GTA
Support Equipment For PCP/HPA/CO2 and springers ,rams => Support Equipment For PCP/HPA/CO2 => Topic started by: Wayne52 on October 23, 2018, 08:52:01 AM
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Well folks I went and did it, I ordered me a Shoebox F10, I wasn't expecting almost $50 for shipping though (UPS) but it is what it is. The only other option was USPS@$75 and I can wait because both of my 88CF tanks are full right now so I'm in no big hurry. I sure the heck wasn't going to order all the headaches that go with the Yong Heng compressor.
After seeing and hearing about people filling their tanks with the F8 with no problems whatsoever I decided the Shoebox was the best route to go. I realize they're not as fast as many of the compressors but I'm mainly just going to be hunting and very little plinking. The one thing that I really like about them is they're made in USA!!!
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The ability to do moisture removal after the 125 psi shop compressor is a definite plus. The speed is still bit of a concern, but I think it would work for me. Best wishes with the purchase!
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Wayne,
I only have Benjamin tanks and they require 50 minutes on the ShoeboxMax.
You will be fine with the Shoebox 10...IMHO
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Congrats Wayne. I'll be following this to see how it works for you!
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You'll be happy! I only have a Freedom 8, which is slower than the version you have, and I LOVE it!
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They sent me an email today giving me the UPS shipping number, I checked it of course and it's been picked up by UPS and scheduled to be here Tuesday :D
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Looking forward to your impressions.
I am thinking about going into pcp but the initial investment holds me back.
What will you be using for the low pressure air?
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A F10 for what a Max use to cost, well worth it.
Not as fast as many china compressors in this price range, but will probably be around much longer.
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Fast is OK, gut longevity is more important to me. The F!) will do a fine job! In fact, probably my next purchace. ;)
Knife
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Thanks for all the great replies everyone !!!
Looking forward to your impressions.
I am thinking about going into pcp but the initial investment holds me back.
What will you be using for the low pressure air?
Harbor Freight has one that I'll probably pick up, it's good up to 150psi but 125 will be fine from it, I figure I do a little overkill buying the compressor to drive it. ;D
Fast is OK, gut longevity is more important to me. The F!) will do a fine job! In fact, probably my next purchace. ;)
Knife
I figure as far as longevity the F10 will probably still be here long after I'm gone.
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Ugh one of those little 'pancake' compressers? Don't to it man!
They are noisy as *(&^ and cheap. Talk about lack of longevity!
Reason I asked is I have a California air compressor but wondered if it would be enough to 'feed' a shoebox.
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Ugh one of those little 'pancake' compressers? Don't to it man!
They are noisy as *(&^ and cheap. Talk about lack of longevity!
Reason I asked is I have a California air compressor but wondered if it would be enough to 'feed' a shoebox.
A lot of the guys use the California compressor My oilless pancake is noisy as heck but only runs for a couple minutes at a time when feeding my Freedom 8
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Ugh one of those little 'pancake' compressers? Don't to it man!
They are noisy as *(&^ and cheap. Talk about lack of longevity!
Reason I asked is I have a California air compressor but wondered if it would be enough to 'feed' a shoebox.
Tom,
The Shoebox only uses .2 cfm. To get the rated fill speeds you have to supply a constant 125 psi. It will work with less pressure but it won't fill as fast.
My California Air Tools compressor cycles between 90 psi on and 120 psi shutoff. I's the small 1/2 horsepower model. I bought it for it's low power draw to use on the same circuit as my Shoebox Max and I wanted super quiet.
If my Max dies I will not hesitate to replace it with an F10.
Thanks,
Taso
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I may stand corrected on this Taso but the F10 requires a 2 cfm air source and not .2 cfm? At least I think that's what the manufacturer states..
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Tom Kaye says 2 cfm as an output from the compressor so that it does not run so much, making hotter air. The 0.2 cfm is the actual usage rate of the compressor (rounded up from 0.17 cfm) . . .
