GTA
Support Equipment For PCP/HPA/CO2 and springers ,rams => Scopes And Optics Gate => Topic started by: DrGunner on November 09, 2019, 04:37:47 PM
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So, I’ve looked at literally hundreds of scopes and I’ve narrowed it down to two models to choose between. They are:
1) MTC Optics Mamba Lite 4-16x42 Scope
2) Hawke 4-16x44 Airmax 30 SF Compact
It turns out that to get all the features I want:
4-16
Side Focus
Parallax down to 10 yards
Weight around 20oz or less
I’m going to end up with a 30mm tube.
I’m interested in hearing from members here who have owned either of these models, preferably both.
I look forward to hearing pros & cons of these choices.
DrGunner
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Don't own either but have looked through a few hawks and weren't impressed. I've heard the MTCs are very good and have eyed there fixed scope from time to time.
Also the MTC you mentioned comes in a 1" tube not 30mm so that's a plus
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Don't own either but have looked through a few hawks and weren't impressed. I've heard the MTCs are very good and have eyed there fixed scope from time to time.
Also the MTC you mentioned comes in a 1" tube not 30mm so that's a plus
I thought I’d read that it was 30mm, but just checked and you’re right. That makes the decision easier... I already have a set of tall silhouette rings for a 1” tube. If I want rings that tall in 30mm, I would either need to buy them from Morr Accuracy in raw aluminum and have them anodized, or go with some type of riser, which I’m not a fan of.
I was already leaning towards the MTC based on an article I read in which the Daystate Regal was reviewed along with that exact scope.
Thanks for pointing out my error!
DrGunner
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Would you really need high (tall) rings for a 42mm fixed objective? Mediums usually work fine.
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So, I’ve looked at literally hundreds of scopes and I’ve narrowed it down to two models to choose between. They are:
1) MTC Optics Mamba Lite 4-16x42 Scope
2) Hawke 4-16x44 Airmax 30 SF Compact
It turns out that to get all the features I want:
4-16
Side Focus
Parallax down to 10 yards
Weight around 20oz or less
I’m going to end up with a 30mm tube.
I’m interested in hearing from members here who have owned either of these models, preferably both.
I look forward to hearing pros & cons of these choices.
DrGunner
Well.....I have a 4-16x44 Hawke Airmax Compact and it works surprisingly well after figuring out the setup, however this acope weighs about 22oz (21.9oz).
I do have a few comments about my scope.
Positives............
1. The optics of my scope are pretty good and it even "scope rangefinds" pretty well considering the 11.7" length and 44mm objective.
2. At the first field target match I attended with the scope I was surprised by the lack of "sun flare" when aiming on lanes orientated with the sun and when sitting in direct sun on those unshaded lanes.
3. While the reticle lighting knob was exceptionally stiff to turn the first time I used them I did like the feature where adjacent "brightness settings" turned off the lighting. That way I don't have to rotate the "rheostat knob" half way around to turn off the light. REAL CONVIENENT!
4. I really like the AMX IR reticle!
Negatives.........
1. Turret clicks aren't real distinct like my 4-12x50 Hawke Airmax AO. Since I only use "holdover aiming" and don't "click on" this really isn't an real issue for me.
2. The scope tube between the two "end bells" is so short that the supplied side wheel won't fit between the scope mount rings without a bit of "ring-adectomy".......
(https://i.imgur.com/6DEN4t8l.jpg)(https://i.imgur.com/pfqvOtKl.jpg)
LOL....I even made a 4 1/2" long sunshade for the scope from machined PVC pipe painted black inside and out and the sunshade even makes the scope look "normal size"......
(https://i.imgur.com/06ZehxUl.jpg)
3. The reticle lighting knob was so tight that it almost needed Vise-Grips to turn. This issue was largely resolved by turning the knob "round and round" a bunch of times which made it useful for shooting at a hunter class field target match.
4. While the side focus mechanism was smooth, a tiny bit of "backlash" developed with use. Not enough backlash to be an issue with scope rangefinding, however I did have to make sure all final sidewheel adjustments were done turning the same direction to remove the backlash.
