GTA
Airguns by Make and Model => Crosman Airguns => Topic started by: Will403536 on August 14, 2011, 05:06:03 PM
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Picked up a Nitro Venom Dusk .22 and Nitro Venom Wood .177. Only shot the .22. Here is a review from someone not initiated into the air gun obsession:
-cocking it was too tiring. After 150 shots, my entire upper body would be sore, it felt like I had a fever. I tried cocking it in all kinds of ways to, to find the easiest for me. Holding it against my upper thigh caused it to dig into my pelvis area, even leaving wave-shaped bloody marks days later. I have very little body fat, so I guess there's no padding for the pressure. Am I just a weakling?
-setting up the scope was TOO much effort! Cleaning with 100% ethanol (yall call it "denatured alcohol", I got the science lab stuff), tightening screws, only to have the scope continue to slip, but I don't wanna crush my scope tube, and why do I have to spend more $$ to buy LocTite and other stuff just to get a $150 gun working properly out of the box?
-scopes = pain in the butt! My .22 came with a dented scope (WalMart FedEx's the retail display box, which has no protection for the scope), so I used the same scope that came with my .177. On both scopes, I noticed that adjusting to a # of clicks, even using a ruler and calculator, did NOT give predictable results! How much scope lag should I expect?
-break-in was horrendous. After probably 300 shots, my barrel was still smoking like crazy! Maybe I coulda used Goo-Gone and a weed whacker line + patch, but that's more investment just to get a retail product working brand new!
extremely hold-sensitive I couldn't properly zero the gun past 5 yd because of imprecision in my shooting technique, I admit. But just what kind of Olympic level training is required to enjoy a pellet gun for fun? The gun is also heavy to me, and even holding it on a rest, the gun was still very hold sensitive. The artillery hold is difficult to get used to, and if I'm realistically using it for hunting at 30 yd, with no set up gun rest/pillow/etc., how could I expect to get any accuracy at all?
I was expecting to get a fun toy that allowed me to avoid all the ridiculous firearms regulations and not kill my neighbors by accident, but still let me hit targets and small game, birds, etc. What I got was no doubt an engineering marvel, but which required extreme amount effort and dedication just to be able to enjoy it properly. Not quite satisfying, so I returned them both.
I have to be honest though, I'm itching to give it another go, maybe contact WalMart this time to make sure they ship it with proper packaging so nothing gets damaged and I can be sure that the gun I get will be accurate and consistent. I would also Goo-Gone the barrel and LocTite the scope this time. But man oh man... how do you guys enjoy this torture?
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A certain amount of masochism is essential for shooting springers. ;)
Is the scope slipping in the mount or is the mount itself slipping? If the former, a small piece of double-sided tape in the bottom of each ring should hold it in place. If the latter, is there a scope stop on the gun (a small hole bored in the breech) and a stop pin in the mount (a screw in the rear of the mount, to be screwed down into the stop). If present but not lined up and screwed in, the mount will slip. If neither is present, things get a bit more difficult. Where are you putting LocTite? If on the mount and ring screws, that is okay. If anywhere else, things are screwy.
Did you buy your guns from WalMart, as your post implies? If so, they have a no-questions-asked return/replacement policy. Take the dented scope back and ask for a new one. If from someone else, contact them about refund or replacement.
Cocking the Nitro piston should not be that difficult; the Nitro Venom is advertised as requiring under 25 pounds of cocking effort. Holding the butt plate against your thigh and breaking the barrel with your left hand (assuming you are right handed) at the muzzle end of the barrel should most certainly not result in "bloody marks," no matter how little body fat you have!
Dieseling is caused by lubricant in the barrel and it really isn't good for the gun. Guns are shipped with oil or grease in/on them to protect them against the elements to which they might be exposed during shipping (usually from overseas) and many companies seem to over do it. It is good practice to remove that lubricant before shooting; expecting the gun to be absolutely ready to shoot just because it is new is not the best way to approach things. Yes, it should be mechanically ready but lubrication levels are often an issue, and it simply makes safety sense to be sure there are no obstruction in the barrel by running some patches through it until they come out clean.
