GTA
Airguns by Make and Model => Vintage Air Gun Gate => Topic started by: unionrdr on August 27, 2018, 12:17:31 AM
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Got lucky again on the eBay Crosman auctions this afternoon. After wanting one for years, not even seeing one in person, I finally acquired a Crosman Model 70. Estimated to be here Thursday. Needs a lil work, but shoots he claims. And I already have most of what's needed to make it more beautiful than when it was new. Can't see the serial number real good though.
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/640x480q90/921/5qKJf2.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/pl5qKJf2j)
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/640x480q90/923/mkhXT4.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/pnmkhXT4j)
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/640x480q90/923/DIyzDd.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/pnDIyzDdj)
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Very cool. Congratulations!
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Definitely way cool! Thanks! I can't wait till it gets here! Then I'll work my magic on it after finishing part 2 of the 725VTR video.
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Looking forward to hearing the report once it arrives.
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nice addition a model I'd like to find in the UK along with a 622 and a 99
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Mike Baker @ peter_built78@hotmail.com has 6 new 622's he built from NOS parts he has for sale now! I'll do an initial video review and initial cleaning/test when it gets here. So stay tuned for that. This has got me feeling a lil weird, After so many years of wanting and searching. I just feel like I don't know how to feel about it? Numbed I guess, but not comfortably. Drank just enough beer-n-bourbon last night that I should've passed out, but didn't feel but half of it?
So we'll all see what it's really like when it gets here, cleaned and oiled. Then we'll charge it up and test fire it with some good quality pellets I have for all the .177's in my collection. This'll be so darn cool to finally touch it, smell it, clean it, shoot it, heft it...oh yeah...a man and his model 70, the rifleman's rifle! Interesting to note that, when the Winchester model 70 was born in 1936, it's barreled action was an improvement of the K98 Mauser.
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/640x480q90/921/5qKJf2.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/pl5qKJf2j)
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cheers for the heads up on the 622's
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You're welcome. Like to share info so we all learn a lil more in the telling. Just can't wait to finally feel it, touch, etc. First time I'll ever see one in person!
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Real nice.
Is it real wood ?
I believe they also had them with faux wood which looks pretty real.
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Real nice.
Is it real wood ?
I believe they also had them with faux wood which looks pretty real.
I thought these were all faux wood?
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Real nice.
Is it real wood ?
I believe they also had them with faux wood which looks pretty real.
I thought these were all faux wood?
This one sure looks like real wood, and there appears to even be a chip in the edge of the magazine well
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No, they've all been real wood that I've ever seen pics of. It looks like Elm again. It has that same smooth, flowing grain with all the grain character details of the 160 Pellgun stock. I also went back to eBay today and found a Dem-Bart checkering kit barely used. It'll be her Saturday. The rifle is due to arrive by pony express tomorrow!
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/640x480q90/924/ZsV7Bb.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/poZsV7Bbj)
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/640x480q90/923/mkhXT4.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/pnmkhXT4j)
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No, they've all been real wood that I've ever seen pics of. It looks like Elm again. It has that same smooth, flowing grain with all the grain character details of the 160 Pellgun stock. I also went back to eBay today and found a Dem-Bart checkering kit barely used. It'll be her Saturday. The rifle is due to arrive by pony express tomorrow!
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/640x480q90/924/ZsV7Bb.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/poZsV7Bbj)
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/640x480q90/923/mkhXT4.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/pnmkhXT4j)
That's definitely a nice looking rifle and it'll look even better all checkered up.
It's just too bad that they used a decent wood for the stock but had to go and make the barrel shroud out of plastic.
hypothetically speaking, if you could get a metal barrel shroud for say $30 would you ?
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If it was steel and the same shape, definitely! But keep in mind that, just like the Winchester model 70's, the front sight is part of the barrel. As are the rear sight mounting wings. And also that the actual barrel insert is a thin-walled, " soda straw" type made of steel. I also would like to find a period-correct scope for it as well. late 70's would be about right. My 66AB Powermaster has a steel barrel sleeve and looks great. I'll post pics of the 160 & 70 here to, just for comparison's sake. ** I also noticed that this forums date cutoff of, " pre-1985 only" was changed to 1993. So I think I'll continue threads about the older 760's and 66AB in this forum to lump them all in one place. Easier for me.
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/640x480q90/921/pgyXQw.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/plpgyXQwj)
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/640x480q90/924/UECNFh.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/poUECNFhj)
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/640x480q90/923/mkhXT4.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/pnmkhXT4j)
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/640x480q90/921/5qKJf2.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/pl5qKJf2j)
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Would this scope work?