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I have the Mamba Lite on my .25 cal Cricket carbine. Great scope and performs well. Have shot many moa groups
at 100 yds. Are buying used? I was under the impression the mamba lites were no longer available.
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Would you really need high (tall) rings for a 42mm fixed objective? Mediums usually work fine.
The purpose of tall rings for me has nothing to do with clearing the scope objective over the barrel, at all.
I shoot NRA smallbore silhouette- The purpose of this rifle is purely for backyard silhouette practice, every shot will be taken offhand.
Close to the bore axis is supposed to reduce parallax issues, and that idea applies more to BR shooting. I used to think that, too- but time and experience have taught me that if my rifle is set up properly, the comfort and fit of my setup matter more. Raising the scope height for offhand shooting has advantages.
You want your head as vertical as you can get, plus- think about it more as you are “lowering the rifle” as you raise the scope. It’s much easier to hold my rifle stable with taller rings.
Many silhouette shooters cant the scope in the rings, rotating the scope about 5 degrees or so clockwise for a right handed shooter, so when the rifle is shouldered the scope is rolled toward the shooters eye for the crosshairs to be level. This also aids in keeping the head straight. Keeping your head straight helps with overall balance.
Everyone has different body dimensions, so a rifle setup often evolves over time- I use what works for me. I find my hold to be much more stable and I have longer lasting hold stamina over the course of a 40 and especially an 80 shot match. Try hitting a 3”x4” target at 84 yards or a 5”x5” target at 109 yards with a rimfire rifle, without a sling or any added attachments and you’ll see what I mean.
Respectfully,
DrGunner
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So, I’ve looked at literally hundreds of scopes and I’ve narrowed it down to two models to choose between. They are:
1) MTC Optics Mamba Lite 4-16x42 Scope
2) Hawke 4-16x44 Airmax 30 SF Compact
It turns out that to get all the features I want:
4-16
Side Focus
Parallax down to 10 yards
Weight around 20oz or less
I’m going to end up with a 30mm tube.
I’m interested in hearing from members here who have owned either of these models, preferably both.
I look forward to hearing pros & cons of these choices.
DrGunner
Well.....I have a 4-16x44 Hawke Airmax Compact and it works surprisingly well after figuring out the setup, however this acope weighs about 22oz (21.9oz).
I do have a few comments about my scope.
Positives............
1. The optics of my scope are pretty good and it even "scope rangefinds" pretty well considering the 11.7" length and 44mm objective.
2. At the first field target match I attended with the scope I was surprised by the lack of "sun flare" when aiming on lanes orientated with the sun and when sitting in direct sun on those unshaded lanes.
3. While the reticle lighting knob was exceptionally stiff to turn the first time I used them I did like the feature where adjacent "brightness settings" turned off the lighting. That way I don't have to rotate the "rheostat knob" half way around to turn off the light. REAL CONVIENENT!
4. I really like the AMX IR reticle!
Negatives.........
1. Turret clicks aren't real distinct like my 4-12x50 Hawke Airmax AO. Since I only use "holdover aiming" and don't "click on" this really isn't an real issue for me.
2. The scope tube between the two "end bells" is so short that the supplied side wheel won't fit between the scope mount rings without a bit of "ring-adectomy".......
(https://i.imgur.com/6DEN4t8l.jpg)(https://i.imgur.com/pfqvOtKl.jpg)
LOL....I even made a 4 1/2" long sunshade for the scope from machined PVC pipe painted black inside and out and the sunshade even makes the scope look "normal size"......
(https://i.imgur.com/06ZehxUl.jpg)
3. The reticle lighting knob was so tight that it almost needed Vise-Grips to turn. This issue was largely resolved by turning the knob "round and round" a bunch of times which made it useful for shooting at a hunter class field target match.
4. While the side focus mechanism was smooth, a tiny bit of "backlash" developed with use. Not enough backlash to be an issue with scope rangefinding, however I did have to make sure all final sidewheel adjustments were done turning the same direction to remove the backlash.
Thanks for the comprehensive write up!
