lbs which a bulldog will do out the box for about 20 rounds.The bullets I use are cheaper and much better than pellets.Unless you need close range power pellets are great but $20 plus shipping for 100
With that said the .22 puncher bullpup is a very nice gun for the value and is on my list for sure.
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To address the OP, I would not get that gun. I'd find something with better support (parts availability)
A .25 will always be able to do what a .22 do
a .22 will not always be able to do what a .25 does.
Wouldnt less surface area equate to more penetration in some scenarios? MY 22 sending 21gr slugs @1111fps has some pretty ridiculous penetration
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.... double post :-X
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Out of what I actually own , I would use my badger .40 cal using my cast 150 g bullet at 950 fps , or a 196 g flat nose Bobs bullet design that I had accurate mold make in a flat nose instead of hollow point ... FPS is close to 900 fps shot out of the badger around 350 FPE ...
Now if the yote was getting my chickens I would get even with the Ranger .45 800 FPE ... ;D ;D this one would be especially use full if you got lucky ,and had 3 of them lined up side ways ...
.30 Carnivore would have no problem taking a yote down ,and really might be the best match for the gun vs yote .... .25 would be bare minimum with a well placed shot ...
The only way I would use a .22 would be with heavier slugs at the 950-1000 fps range with a well placed shot ...