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Looks long enough, but to small diameter for my eyesight at this point. My Weaver V22-A is 18mm, and that's about as small as I can work with. Not 100% comfortably, but workable. And with the model 70 sitting in the Elk Grove Village USPS hub a bit too long, and being " in transit to destination" with no departure scan, I launched an investigation. Had to explain to the investigator that I bought it on eBay 5 days ago, Was supposed to be delivered today, being priority mail, what it was, and being vintage & valuable. It is now listed as going to be delivered later than expected. In transit to next facility. I hope I get it by Saturday for the holiday weekend. I'm left wondering if some snowflake did that to me on purpose? One look at that box and you know what it is... :'(
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Yes, this is pretty small, probably why I don't have it mounted.
I wouldn't take it personally on the shipping delay, even though it may FEEL that way as you're understandably anxious. Even snowflakes mostly just do their jobs.
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After getting an investigator on the job, it made it's way to the Cleveland hub @ 5:29PM. Then " on route to destination". I hope that means to the local hub so my priority mail rifle will get here on day 4, tomorrow.
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Well, it finally got here by mid afternoon Friday (about 12 hours ago now). I finally got the video uploaded, so here it is. And dummy me, I didn't notice I had the scope 90 degrees out of rotation,. Fixed it a lil bit ago. Oopse! **PS- After another look at the serial number close up, it seems to read, " 00009857". So I take that to mean 9/80 build date?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LGhkf1COTck&feature=youtu.be (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LGhkf1COTck&feature=youtu.be)
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Here's a pic of the model 70 after it's first cleaning and Rem-Oil rub down in Lord knows how long? Seen here with Hatsan/Optima 3-9x32 scope on Gamo sight-through high-mounts that barely fits with decent eye relief. Hawk mid-rise dovetail mounts on the way!;
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/640x480q90/921/7jibEM.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/pl7jibEMj)
Cleaned up pretty good. But still gettin' Coronel Cougar's special restomod! And in this pic, you can see comparative sizes;
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/640x480q90/922/qghz3F.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/pmqghz3Fj)
And the 7/8" round cleaning patches wetted with Rem-Oil used to clean the barrel bore;
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/640x480q90/921/o0mVHJ.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/plo0mVHJj)
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And after a serial number conversation with a member of one of my Facebook groups, I found the serial number, upon receiving the rifle, to actually be, " 00009857". And then a number printed beyond that, and at a 90 degree angle to it, " 1 (pellet symbol?)4"? So would that then make the build date 1/74, or January 1974? After making a couple calls, this is turning into another game of, " stump the chump" as we used to call it back in the day.
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/640x480q90/924/q4XMdv.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/poq4XMdvj)
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Interesting.
Crosman says they produced them from '74-'80, so the serial number can't be the date or that would make it '85.
If that other number is the date, it would make this one of the first model 70's crosman ever made which is pretty cool.
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The three digit # is actually 124. Probably meaning Dec '74.
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Looks like 124 to me, too.
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Well, the plot thickens. According to Tom Slocum, who collected up a ton of books, diagrams, manuals, & printed info from collectors that passed on for some 35 years, some even Crossman employee's, the, " 124" is a makers mark. Someone at Crosman who repaired or resealed the rifle at some point. The four zero's at the beginning of the serial number is odd though. Here's a pic of two of his model 70's that have the build date where the zero's are;
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/640x480q90/922/Fd5ScJ.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/pmFd5ScJj)
So I can only surmise that all those zero's are there because it's a first year run, 1973. (Crosman site says 1973 to 1980). So it is likely a 1973, & the 9,857th one built up to that point. If that's the case, it should be more valuable?
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Crosman sais the 70 was made 1974-'80. They also state "If your Crosman airgun was manufactured after July of 1975, the first three or four digits of the serial number indicate the month and year the gun was built. For example if the first three or four digits of the serial number were 1179 or N79 then your gun was manufactured in November of 1979.
If your gun was manufactured prior to July of 1975, you can use the chart below to ascertain the years of manufacture, but you will not be able to ascertain the exact date."
From that, I would think your 70 was made between 1974 and July of 1975.
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Found it again on Crosman.com, Crosman air rifles, page 3 snipped;
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/640x480q90/923/kZOWMr.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/pnkZOWMrj)
Where precisely did you find your listing?
And cover page of diagram .PDF;
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/640x480q90/923/useeb5.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/pnuseeb5j)
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On the Crosman Product Dates page on their site, https://www.crosman.com/discover/crosman/crosman-product-dates (https://www.crosman.com/discover/crosman/crosman-product-dates) Either way I think it's safe to say your gun was made prior to July, '75.
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Getting ERROR 404; not found from your link? But that's where I got mine from, product build dates, Crosman air rifles, top of page 3 as shown? I'll have to look at the other pages? But yeah, with serial number giving build # 9,857, I'm sure it's a first year build.
** After another search of the site, and your link giving an ERROR 404; Not Found, I'm thinking it's possible your link is to the old site. Mine to the new one? https://support.crosman.com/hc/en-us/sections/200658060-Crosman-Air-Rifles?page=1#articles
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Sorry, the period at the end of the link caused the prob. It works now.