Turret clicks do matter to me, as I’ll be changing from 25 to 50 yards and back, but I will be able to dial in on paper between distances. Reliable tracking matters, but much more so on my rimfire scopes.
I appreciate your honest feedback!
DrGunner
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I have the Mamba Lite on my .25 cal Cricket carbine. Great scope and performs well. Have shot many moa groups
at 100 yds. Are buying used? I was under the impression the mamba lites were no longer available.
I was planning on buying new. As of this post, both Airguns of Arizona and AirgunOptics.com both have the Mamba Lite listed in stock and on sale for $399. I’ll email both to verify that they still have them.
Thanks for the info-
DrGunner
EDIT- I emailed AirgunOpticsPlus, got an immediate response from Charlie Sexton.
The Mamba Lite IS available- just has to be ordered, with a 10-12 day wait.
Great news there, you had me worried!
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I have the Mamba Lite on my .25 cal Cricket carbine. Great scope and performs well. Have shot many moa groups
at 100 yds. Are buying used? I was under the impression the mamba lites were no longer available.
Still available, Mr. 007.
Trenier Outdoors has them too in 10x, 12x, and 16x---the 10x is $100 cheaper.
Have never done business with Trenier, one of GTA's sponsors, but they are said to provide excellent service ;D..
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Treiner is top notch. I bought my Mamba lite from Jeff there. Everybody who looks through my scope says the same thing, " boy your scope is clear".
I love the reticle! Have the 12 x, wish I had the 16X. These guys make a big side wheel if you want one:
http://www.scope-werks.com (http://www.scope-werks.com)
Repeat, I LOVE MT MAMBA LITE! ;D ;)
-Y
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Treiner is top notch. I bought my Mamba lite from Jeff there. Everybody who looks through my scope says the same thing, " boy your scope is clear".
I love the reticle! Have the 12 x, wish I had the 16X. These guys make a big side wheel if you want one:
http://www.scope-werks.com (http://www.scope-werks.com)
Repeat, I LOVE MT MAMBA LITE! ;D ;)
-Y
Trenier lists the Mamba Lite 4-16 in stock, same price and they’re closer to me. Thanx!!!
DrGunner
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Yogi,
Scope weeks makes the side wheel for the Mamba Lite?
Mitch
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Yogi,
Scope weeks makes the side wheel for the Mamba Lite?
Mitch
I was about to ask the same question. They have MTC listed, but not the Mamba Lite. Perhaps the SF knob is the same size?
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Rowan Engineering in the UK has a lever-type parallax adjuster for the Mamba Lite, Dr. G.
They also have a round universal version.
I dunno if you have been to that site but their parts ooze fantastic quality.
They have an adjustable buttpad for the Huntsman too and some other stuff.
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Rowan Engineering in the UK has a lever-type parallax adjuster for the Mamba Lite, Dr. G.
They also have a round universal version.
I dunno if you have been to that site but their parts ooze fantastic quality.
They have an adjustable buttpad for the Huntsman too and some other stuff.
Rick- Not only have I been to that site, I ordered and already received one of their single shot loaders and an aluminum trigger guard that I plan to have anodized in black for my Regal XL:
(http://i1162.photobucket.com/albums/q535/drkgavin/Daystate%20Regal/BD12696C-4018-4A00-8F52-117D99DDC6EC_zpstt2nbvc6.jpg) (http://s1162.photobucket.com/user/drkgavin/media/Daystate%20Regal/BD12696C-4018-4A00-8F52-117D99DDC6EC_zpstt2nbvc6.jpg.html)
(http://i1162.photobucket.com/albums/q535/drkgavin/Daystate%20Regal/C96A128B-983D-47B7-9B95-16E88960F096_zpsb6vtxo83.jpg) (http://s1162.photobucket.com/user/drkgavin/media/Daystate%20Regal/C96A128B-983D-47B7-9B95-16E88960F096_zpsb6vtxo83.jpg.html)
(http://i1162.photobucket.com/albums/q535/drkgavin/Daystate%20Regal/2B1B858D-4876-4A1E-8544-264BA5EF446C_zpsljuy3qix.jpg) (http://s1162.photobucket.com/user/drkgavin/media/Daystate%20Regal/2B1B858D-4876-4A1E-8544-264BA5EF446C_zpsljuy3qix.jpg.html)
(http://i1162.photobucket.com/albums/q535/drkgavin/Daystate%20Regal/29BADA5E-3CE8-48F4-8D81-8575BB1DD53B_zps0a4somic.jpg) (http://s1162.photobucket.com/user/drkgavin/media/Daystate%20Regal/29BADA5E-3CE8-48F4-8D81-8575BB1DD53B_zps0a4somic.jpg.html)
The single shot loader is an excellent design- it flips open when you cycle the bolt. I find it much easier to load than the Daystate tray, with my big hands. Plus, it aligns the pellet very precisely with the bore.