Hold sensitivity is an issue with springers. You have apparently tried the artillery hold, which is pretty much essential for springers. Maybe you would be better advised to try a PCP.
Other issues, questions, etc., bring them up here. I'm sure the enablers here will manage to hook into your interest and lead you along a path to satisfaction (even if it is only in buying another gun that more closely fits your needs).
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So sorry to hear that your first experience with springers left such a bad taste in your mouth, but after reading you post I can see how you would certainly be discouraged.
First off,, take a deep breath. No, I mean a really deep breath. Ok, exhale slowly, do you feel better? :)
Larry has given you solid advice. The rifle should not be that difficult to cock. Follow the technique Larry described and you'll get the hang of it. Get yourself some weed whacker line, "Goo-Gone", patches and take a few minutes to clean the barrel again. I know you already cleaned it but just do it again. Now, for the scope. I'm not sure what kind of scope mount came with the rifle, my choice would be an "Accushot" 1 piece mount but whatever mount came with it go ahead and clean all metal surfaces of the mount, including the threads on all screws, with denatured alcohol. Also clean the top of the rifle receiver as well as the scope tube with the denatured alcohol. Now go ahead and install the scope using a drop of blue loctite on each screw. Tighten down all the screws and put the rifle away for at least 24 hours for the loctite to cure,,, 48 hours is even better. Now, before you take that first shot take a fine lined pencil and make marks around the scope tube where the rings clamp on. These marks will instantly show any slip, but if you did the procedure as described you won't have any slip. I know you don't want to use loctite but trust me, just do it. Make sure the stock screws are tight.... you are now ready to shoot.
Shoot your first group at 10 yards, just to get the scope on paper, then move back and do the final sight in. Use a good domed pellet to start, the Crosman Hollow points that Walmart sells are fine and will usually shoot decent in most guns. You will need to order a pellet sampler pack to find the best pellets for the rifle but for now a plain domed pellet should work. As for mathematically calculating the effect of each click of the elevation and windage turrets..... forget about it. You're going to have to crank the windage and elevation much more than you though you would have to, just do it, you'll see the POI move. You may have to crank it 15 or 20 clicks but you'll see the POI move. It's just the way it is. Once you get it sighted in then you can start adjusting with just a click or 2 here and there. It's just the way it is.
As for the artillery hold.... if it doesn't work for you and your rifle then don't use it. I personally don't use the artillery hold, except for a few rifles I have that demand it, but for all my other shooters I don't use it, opting for a more traditional hold. Some rifles like a firm hold, some a loose hold, some like a little further forward and some back,,, you just have to experiment with you rifle.
When shooting, even at a shooting bench, don't rest the rifle on anything except you open palm,, it will make a big difference. Besides, when out in the woods hunting that's what you'll be using as a rest anyway so it's a good habit to get into.
Now just take some time, sit down and just have some fun shooting and getting to know your rifle. It will no doubt take time and practice on your part to get used to the shooting dynamics of springers but you're already an accomplished shooter so it won't take as long as you might think. In no time you'll see those groups shrink in size as you get more trigger time with your springer. Don't get frustrated, don't get mad, just relax and keep shooting. Before you even know it you'll be hooked like the rest of us.
Hang in there.
Jeff
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I'm gonna be honest. I hate it when people expect a gun to shoot perfectly out the box. Ok, the cocking. Wear thicker clothing. The nitro piston does not always smooth cocking.
Scope. We all had to go through scope mounting. The cleaning with alcohol thing, never did it. Wonder whats it for? And the scope dent thing isnt really an issue until it makes it hard to use or see through. Breaking in. Sorry, but 300 rounds is not enough. My Titan did not break-in at 500 rounds. Hold sensitivity, the artillery hold is twhe only hold that allows you to shoot accurately, so what's the problem?
Gun weight, get used to it.
