GTA
All Springer/NP/PCP Air Gun Discussion General => PCP/CO2/HPA Air Gun Gates "The Darkside" => Topic started by: ranchibi on December 22, 2019, 09:17:17 PM
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Joe Brancatto @ AirTanksForSale got a shipment of these .22 cal in Friday. They are up front side lever (Edgun style). Cost is about a grand. He is getting .25 calibers in soon. Very nice, light, over 30ft/lb guns in .22. Comes with suppressor. I believe these are all in house made, barrels too, very similar to CZ barrels.
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Slick looking PCPs. Like a hybrid of the Capybara and an Impact or Priest. Indifferent to the Impact, find the Priest alright, and love the Capybara, so it works for me.
I've seen a few videos of the Zbroia guns and what they can do; really digging the looks here. ~ $1k, huh?
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I like the looks, .......but why the half shroud ?
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Slick looking PCPs. Like a hybrid of the Capybara and an Impact or Priest. Indifferent to the Impact, find the Priest alright, and love the Capybara, so it works for me.
I've seen a few videos of the Zbroia guns and what they can do; really digging the looks here. ~ $1k, huh?
The price was something Joe really tried to get Zbroia to stay under a grand. Mags are like Hatsan, simple and sturdy.
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I like the looks, .......but why the half shroud ?
Manny, no shroud just a moderator that is ok....DonnyFL or other would be needed for quiet shooting.
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I'm a big fan of bullpups, and this semi-bullpup is right up my alley. Looking forward to see reviews on this gun.
Is that a Huben under the Sapsan's air tank?
What is that gun above the Bulldog?
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Veeeeery nice design fully adjustable and scope rail assembly fixed the barrel at middle.
Just we have to wait for :
1. diagram
2. disassembling video
3. 100m accuracy for .177 slugs
I hope that they also develop hammer les or balanced valve version at 2020
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I'm a big fan of bullpups, and this semi-bullpup is right up my alley. Looking forward to see reviews on this gun.
Is that a Huben under the Sapsan's air tank?
What is that gun above the Bulldog?
Dinh, it is a full bullpup as the action is all the way rearward like an Edgun! Yes Huben under tank and an FX Tactical above BD.
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I'm a big fan of bullpups, and this semi-bullpup is right up my alley.
Dinh, it is a full bullpup as the action is all the way rearward like an Edgun!
Yeah, it looks good, and it's a full bullpup, but why is it sooo looong... — 33.5" (85cm)?! 😟 The barrel length is pretty standard, so no gain there....
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I like the looks, .......but why the half shroud ?
Manny, no shroud just a moderator that is ok....DonnyFL or other would be needed for quiet shooting.
Wander what's the reasoning not to go with a shroud, looks half baked like that :(
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I like the looks, .......but why the half shroud ?
Manny, no shroud just a moderator that is ok....DonnyFL or other would be needed for quiet shooting.
Wander what's the reasoning not to go with a shroud, looks half baked like that :(
I agree Manny and a full shroud with baffled could potentially make it 2-3” shorter plus look more finished. I’m really into compact air guns so I’ll order one to review it.
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Simple answer to several questions: a basic moderator is likely much cheaper than a full-length baffled shroud in material costs lone.
I don't know of any full-shroud bullpups that are truly quiet under $1k.
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Simple answer to several questions: a basic moderator is likely much cheaper than a full-length baffled shroud in material costs lone.
I don't know of any full-shroud bullpups that are truly quiet under $1k.
I've just recently added a sub $50 delrin, carbon fiber shroud extension(from eBay) to my $500 .25 Bullboss, and now I mainly just hear the action and the downrange impact.
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I'm a big fan of bullpups, and this semi-bullpup is right up my alley.
Dinh, it is a full bullpup as the action is all the way rearward like an Edgun!
Yeah, it looks good, and it's a full bullpup, but why is it sooo looong... — 33.5" (85cm)?! 😟 The barrel length is pretty standard, so no gain there....
I think it’s longer because they wanted more shots so a longer reservoir. The Kozak comes in different barrel lengths and the longer the barrel the bigger the reservoir it comes with. Longer barrel bigger air tank more shots more power is their thinking.
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I like the looks, .......but why the half shroud ?
Manny, no shroud just a moderator that is ok....DonnyFL or other would be needed for quiet shooting.
Wander what's the reasoning not to go with a shroud, looks half baked like that :(
Manny, I too wondered why no shroud..as Travis said they could have made it quieter and shorter with a baffled shroud and shorter LDC.
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Simple answer to several questions: a basic moderator is likely much cheaper than a full-length baffled shroud in material costs lone.