I will say that I have had an oil free shop compressor for decades, and it is one of my most used tools. I would not be without one. When it dies, I will probably replace it with a California one for the quiet operation. My current one is a 1990's 15 gallon Craftsman and it works fine but it loud as *(&^. I keep it in the garage, and I have a manifold system I installed that feeds air to my shop where my Shoebox is (of course that ll predates the Shoebox). The reulst is that the air has a long time to cool down as it makes its way to the Shoebox, and in the winter the shop compressor gets nice and cold condensing our even more water vapor before hitting my desiccant pre-filter system.
Bottom line - don't skimp too much on the shop compressor, as it has great value on its own.
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I have only used air from the scuba shop, but a small compressor would be nice.
Has anyone tried the 12 volt job that airforce sells?
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...So a minimum of 2cfm sustained from the air source (shop compressor) should allow for cycling and that would lessen heat and overall wear and tear. Now I believe I understand.
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What ever happened to the air venturi 'booster' ?
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I may stand corrected on this Taso but the F10 requires a 2 cfm air source and not .2 cfm? At least I think that's what the manufacturer states..
Yes, Alan's explanation is spot on. The Shoebox site suggests a 2 cfm compressor I think for an idea on size and duty rate. I have attached a screenshot of the usage as stated on the Shoebox FAQ page.
I do have a higher capability and older Sears Craftsman compressor in the garage. I got it free from the previous owner as it was abused. I'm sure the tank is full of job site dust and rusty inside and emitting dirty air. But it's mostly used filling tires and some rare air tool use.
I did want as clean as possible air for my Shoebox so I bought the new mini CAT compressor.
Thanks,
Taso
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I am on my 3rd Shoebox and each one has been a positive experience.
I sold the first one to get the max when it came out and then sold the max during a moment of clarity as I decided to get out of airguns, but madness overtook me once again and I purchased the F10couple of months ago, and I love it, love it even more when I read about the Chinese Compressor’s.
Roachcreek
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I might just get something better than the Harbor Freight because I was watching a youtube video comparing the California one and HB one and that California one is super quiet in comparison. As of right now both my 88cf Jager SCBA's have plenty of air in them to last a month or more so I've got plenty of time to get what I really want, I can't take that noise that the HB puts out, it's terrible for indoor use.
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I might just get something better than the Harbor Freight because I was watching a youtube video comparing the California one and HB one and that California one is super quiet in comparison. As of right now both my 88cf Jager SCBA's have plenty of air in them to last a month or more so I've got plenty of time to get what I really want, I can't take that noise that the HB puts out, it's terrible for indoor use.
I bought a small Husky 4.6 gallon compressor from Home Depot that looks identical to one of the California Air compressors. I use it with my Freedom 10 and originally Shoebox Max.
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The Rolair JC-10 is a good match for the Shoebox. Very quiet and compact and it doesn’t run much to keep up with the Shoebox. The pancake compressors and small Harbor Freight models are noisy and less durable. The Rolair is actually a rebranded California Air Tools model. Why have a quiet Shoebox and a buzzy cheap first stage compressor?
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The Rolair JC-10 is a good match for the Shoebox.
I have this compressor as well- extremely happy with the sound level
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The Rolair is actually a rebranded California Air Tools model
Looks like it, looks just like my CA compressor except for the color.
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Can someone with a Shoebox post fill time for a gun directly? Is this something you do regularly. Related to another post regarding lowest cost to get started in PCP's.
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I was sitting on the throne a while ago thumbing through a new Harbor Freight catalog I got in the mail a couple days ago and look what I found. Sure looks a lot like the California ones
(https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1909/45577628891_5405708623_b.jpg)
They're not even shown anywhere on line yet (the one on the right), there is a video of the one on a left in Vimeo.