If you have so many issues with the nitrogen piston, than i think itd be best that you get a bb gun or multi pump pnenematic.
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Sorry to here of your experience. I just got a Venom Dusk and did a good tune on it and it shoots great. A hundred and fifty cocks on the gun will make me take a rest but I am 72 years old. Just think of it as a little workout without going to the gym. Seems a gun when new should just shoot good without doing anything but that is the nature of the beast. I listened for quite a while to guys on this forum and the learning experience was worth a ton. Then I bought a Gamo and did some of the things I learned about. Set back and read some of these, take that deep breath and try again. That Venom is a really good gun and with a little work it will surprise you.
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Well, 150 rounds, depending upon how fast you are sending them down range, can be fatiguing. Still, if the gun is supposed to be 25 pounds, it should not be difficult to cock. Most magnum springers are in the 30 pound range and up. I have to brace my 54 on my thigh. (For wooden stocked guns or those with a painted finish, be wary of jeans rivets. Dinged my pristine Diana in only five rounds.)
You had asked earlier about the scope slipping. From that last post, it sounded like the scope was slipping in the rings. You should try the tape or rubber cement if that is the problem. Happens on powder burners, too, so not something unique to springers. If the mount or rings are slipping, you need a scope stop. Some guns come with them, like a triangular piece of sheet metal with a screw in it, while others you have to add one that clamps to the grooves. And, about that scope, you should certainly return it for an exchange. As I mentioned previously, there could be internal damage you can't see.
Yes, springers are heavy. I imagine the gas piston guns are actually lighter than their wound wire counterparts. Depending upon condition and upper body strength, you might have to shorten your sessions to let your muscles recuperate. I know that I would be wobbling worse than someone with St. Vitus Dance were I to shoot a long string. Heck, my crosshairs waggle enough for me to take Dramamine as it is.
Don't count your guns down and out yet. Like anything worth doing, it takes a bit of practice before you get it right. Stick with it.
PS - The dieseling is probably coming from inside the gun and not the barrel. Must be still burning off lubes or oil. Noticed that a lot of guns seem to be getting sprayed with a light oil these days. The makers should know better since that stuff is only going to burn off.
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I appreciate the advice from here. I might try it again when I have more free time. I store/shoot the guns in a different state (due to laws), so I don't get to shoot them very often, but I love shooting, so I wanted quick fun, with minimal time and work spent getting it all set up.
Yes the slipping was the scope in the rings, the Nitro Venoms come with a weaver rail, and that worked great actually. I've been hearing amazing things about this rifle TBH, so I wondered if it was just me being a noob.
Funny thing that farrlarr mentioned the factory oil/lube, the .177 Nitro Venom I got from WalMart came covered with brown grease, literally all over the outside of the gun such that when I pulled it out my hands were covered with grease. I chalked that one up to just a factory glitch.
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Sounds like the source of your dieseling. I think they must have a bunch of ex-GI's prepping the guns for shipping. Next thing you know, it will be Cosmoline.
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Every one had gave great advice, I can say that gamo bigcat which was 150ish after has about 600 pellets through it. It took a lot to get it to not smoke but still every now and again I get a faint whisp of burning lube.. btw I also shot the first 375 pellets out of my bigcat before I mounted a scope or even cared about accuracy..
Also if ur using the scope that came with the rifle, its time to get a better scope... a nice scope will make a world of difference.. something my uncle learned yesterday shoot his gamo and then shooting mine.. he uses the scope that came with his gamo and a I have a 5th generation golden image leapers 3-9x32AO...
Try rolling up a towel and using that as a rest when shooting, also pay close attention to ur trigger learn to feel when its about to break. Most factory triggers have some kind of ruff spot or a faint click before the trigger breaks and the shot is fired... with my gamo the trigger will easly pull back untill it hits the 2nd stage and then its just a hair harder pull and it breaks.. my walther p99q co2 pistol has a faint click right before the trigger breaks and the shot is fired.. you need to learn to get a feel for your gun and more importantly get a feel for how you shoot..