DrGunner
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Ahaha!
Typical Dr.G ;D..
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Ahaha!
Typical Dr.G ;D..
Crazy part is that I was directed to Rowan Engineering from RFC, lol
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Yogi,
Scope weeks makes the side wheel for the Mamba Lite?
Mitch
I was about to ask the same question. They have MTC listed, but not the Mamba Lite. Perhaps the SF knob is the same size?
Eric at Scope-werks made me a side wheel. I measured the side parralex knob and he made it. Sure he could do the same for you.
Once again, I love my Mamba Lite!
-Y
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You guys made me feel guilty..... :-[
They have 6 set screws! Was not cheap but real quality! ;)
-Y
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Ahaha!
Typical Dr.G ;D..
Crazy part is that I was directed to Rowan Engineering from RFC, lol
Yes, I do remember being guilty of posting Rowan parts a long time ago in our beloved rimfire forum but, obviously, rimfire users and airgun users are about the same breed, sir, lol!
I do not have a single Rowan part but they are adjudged to be head honcho when it comes to airguns parts, Dr. G!
Yogi sir, his work is also exemplary ;D..
Can't imagine how he machines those parts with odd angles :o..
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I have many and will repeat those purchases again when necessary, Rowan is the best!
Mitch
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Thinking about getting the Hawke compact scope so following this thread.
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I really like the clarity of Optisan scopes--I believe they are the same company as MTC?
Their reticles are about the same, the one on my old Optisan had the SCB (not the upgraded SCB2) reticle.
Mine was the fixed 10x in 30mm tube, which was shipped from the UK to the Philippines, but I sold later to a friend of mine when I upgraded to a higher mag.
I still have a photo of it ;D..
(https://i.imgur.com/GR5ACP9.jpg)
The upgrade ;D
(https://i.imgur.com/HawSlVB.jpg)
To my eyes, the Optisan was clearer than my friend's Hawke Sidewinder.
They also feel more solid, IMHO, but I only had 2 Hawkes (still have the 2-7x32 in the Philippines), both glass-etched.
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Thinking about getting the Hawke compact scope so following this thread.
Consider this scope too:
https://www.krale.shop/en/rifle-scope-optisan-cobra-ii-3-9x42-mil-dot.html (https://www.krale.shop/en/rifle-scope-optisan-cobra-ii-3-9x42-mil-dot.html)
If buy more stuff, like pellets and mounts the shipping is not so burdensome. Great glass for a cheap scope.
The EVX line of scope are supposed to be good too! :D
-Y
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After much research & deliberation, I’ve decided my Daystate Regal XL will be topped with an MTC Mamba Lite 4-16x42, mounted on 1.5”
D3 Precision Silhouette rings.
I will post pictures when I get the scope and mount it up, we are already into single digits and snowfall here in the Midwest so there is no further rush to get the scope. I might even be waiting until Christmas to actually order it as I’ve already exceeded my predicted spending limit for this rifle, and have a family to support and always consider first.
DrGunner
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I ordered the MTC Mamba Lite 4-16x42 from Trenier Outdoors today. Jeff from Trenier proved to be extremely knowledgeable, helpful and generous with his time answering my many questions. He offered to send me the Mamba and inspect it, send it back if I don’t like it as long as I don’t mount it which would leave ring marks. I would definitely recommend Trenier Outdoors to any of you heard who are looking to buy a scope, great people tyere!
DrGunner