I don't know of any full-shroud bullpups that are truly quiet under $1k.
Peter, you are spot on for the reasoning for no shroud/baffles...cost! They are trying to keep their line up more affordable. This new ones platform was modified so R&D costs money. Their whole Kozak lineup is under a grand.
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Simple answer to several questions: a basic moderator is likely much cheaper than a full-length baffled shroud in material costs lone.
I don't know of any full-shroud bullpups that are truly quiet under $1k.
I've just recently added a sub $50 delrin, carbon fiber shroud extension(from eBay) to my $500 .25 Bullboss, and now I mainly just hear the action and the downrange impact.
IN STOCK CONFIGURATION
I hear what you're saying Dinh; we can reach out to any of a bunch of people or do a home-baked remedy for noise, but out of the box from the manufacturer, none of the under-a-grand bullpups are truly quiet.
EDIT: Actually, I think JKHan had a quiet BP for under $1k. A lot depends on power level of course, but let's assume .22 and close to MRod quiet- nope, nothing under a grand in stock form.
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Simple answer to several questions: a basic moderator is likely much cheaper than a full-length baffled shroud in material costs lone.
I don't know of any full-shroud bullpups that are truly quiet under $1k.
I agree cheaper to just put on a LDC
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Simple answer to several questions: a basic moderator is likely much cheaper than a full-length baffled shroud in material costs lone.
I don't know of any full-shroud bullpups that are truly quiet under $1k.
I agree cheaper to just put on a LDC
Looking at some of the EdGun and Ataman BPs configurations in "naked" form sans shroud... the air tube or bottle sticks wayyyyy out so the shroud "makes up" the difference.
If cost is kept down, I'm okay with that. Lots of folks like using their own LDC or improving on the existing (like Dinh mentioned).
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8) I think she looks just fine
https://www.airgunforum.co.uk/community/index.php?threads/sapsan-photograph.280008/ (https://www.airgunforum.co.uk/community/index.php?threads/sapsan-photograph.280008/) 8)
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I really like the overall lines, but I think a shroud would have completed it much better
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Well, it would not be hard to fab one up, and I would make it a little long and use the moderator to push on the shroud and pull on the barrel for a little tension
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Well, it would not be hard to fab one up, and I would make it a little long and use the moderator to push on the shroud and pull on the barrel for a little tension
👍
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I really like the overall lines, but I think a shroud would have completed it much better
Yes but scope rail assembly have to be fixed directly to the barrel as strong as possible.
Therefore only front part of barrel can be shrouded
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Well, it would not be hard to fab one up, and I would make it a little long and use the moderator to push on the shroud and pull on the barrel for a little tension
Sure, but doesn't all that beat the argument "to keep the gun cheaper" ?.....when even before you buy it you already know you'll be spending more money for a decent LDC or a shroud ?
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My guess is- knowing what I do about Ukrainians (having married a gal with Ukrainian roots)- Aesthetics are less important than performance. If the performance is in line with other Zbroia, should be a good shooter. For folks who don't worry about noise (hunters and those with rural property) not an issue. For those dealing with pesting (such as me), I don't mind swapping an LDC from another gun as needed.
Plus Ukrainian! A few threads back, I distinctly recall praise for airguns from eastern Europe :)
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My guess is- knowing what I do about Ukrainians (having married a gal with Ukrainian roots)- Aesthetics are less important than performance. If the performance is in line with other Zbroia, should be a good shooter. For folks who don't worry about noise (hunters and those with rural property) not an issue. For those dealing with pesting (such as me), I don't mind swapping an LDC from another gun as needed.
Plus Ukrainian! A few threads back, I distinctly recall praise for airguns from eastern Europe :)
Don't get me wrong, I really like the gun's looks,....I just don't thing a shroud would have been much more expensive then that LDC and it would have looked better and most likely come out shorter too :) :)
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I like that having the air tube not going past the trigger makes the gun less top heavy
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;) saw this photo on Zbroia facebook it has a shroud
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=2644124602308276&set=gm.1004544506592966&type=3&theater&ifg=1 (https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=2644124602308276&set=gm.1004544506592966&type=3&theater&ifg=1)
and a leather cheek piece for those who are always looking for after market ways to keep cold steel insulated from their face in cold weather 8)
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Could have gone a bit thicker on the shroud, .....yet an improvement none the less
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Now that looks excellent. I'm okay with a skinny shroud; I'd still opt for something by Donny, Neil, or David on the end to keep things civil in the backyard.
If Zbroia intends to sell like that, I want one.