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Sounds like the source of your dieseling. I think they must have a bunch of ex-GI's prepping the guns for shipping. Next thing you know, it will be Cosmoline.
COSMOLINE !! Groan...parts soaking in gasoline..all those fumes, the brushes....GAG..
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"-setting up the scope was TOO much effort! Cleaning with 100% ethanol (yall call it "denatured alcohol", I got the science lab stuff), tightening screws, only to have the scope continue to slip, but I don't wanna crush my scope tube, and why do I have to spend more $$ to buy LocTite and other stuff just to get a $150 gun working properly out of the box?"
Well I hope it works out for you. I am not trying to be mean or sound like a jerk............but you were given sound advice in this area and a lot of headache could have been avoided if you had heeded the advice :-\
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well, for the $300-some-odd dollars you spent on those two break barrels, you coulda got a disco with a pump or a nice, solid steroid 392 with a williams peep. both guns have adequate power and nice open sights, one's self-contained(steroid), the other offers a quick follow-up(disco). these things being said, while you may have to find the right hold for a springer/gas ram to yield "superb" accuracy, it's been my experience that as long as you use a good follow-through then you can get an inch at 20 yards with any gun. my xl is capable of superb accuracy but it takes so much technique to extract it that i decided today to just re-zero off hand at 30 yards with just a nice, comfy off-hand hold. try to keep those crosshairs on the target untill you hear the impact, groups will look better automatically. IMHO you're better off using a bad hold with good follow-through than you are using the perfect technique without follow-through.
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Clip, knew a guy in the Army who said that the worst KP was being assigned to the armorer where he made them unpack and degrease new guns. Sounds like you might have enjoyed that a bit, yourself. ;D
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AirHunter, being new to air guns, he probably wasn't aware of the Disco (which I am and don't have a hankering for) and especially a Steroid tuned pumper. BTW, if he doesn't like cranking that barrel at 25 pounds, he sure as heck ain't gonna like pumping up that Disco or imitating a Chuck Norris workout on that Steroid, LOL!
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I guess I was lucky with my walmart titan. She shoots great right out of the box.Now after allot of pellets she shoots even better. Installed a Tuna trigger and wow accuracy increased 50% right away. But if i had his problem with the nitro venom I would have returned it immediately.
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Get rid of all that stuff and go get a Benjamin 397 or 392 and a Williams Peep Sight or, the scope mounts and a small 7x AO scope. Ya, it' a pumper and it's a little bit of work on each shot but.. no recoil and lot's of fun. You will want to tune up the trigger though, there are lot's of articles and info on how to do this on the web and here. It's easy to do and makes the trigger a real shooter.
Cheap spring guns are tough on even the seasoned pros, it's not your fault, it takes a lot of insight into the mechanics of spring guns to make them shoot well unless you spend $$ modifying (the cheap ones) or spend big $$ to buy a really great one, like a TX200 or HW97K.
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Clip, knew a guy in the Army who said that the worst KP was being assigned to the armorer where he made them unpack and degrease new guns. Sounds like you might have enjoyed that a bit, yourself. ;D
LOL....wasn't the Army but the duty was the same. Actually, the REAL KP was much better than what the armorer had in store. At least it was possible to eat what we policed ( biting tongue, here..). It all depended on how badly we P.O.ed the Sgt. AHHH..fond memories.....
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Man I hated KP, I hated Cosmoline, maybe I'm just a hater? :P
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Sounds like the source of your dieseling. I think they must have a bunch of ex-GI's prepping the guns for shipping. Next thing you know, it will be Cosmoline.
Is cosmoline black and sticky like used motor oil? A couple of weeks ago, I picked up an old BSA scope from (probably) the 70's. It was covered with some kind of black thick sticky stuff that I had to use rubbing alcohol to remove. I couldn't figure out what it was, but was just guessing it was there to protect the scope's surface in some manner.