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Now that's odd? They give two different start dates in two different places on the same site? My listing is from their Manuals & diagrams .PDF listing. Yours is from Production dates. So which one is right, I wonder? 1973, or 1974? At any rate, I think the four zero's at the beginning of my serial # indicate first year, 9,857th one completed. That's about as much as anyone, even Tom Slocum, could/can surmise. I'd still like to know for sure though? First year build would be more collectable. And would be my 4th variant 1 I've collected. Among the 160 Pellgun, variant 1, 1955-56. 760 Powermaster variant 1, June 1970. Model 70 Pellgun variant 1, 1974? And the 66AB Powermaster, June 1986, variant 1, revision B.
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/640x480q90/924/UECNFh.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/poUECNFhj)
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/640x480q90/921/r94ye6.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/plr94ye6j)
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/640x480q90/921/7jibEM.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/pl7jibEMj)
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/640x480q90/921/pgyXQw.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/plpgyXQwj)
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You may have already seen this, but Nick at Another Airgun Blog did a nice 3 part article on the 70. Reading elsewhere it seems caution has to be used when piercing the cartridge...
The AAB articles:
http://anotherairgunblog.blogspot.com/2009/05/messing-with-crosman-model-70-part-1.html (http://anotherairgunblog.blogspot.com/2009/05/messing-with-crosman-model-70-part-1.html)
http://anotherairgunblog.blogspot.com/2009/05/messing-with-crosman-model-70-part-2.html (http://anotherairgunblog.blogspot.com/2009/05/messing-with-crosman-model-70-part-2.html)
http://anotherairgunblog.blogspot.com/2009/05/messing-with-crosman-model-70-part-3.html (http://anotherairgunblog.blogspot.com/2009/05/messing-with-crosman-model-70-part-3.html)
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Nice blog for seeing the details I'll need to know when restoring this one. Very oddball gas valve? Never saw one like that? Was hoping it was upgradable? Seals will undoubtedly. Gotta practice with my new checkering starter set too. 18LPI, just like Winchester used on the pre-64 model 70's.
I pulled a vintage powerlet out of the model 70 when cleaning it. Putting in a new 12g Co2 cartridge was easy and no leaks! Just push the lever plate straight back in with no hesitations seemed to work fine for me.
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/640x480q90/922/scKEff.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/pmscKEffj)
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Well, my botched-up order from Optics Planet came in today. Got my Hawke mid-rise dovetail scope mounts. Gonna swap the Centerpoint 3-9x32 mildot scope off the GuideHawk NP to the model 70 with the mid-rise Hawke mounts. They'll be substantially lower than the Gamo site-through high mounts. So parallax will be improved and looks as well.
** I also have found the trigger pull is way too heavy for a light, balanced rifle like this! So I'm going to find a way to lighten it. There's an old hardware store in Sheffield Lake that carries a large amount of different springs & tensions. I might have to check with him?
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/640x480q90/923/Mfpcr7.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/pnMfpcr7j)
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/640x480q90/924/BIC2PV.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/poBIC2PVj)
And with the mid-rise Hawke mounts & Centerpoint 3-9x32 mildot scope off the GuideHawk NP;
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/640x480q90/922/wUa81q.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/pmwUa81qj)
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Here's the diagram for the model 70 from Crosman's site. The trigger assembly looks like it has only one spring? But feels really tight & heavy! I'll have to start with a polish & lube tune.
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/1024x768q90/921/h0WrjZ.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/plh0WrjZj)
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Got the seal kit ordered from Baker's and a couple other tools I need to start practicing to do the Model 70 Standard checkering on this one. Figured I might as well reseal it while I have it apart to refinish the alloy breech/trigger block. That and the stock restomod will be the biggest part of the job.
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I ordered the seal kit on the 27th and it's here already by priority mail! Wife picked up the flexible stainless steel ruler I needed for the checkering job too.
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/640x480q90/924/JOFGfc.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/poJOFGfcj)
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/640x480q90/924/Pnudn9.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/poPnudn9j)
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/640x480q90/923/9L38nW.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/pn9L38nWj)
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I got the Winchester 4x32AO scope & Hawke mid-rise mounts in today. So they went on the Model 70. Being a copy of the Winchester model 70 Ranger (base model) made adding a Winchester scope apropos. It has markings to adjust down to 15 and 30 feet ( 5yds & 10yds respectively) before switching to the usual yard markings. That'll prove very handy I'm sure?
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/640x480q90/924/e1sY8V.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/poe1sY8Vj)
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I agree. Leather seals are extremely durable. A little oil in the pump chamber,move the gun around and ....presto....I've brought a few pistols back to life this way.Sold as not working/parts then the oil trick and you have a working piece.....