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I think it looks great just like it is. Looks are secondary to function for me. Function is form usually in my book. If adding a full shroud makes it quieter, then great. If adding a full shroud just makes it look different, then it is a waste of time and money.
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Well, it would not be hard to fab one up, and I would make it a little long and use the moderator to push on the shroud and pull on the barrel for a little tension
Sure, but doesn't all that beat the argument "to keep the gun cheaper" ?.....when even before you buy it you already know you'll be spending more money for a decent LDC or a shroud ?
i think $1k is reasonable.
STOP and think..............how many people spend $2k for a gun and STILL spend more for a moderator!
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Yes nice design just I am thinking if air bottle behind trigger assembly ( between the shoulder and triggering hand ) is not a little bit better . Also thin air tube lengthwise the barrel is nice bulb up solution.
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Well, it would not be hard to fab one up, and I would make it a little long and use the moderator to push on the shroud and pull on the barrel for a little tension
Sure, but doesn't all that beat the argument "to keep the gun cheaper" ?.....when even before you buy it you already know you'll be spending more money for a decent LDC or a shroud ?
i think $1k is reasonable.
STOP and think..............how many people spend $2k for a gun and STILL spend more for a moderator!
Exacly !!!!!
Saving 30-40-50 bucks in production on a Grand gun by non coming out with a decent shroud will not change the selling capability,
and adding 30-40-50 bucks to the cost of a Grand gun by having a decent shroud on it will not hinder the selling capability either
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Does anyone know how the magazine system indexes? If memory serves me correctly, the earlier Zbroia offering has an issue with their flimsyish indexing arm getting out-of-whack.
Good looking gun, me thinks. I’d install some carbon fiber tubing over the exposed barrel but I don’t think it looks bad as is.
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Remove that butt ugly fore arm, add closed cell neoprene, add a decent shroud and it would look like much like the hard to get Huming Bird. Loved the looks of them. 8)
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ZX,, The magazines are different from the Kozak according to Andrey at Zbroia, so the mag advance system is probably different ???
Knife, the forearm will work great for my style of shooting , on the move finding something to lean on or againist
but it looks like one screw and that forearm comes off and it looks like a support for the airtube is there and you might mount a pic rail to it for them that enjoy a bench and a range to play on ;)
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Does anybody know the cost? Not a "I think $1k" but a hard-set price?
Cuz me want!
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Does anybody know the cost? Not a "I think $1k" but a hard-set price?
Cuz me want!
Peter, I don’t know the exact price but you can call Joe Brancatto 714-612-5956, he will now have a definitive price..should be very close to 1K. Very light and compact. The trigger guard folds forward and the foster fill is under the guard! Lever action is smooth and their barrels are CZ like in accuracy.
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Sounds interesting, but I don't think JB updated his site yet. I didnt see them under the Zbroia page.
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I've been checking Joe's site daily to see if they show up, then going to Zbroia's website to just, um, drool. The other models got a little bit of bad rep for magazine feeding IIRC, but nobody complained about accuracy. And a built-in cover for the foster fitting is a nice touch. This is one of a few PCPs that has really captured my attention in the last couple weeks (the other main one being the Lobo Mustang 30-30 look-alike!).
I may have to give Joe's shop a holler tomorrow.
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ZX,, The magazines are different from the Kozak according to Andrey at Zbroia, so the mag advance system is probably different ???
Thank you Jack.
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Talked to Charlie, Georgia airgun, he is thinking $1299. and that is with his special touches,tune and polishing(the man has a good reputation)
says he will get back to me for a sure price,,
dang,I forgot to ask about extra mags :(
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That's steeper than I was hoping for given the cost of the other Zbroia guns. Still, Charlie has a good rep for making shiny stuff sparkle.
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Well, I have been waiting since spring, I been guessing $1200 range the whole time and feel this is a good price considering Zbroia build quality
Charlie told me about 1 week to get to his shop, up to one week to work his tuning process, and it can take 1 week to get from him to me
I said, DO IT!,,,but will have to wait on extra mags,,cause the US importer did not realize the Sapsan mags are different than the Kozak mags
my .22 is ordered 8)
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Fully shrouded Sapsan’s does exists.
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They have only been spotted on facebook, ::)
It looks like they put the skinny az shroud from the Kozak on it. It would have been better to go with a larger diameter, and they would have to build a baffle to fit it.
Oh well, it ain't like we never customize our airguns to please us 8)
the shroud for the Kozak was small due to the narrow distance between the barrel and the scope rail
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It is still a good looking rifle. I'll eventually get one of these if I don't end up with a Capybara.