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No lizzie, cosmoline it a thick paste grease that was used when arms were built and were to either be in storage for a long time or shipped overseas. This thick stuff was to protect the gun from salt water or just rust while in prolonged storage. On your scope was probably a flat rubberized coating used on some scopes. It was not applied very well or tends to break down after a short time. That's a different coating all together.
:)
Happy shooting!!!!
Dave
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Wow, thanks Dave! :)
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Okay, we have all given Will403536 advice about what gun(s) he shoulda/coulda bought instead of what he did buy. The question now is how is Will403536 doing with what he has? How about it Will, was any of our advice helpful? Have you returned both of your guns and run screaming into the night or have you vowed to master the evil springer? ???
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Will, sorry for all the problems you are experiencing with your first venture into moden airgunning. Without seeing them, it sounds to me that you have several issues going on. First off, can we ask your age and size? Not to get personal but to understand a little better the gun and shooter situation here. I'm 57 years old, 5'10" and weigh in around 220. I'm a big ole' boy and have no problem with any break barrel or other type of airgun I've handled so far. It DOES make a difference with some folks and some airguns.
It does sound like you have gotten at least one dinged scope that probably should be returned to Wal-Mart for exchange. If they give you a hard time, you can always get it exchanged through Crosman. They have an excellent warranty and customer service second to none. The smoke still present after 150 or more shots indicates to me there is a main seal issue. This can also account for bad accuracy and even a harsh shooting cycle. THAT needs to be addressed by warranty exchange in my opinion. If there is in fact a main seal issue, no practice with holds and such will be fruitful. The cocking effort it is taking may be the sign of more internal issues, but this statement is without knowing your age and physical makeup.
Just don't get discouraged, these things DO happen. But they can be remedied. It may take some patience and a little time but it will work out. Again, sorry you have to deal with issues getting started but keep us informed. I'm sure you will get things in order and start enjoying the sport/hobby.
Happy Shooting!!!!
Dave
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Yeah thanks for the advice guys. I'm pretty set on an NP rifle as opposed to a PCP or multi-pump, and the Nitro Venom seemed perfect for that, comes with a weaver rail, etc.
Thus far I have returned both rifles to WalMart, and they are out of stock online (the .22 can not even be found on their site anymore, but it may show up again when it's back in stock). I prefer WalMart because of the return policy, but I want to avoid shipping dents again. Do other airgun retailers ship the rifle retail box in a larger box, styrofoam, how do they do it?
Yes I coulda LocTited the scope when I got it, but I believe that when you buy a brand new product, it should work properly without having to buy more "accessories" to make it so.
I honestly didn't think I'd have a physical problem with cocking, since I go to the gym regularly and am 20 years old. Most people can't even do a pull-up but I do them with dumbells for added weight. I think I figured out a way to cock it that's easy for me, but is not the way as shown in the instructions (cocking in a rowing motion, buttstock against hip-bone).
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Get a blowgun?? ;D
Seriously, if the cocking effort is tireing ( and I'm guessing 150 rounds in one session would be,), I'd suggest a lower powered gun that is easy to cock. It will still kill pop cans just as good.
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To be honest I don't expect to regularly shoot 150 rounds in one session, I was just frustratedly trying to get past the break-in/dieseling on my second day of shooting it. Taking breaks to go do something else, etc. helps a lot. My biggest concern isn't the physical effort, but the time and energy that goes into unsuccessfully setting up consistent shots (scope mounting, dieseling, etc.).
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Airguns, and in particular springers , are a challenge just waiting to be unleashed on the unsuspecting. They have so many things, on them, in them, that tracking them down can be a full time job. Not counting the human factor. It took me months to master a BigCat. And when I did it was a sence of satisfaction. Most of the problems was me. And as soon as I got the me figured out , things started to get better.
Bogey
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[Is cosmoline black and sticky like used motor oil? A couple of weeks ago, I picked up an old BSA scope from (probably) the 70's. It was covered with some kind of black thick sticky stuff that I had to use rubbing alcohol to remove. I couldn't figure out what it was, but was just guessing it was there to protect the scope's surface in some manner.