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Walmart also carries the CAT compressors:
https://www.walmart.com/search/?page=1&query=%22california+air+tools%22&sort=price_low#searchProductResult (https://www.walmart.com/search/?page=1&query=%22california+air+tools%22&sort=price_low#searchProductResult)
Taso
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Wayne, Amazon has the .6HP CAT compressor for $93 and change, is it the same as the one on the left in the HF ad?
https://www.amazon.com/California-Air-Tools-CAT-1P1060S-Compressor/dp/B01LYHYHEA/ref=pd_cart_vw_crc_1_3?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=B01LYHYHEA&pd_rd_r=Q9YFC8ST1HKSMK9T2YR1&pd_rd_w=OkgEh&pd_rd_wg=cHdaX&pf_rd_i=cart-page-widgets&pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_p=7b1a11cb-b9d6-4645-a52e-34c86ca37029&pf_rd_r=Q9YFC8ST1HKSMK9T2YR1&pf_rd_s=cart-page-widgets&pf_rd_t=40701&psc=1&refRID=Q9YFC8ST1HKSMK9T2YR1 (https://www.amazon.com/California-Air-Tools-CAT-1P1060S-Compressor/dp/B01LYHYHEA/ref=pd_cart_vw_crc_1_3?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=B01LYHYHEA&pd_rd_r=Q9YFC8ST1HKSMK9T2YR1&pd_rd_w=OkgEh&pd_rd_wg=cHdaX&pf_rd_i=cart-page-widgets&pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_p=7b1a11cb-b9d6-4645-a52e-34c86ca37029&pf_rd_r=Q9YFC8ST1HKSMK9T2YR1&pf_rd_s=cart-page-widgets&pf_rd_t=40701&psc=1&refRID=Q9YFC8ST1HKSMK9T2YR1)
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Wayne
You'll be HAPPY you got the SB.......... ;D
I got my F-10 about a year ago, used for $225, shipped, and I just love it,
very quite and I can be in the same room when running.
I have a contractors Hatchi air compressor that goes to 150#'s psi, with a 100' of 3/8" line,
It sits outside and I run the line inside thru a door or window, so I don't have to listen to that noisy beast etc.
I made a 3 sectioned air dryer filter system using these type of AFTER filters,
http://www.wilkersoncorp.com/9EM-TK-190/9EM-AF2.pdf, (http://www.wilkersoncorp.com/9EM-TK-190/9EM-AF2.pdf,)
I found 6 of them for $40.
After I got them in my hot grubbies, I did some mods to them,
the air comes in 1 side, at the top, and flows down/out thru the inside filter part, then out the top of the other side,
I found out that the air pressure, would move some of the Blue beads into the exit side,
and could possibly get into the air line going to the SB. :o
So I installed a smoking pipe screen (cut to size and made to fit the exhaust/outlet sides),
and used epoxy to hold in place, on each exit side of the 3 filters, to hold these beads inside each filter etc.
I used a fitting that closed off the exit hole and T/D a fitting that used a push on nipple for plastic tubing,
into the exit path. All 3 filters have 5/16-3/8" plastic hose cut to length that terminates at the bottom of the plastic bowl,
there is a pressed bronze filter at the end, this will cause the air to travel down thru the beads,
then up thru the hose and go into the next filter etc.
I used the smallest Blue beads 1-2 mm size in the first 2 filters, then used the smallest Zeolite beads in the last filter,
there is a 4' section of hose with QD couplers to fit the supply air line and the SB connector,
when I am finished using the SB, I connect the filter ends together, so I am NOT drawing in outside air etc..
I use the SB to fill my 3-4500 psi SCBA tanks about once or twice a month, the G-son can go thru the air and pellets LOL.
I just checked and the first filter is just slightly changing color (normal humidity here runs 10-15% yr around),
the second filter is normal deep Blue colored etc.
After filling the SCBA tanks to 3000 psi (all the higher I go for my needs), using down to 2000 psi range,
it takes about 2-3 hrs to fill back up to the 3000 psi range with the SB, just purring along,
I rotate these tanks, and have found no moisture inside, any of them, so far.
When I got these CF 4500 psi tanks, (the valve was loosened for shipping),
I removed the valve and cut off the alum extension, (which keeps water out of the air supply for emergency use),
so when turned upside down and the main valve was opened, any water would blow out etc.
I have NOT found any moisture inside these tanks when I go to refill them, so I am happy with the air filter system I am using.
I have NOT attempted to fill the 4 - 13/3000 Ninja tanks with the SB, as I was told it is not a good Idea,
from using the SB and mild mannered as it is, I don't see why you can't fill gun tanks etc.