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Lizzie..As Dave said, it was most likely the rubberized coating on the scope. BSA used to put such a coating on their scopes calling it "Armorized" or some such name. I assume they thought it made the product sound strong. I bought one or two of the BSAs and the ads said the scopes "might" have that type coating if they were still available. So far, mine have not started dissolving as yet.
P.S. be happy it is NOT Cosmoline! LOL
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get a pcp
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Smoke 'em if you've got 'em. A thin wisp of smoke in the breech is pretty normal. It doesn't necessarily mean the gun is dieseling, just combusting, something that magnum springers do. When the piston forces the air down into a tiny space, all of the latent heat is concentrated and the temperature spikes (maybe 800 degrees F?), cooking off any fumes present in the mix. Gives the gun a boost, so to speak, and that's how they are designed. Don't go helping it, though, by adding oil, etc. That WILL diesel.
You should get a variety of pellets for your new gun(s). Each gun is temperamental about the ammo it prefers. Worse that a .22lr, in fact. Two guns exactly the same will quite often shoot differently. And the scope slipping is nothing to do with the product's performance. Springers are moving a heavy piston which stops abruptly and then rebounds. This subjects scopes to recoil found on true magnum centerfires.
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I have a question about your cocking method. Were you putting consistent pressure on the barrel until it finally opened up and cocked, or did you give it a swift slap on the end to unlock it before cocking it? With these guns, you need to do the latter. I was making that mistake at first too, and man I felt like I was gonna bend the barrel!
Loctite is like $5 or less for a tube, and will last you a lifetime. It's a good investment anyway to loctite your rifle stock screws so nothing shakes loose over time.
The dented scope should have been returned to Walmart, they would accept it and replace it without hassle. As for the scope not tracking exactly as the number of clicks would indicate, this is common in cheaper scopes. It also shouldn't matter much. Just deal with it until your gun is on zeroed in, and then never touch the knobs again; you shouldn't be messing with your turrets in the field anyway. This is where a scope with mildots really comes in handy.
If all you want to do is shoot targets and birds in your backyard with a lightweight gun, maybe try a Daisy 880. I wore out 3 of those as a kid, and must have shot tens of thousands of pellets and BB's through each one around the farm.
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I was indeed giving it a slap. After many shots, my palm would get numb and red from all the slapping.
I am interested in an easier alternative, such as a CO2 powered Crosman 1077 Repeat Air, but those are .177 and only 625 FPS, not to mention I've read lots of reviews saying these CO2 rifles are highly inconsistent in both power and POI due to temperature variation with consecutive shots cooling the CO2 whippet.
PCP guns are way out of my price range. :)
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Im 22, 6 foot and weigh about 165, i use the np trail aw with no problems, after i shot about 500 rounds threw it, it did become easier to cock. Maybe break barrel isnt the way to go, try a co2 pistol if you are having that much trouble. I have the crosman. 357, for shooting cans in the backyard works great and u can mount a scope if you like. Ive shot at most 400 rounds in one session with my np trail, and never suffered from the hurt hands and legs.........but thats just me.
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Everyone should have to clean off the cosmoline off of a m14 once in there life, then get it to pass inspection. David
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I agree with you Air Hunter about follow through. If my groups start to open up I really try to concentrate on the follow through and things usually tighten right up.
Scotty
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Skip the 1077. I hear the triggers are pretty bad. Consider that they also rotate the magazine. If you want a decent CO2 gun, single shots like the Crosman 2260 will serve you much better. And the triggers can be worked on, too.
I have one or two guns that need to be slapped open and it is a chore (rhymes with sore).
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Will403536,
Where are you located? Maybe someone knowledgeable in your area could take you under their wing.
Larry
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Don't focus on the fps so much, I had a gamo recon which is a 177 525fps and that was a ton of fun just shooting a can or shooting at a target.. every now and again a crow would land inside of 15yrds and it had no problem dropping it with a proper head shot...
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I was indeed giving it a slap. After many shots, my palm would get numb and red from all the slapping.