Each of these CF 4500 psi tanks get filled at least times 1-2 per month via the SB,
and I am tickled Pink............with the SB results etc. I am glad I got 3 of them,
1 being used and 2 for back ups........
HTH,
Tia,
Don
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I'm still considering buying an F-10. My yong heng is still hanging in there but who knows for how long filling SCBA tanks...
I already have this 3 gallon quite compressor, an additional 1 gal air tank and all the air drying stuff and fittings....just need the F-10.
https://www.amazon.com/Briggs-Stratton-4-5-Gallon-Technology-074045-00/dp/B01EWMF4DE?th=1 (https://www.amazon.com/Briggs-Stratton-4-5-Gallon-Technology-074045-00/dp/B01EWMF4DE?th=1)
This is my gunroom compressor. Its QUITE, fills in less than a minute and delivers all the air I need for cleaning gun stuff. I think, it will run the F-10 just fine as well...
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Can anyone tell me what the "Add on spacer kit" is on the pull down menu on their order page? I was think about grabbing 1 of these since the price drop & I don't know what this spacer kit is or does
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Rob,
I think the spacer kit is this:
http://www.shoeboxcompressor.com/order/spare-parts/spacer-kit.html (http://www.shoeboxcompressor.com/order/spare-parts/spacer-kit.html)
Also from the website: "These spacers are part of the internal components for each cylinder. We recommend that they are changed approximately every 3-4 times o-rings are replaced,."
Thanks,
Taso
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I bought them with mine to have on hand. Don't lose them - it will likely be a long time before you need them!
I have had my Shoebox ~4.5 years, run it for ~160 hours, and I rebuilt it once at about 150 hours, and did not really need to - I just decided it was time to see what was involved and understand if there was any capability change if I did it (there was no change). So I may not need them for another 12-15 years . . . .
Not saying don't buy them - it is always good to have spares (I even have a spare belt, just in case) - just that you probably don't need them for quite a while. Of course, when you need them, you will want to know that you either have them, or can get them. In my mind it was a good thing to get them with my original order . . . .
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Thank you gentlemen. Spare rebuild parts are always good to have on hand. I wasn't sure if it was an upgrade or what
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Yep. NO WAY I need a new hobby maintaining a king kong kompressor.
I already have a Emglo and with a back fusion surgery coming down the road pumping by hand is getting old FAST.
I've been trying to decide which guns got to go to get the F10.
Congrats and thx from team USA for buying local.
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I got an email from UPS today, mine will be here between 11:15AM and 3:15PM tomorrow ;)
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Well, so what do ya think of it Wayne?
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Michael I ordered a California compressor yesterday because I went to Harbor Freight yesterday to buy the new quiet one they're supposed to have only to hear, oh we don't have them and won't have them for another two weeks or more, then the gal replies oh by the way you can't get any compressors with the discount code either. I then said well I'll go ahead and order the California compressor.
It all ended up the Cal compressor would have been more inexpensive to begin with ???
The Shoebox does look nice but I haven't plugged it in and tried it yet and won't till probably this time next week >:(
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Michael I ordered a California compressor yesterday because I went to Harbor Freight yesterday to buy the new quiet one they're supposed to have only to hear, oh we don't have them and won't have them for another two weeks or more, then the gal replies oh by the way you can't get any compressors with the discount code either. I then said well I'll go ahead and order the California compressor.
It all ended up the Cal compressor would have been more inexpensive to begin with ???
The Shoebox does look nice but I haven't plugged it in and tried it yet and won't till probably this time next week >:(
Turning on notifications so I catch your first hand experience with it.
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From what I've read and seen about the Shoebox they're about as reliable as it gets, I doubt I'll have any problems getting things going once I have all my ducks in a row ;)
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I think you'll enjoy the cali. compressor with it a whole lot more Wayne!
Mike
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I couldn't believe it I got my California compressor today on a Sunday no less, I also got my UTG Tactical scope today as well, the water separator isn't going to be here til Friday though.