I am interested in an easier alternative, such as a CO2 powered Crosman 1077 Repeat Air, but those are .177 and only 625 FPS, not to mention I've read lots of reviews saying these CO2 rifles are highly inconsistent in both power and POI due to temperature variation with consecutive shots cooling the CO2 whippet.
PCP guns are way out of my price range. :)
When I got started, I said the same thing about PCP's. Right now I'm saving for one! Maybe you should just go get a pumper, like a Crosman 2100 Classic/Remington Airmaster 77. Better yet, a Daisy 22SG. Despite it's plastic stock and forearm, I think the 2100 is built better and is more reliable- but a 22SG is easier to pump. Almost too easy! If you go by the velocity on the box then the 22SG makes more muzzle energy, but chrony results I've seen online tell me the 2100 is the most powerful of the two. A step up from these would be a Benji 392/397 and they can both be had for a little less than the venoms. Less power than the venom but far easier to shoot, and more power than the two aforementioned pumpers. But to scope the benji's you've got to invest in intermounts.
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Me, I would avoid the cheaper pumpers. I doubt that they have very good triggers and cannot be upgraded or improved like the current Benjamins. There is nothing worse than fighting a truly bad trigger. If you are just into short range shooting, you might look for a good used Diana 24 with the adjustable trigger. (Got to ask the seller if the trigger has any screws in it since Diana used trigger guards with an an access hole for direct sear triggers, too.) Even the direct sear guns are pretty decent once you get used to them. I have two and they are extremely easy to cock and shoot. You can literally go all day. Ditto for some of the earlier Norica models like the 73 (also seems to have been sold as the Beeman Falcon [not the PCP Falcon gun]) or the 80G. Both have very good triggers and take little effort to cock. I think these are all in the 600 fps range in .177. The 80G was an entry level target rifle and is very accurate, too.
Just got to wondering, what, exactly do you want to do with your gun? If it is solely short distance target shooting and birds, then a 500 - 600 fps gun in .177 will serve you well enough. Most birds can be easily taken out to thirty yards or so with the guns I recommended. I really wouldn't do squirrels with them. If you want more punch, like anticipating doing a bit of larger game hunting or longer range, you will need something in the neighborhood of what you already have. Regarding the cocking, there's no free lunch with those. Consider that something like a Kodiak, what I call an ultra-magnum, is well over fifty pounds.
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I probably wouldn't shoot further than 40yd, and probably nothing larger than a bird/squirrel, but I definitely want the power of a Nitro Venom.
I think I will just bite the bullet and learn the way of the break-barrel... :)
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You'll be glad you did. Make you a better shot all around. And that's "Bite the pellet", my man. ;D
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I think I will just bite the bullet and learn the way of the break-barrel... :)
You'll be glad you did. Make you a better shot all around. And that's "Bite the pellet", my man. ;D
No matter what you are biting, the Zen of the break-barrel will ultimately reveal itself to you! Be patient and diligent, grasshopper.
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Got a Phantom this time. Half the price of a Nitro Venom, and is a proven and well-reputed product.
I've been doing much better with it, and the ironsights, but sometimes I do wish I could see the target a little more clearly with 3x or 4x mag. Maybe I'll pick up a cheap scope and mounts from WalMart some day.
Observations:
-I can put 3 pellets through 1 ragged hole at 10yd, but my accuracy drops off dramatically at 20yd. Possibly due to my own vision, and not achieving the exact same sight picture each time.
-I shoot better withOUT artillery hold--I think it's due to more grip on the rifle allowing for cleaner follow-through when I'm not using the artillery hold.
-The spring loudness is about the same as an NP, maybe 10% "louder" to my ears, at most. Definitely not the 70% number Crosman's marketing team computed with their third-party science lab.
-NP does cock and shoot smoother, but I only hear the difference, not feel it.
-The cheap plastic open sights work fine, but I don't like them. If i push on them, they do indeed have a little wiggle/flex.
Hope this helps out some other noobies.