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As much as you may be tempted to 'try it out' wait till you have the dryer :)
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I tried the Cal compressor though, man is that thing quiet, I filled the tank one time thinking wow is that thing quiet and I hadn't even put the air filter on it yet, I then put the air filter on it and it was even quieter yet. I drained the compressor twice from the bottom of the tank and there was a considerable amount of moisture coming out, so yes I can wait till I get the dryer for sure.
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LOL about the CA compressor, I put the air filter/ muffler on, but didn't see there was a clear plastic hose that slips over the intake, with out it I thought it was almost as loud as the compressor it was replacing. Since then I have added 2 3/4" hoses to our large shop compressor at work with similar results. :o
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So far I'm pretty happy with my Shoebox but I still need to get a better air dryer in line. What I've got now is one of those HB ones with the beads that are blue and turn pink. I dried the beads in it a couple times so far but that really went fast@250F in a toaster oven which was a little less than 1/2 hour each time.
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Wayne,
I had created a thread on water removal when I got my Shoebox compressor here:
https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=120744.0 (https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=120744.0)
There is a lot information for you to pick from. I also documented my thought processes and ideas, my research on various topics, what worked, what didn't and the costs.
I found and use a membrane drier for my moisture debulking for $80 on Ebay. It brings the dew point down to -4° F. That's 3.98% relative humidity at 77° F. It lasts up to 10 years of daily use, requires no maintenance or electricity. It has a constant, controlled air purge to expel the moisture that it separates. It also needs clean air so that the membrane does not get contaminated. Dirtier air will mean shorter life of the membrane.
5 like mine just popped up for sale:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-SMC-IDG1-N02-Membrane-Air-Dryer-1-4-NPT-10-LPM-Air-Flow-20-C-D-P/123450891654?hash=item1cbe3f1d86:g:Y4AAAOSwRIFb0ooU:rk:37:pf:0 (https://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-SMC-IDG1-N02-Membrane-Air-Dryer-1-4-NPT-10-LPM-Air-Flow-20-C-D-P/123450891654?hash=item1cbe3f1d86:g:Y4AAAOSwRIFb0ooU:rk:37:pf:0)
They are the perfect size for our Shoebox compressors. You can submit an offer for $80 and see what happens.
Otherwise you can use bigger quantities of silica gel for your moisture debulking. Silica gel works best at the higher humidity levels but not good at lower moisture levels. I've attached a chart of absorption rates of different media. Since the Shoebox uses very little air the dwell times of air in the desiccant are very high which is good.
Thanks,
Taso
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Wayne,
I had created a thread on water removal when I got my Shoebox compressor here:
https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=120744.0 (https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=120744.0)
There is a lot information for you to pick from. I also documented my thought processes and ideas, my research on various topics, what worked, what didn't and the costs.
I found and use a membrane drier for my moisture debulking for $80 on Ebay. It brings the dew point down to -4° F. That's 3.98% relative humidity at 77° F. It lasts up to 10 years of daily use, requires no maintenance or electricity. It has a constant, controlled air purge to expel the moisture that it separates. It also needs clean air so that the membrane does not get contaminated. Dirtier air will mean shorter life of the membrane.
5 like mine just popped up for sale:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-SMC-IDG1-N02-Membrane-Air-Dryer-1-4-NPT-10-LPM-Air-Flow-20-C-D-P/123450891654?hash=item1cbe3f1d86:g:Y4AAAOSwRIFb0ooU:rk:37:pf:0 (https://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-SMC-IDG1-N02-Membrane-Air-Dryer-1-4-NPT-10-LPM-Air-Flow-20-C-D-P/123450891654?hash=item1cbe3f1d86:g:Y4AAAOSwRIFb0ooU:rk:37:pf:0)
They are the perfect size for our Shoebox compressors. You can submit an offer for $80 and see what happens.
Otherwise you can use bigger quantities of silica gel for your moisture debulking. Silica gel works best at the higher humidity levels but not good at lower moisture levels. I've attached a chart of absorption rates of different media. Since the Shoebox uses very little air the dwell times of air in the desiccant are very high which is good.
Thanks,
Taso
Thanx Taso. I will be starting right where you did with that thread.