GTA
All Springer/NP/PCP Air Gun Discussion General => Machine Shop Talk & AG Parts Machining => Wood Chop Shop (Working with wood) => Topic started by: Nomadic Pirate on July 02, 2018, 06:52:19 PM
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I'm planning to make a rifle stock, it will be a laminate.
I think one of the woods will be Poplar ( but much depends on what I find )
I don't want to use expensive woods because I might well screw it up so I don't want to lose to much money ;D ;D
I there woods that shouldn't be used ? ...what about Red Oak ?
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I believe hearing one or most of the oaks promote rust when near steel, others may correct me if I am mistaken.
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When oak is in contact with steel/iron, it turns black at the point of contact due to a reaction with the tannic acid in the oak.
You can use cheap wood for practice to figure out how to make things fit, then get some better wood like walnut or cherry. I have seen even plywood stocks that looked nice if they used Baltic birch or appleply.
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I agree, do the first run on ply to get the procedure down pat, then move on to the better woods. Remember” measure twice, cut once”.
Mitch
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Drift wood could prove interesting ???
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I made this stock years ago out of Poplar slats,
I only have handtools so it's gonna be a one off, will buy some decent woods but nothing to expensive,.....so Red oak is out, any others ?
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d124/NorthShoreLB/guns/009-5-1.jpg) (http://s34.photobucket.com/user/NorthShoreLB/media/guns/009-5-1.jpg.html)
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d124/NorthShoreLB/guns/008-9-1.jpg) (http://s34.photobucket.com/user/NorthShoreLB/media/guns/008-9-1.jpg.html)
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d124/NorthShoreLB/guns/007-10-1.jpg) (http://s34.photobucket.com/user/NorthShoreLB/media/guns/007-10-1.jpg.html)
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d124/NorthShoreLB/guns/001-14.jpg) (http://s34.photobucket.com/user/NorthShoreLB/media/guns/001-14.jpg.html)
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d124/NorthShoreLB/guns/002-16.jpg) (http://s34.photobucket.com/user/NorthShoreLB/media/guns/002-16.jpg.html)
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d124/NorthShoreLB/guns/007-5.jpg) (http://s34.photobucket.com/user/NorthShoreLB/media/guns/007-5.jpg.html)
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d124/NorthShoreLB/guns/008-6.jpg) (http://s34.photobucket.com/user/NorthShoreLB/media/guns/008-6.jpg.html)
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d124/NorthShoreLB/guns/009-4.jpg) (http://s34.photobucket.com/user/NorthShoreLB/media/guns/009-4.jpg.html)
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Check out laminatedturningblanks.com. Tom
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Not gonna buy a blank !
I will get together slats of 2 different woods and do it myself, just need to know if there's any particular wood I shouls stay away from,
Thanks
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Check out laminatedturningblanks.com. Tom
Btw, sorry if I say this but that stock sure it's ugly :)
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I like the way your poplar looks
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I agree, do the first run on ply to get the procedure down pat, then move on to the better woods. Remember” measure twice, cut once”.
Mitch
”measure twice, cut once”.
Yep, I cut it off twice and it was still too short! :o
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Any kind of Oak will have some amount of tannin in the wood which would cause rust. Poplar, maples, purple heart, beech, myrtle, birch(laminant cut), and walnuts is your best bet. Some of these are expensive but in the are worth working with.
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Considering your location is KOA an option? Kinda pricey here but at the source maybe not so much?
Brian
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If it is going to be laminated you should be open to about any kind. That is one of the original ideas behind laminated stocks. You could use cheaper/smaller pieces of wood and still have a stronger stock less prone to warping than a solid wood stock. The glue/resin should help insulate the wood from the gun to minimize contamination problems.
Gary
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Considering your location is KOA an option? Kinda pricey here but at the source maybe not so much?
Brian
KOA super expensive here too unfortunately,
have to go to the archery store this week and there's a wood shop nearby I will check, if the slats are to expensive LOWES is on my way back :)
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Any kind of Oak will have some amount of tannin in the wood which would cause rust. Poplar, maples, purple heart, beech, myrtle, birch(laminant cut), and walnuts is your best bet. Some of these are expensive but in the are worth working with.
Thanks
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I'm planning to make a rifle stock, it will be a laminate.
I think one of the woods will be Poplar ( but much depends on what I find )
I don't want to use expensive woods because I might well screw it up so I don't want to lose to much money ;D ;D
I there woods that shouldn't be used ? ...what about Red Oak ?
I know you mentioned making a laminated stock, however I'm wondering if there is a "downed Hawaiian tree suitable for a gun stock" to be found?
Years ago when living in West Virginia a friend living in Virginia had a large hollow walnut tree fall over his driveway. When I was told about it I asked is I could have the upturned stump and he agreed. Here is what I ended up with after completely filing down my chainsaw teeth by sharpening...........
(https://i.imgur.com/6gTUbR3l.jpg)(https://i.imgur.com/65qc0sCl.jpg)(https://i.imgur.com/DIkPX2fl.jpg)
LOL....after removing his stump I thanked him but wished he had left another 4" on the stump when he cleared the tree from his driveway. The end grain was sealed when first slabbed and it's been seasoning upstairs in my garage for over 10 years so it should be good for making a walnut stock for both my Beeman R9 and HW95.
Anywhoo.......perhaps there is the possibility of finding "good expensive stock wood" from downed trees "in the islands" but I have no idea of your situation.
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I have no tools to inlet a chunk of wood to fit the action in,
the reason I'll be using slats is because I can build the stock around the gun like I did with those Poplar slats and the DAQ
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Yep, I cut it off twice and it was still too short! :o
That is a great line! I'm gonna have to remember that.
Have you considered trying "Chinese Mystery Wood"?
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Finally, a touch of honesty! Tom
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I have no tools to inlet a chunk of wood to fit the action in,
the reason I'll be using slats is because I can build the stock around the gun like I did with those Poplar slats and the DAQ
Makes sense!
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I'm also in the process of making a stock- I'm just going to be using Home Depot's higher quality plywood for the build. I'm going to laminate them together. Later I'll hydro dip it. I've been meaning to try my hand at it. Besides, the hydro dip will both protect the stock, and hide any mistakes! ;D
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I'm also in the process of making a stock- I'm just going to be using Home Depot's higher quality plywood for the build. I'm going to laminate them together. Later I'll hydro dip it. I've been meaning to try my hand at it. Besides, the hydro dip will both protect the stock, and hide any mistakes! ;D
Cool, you gonna show the process ?
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I'm also in the process of making a stock- I'm just going to be using Home Depot's higher quality plywood for the build. I'm going to laminate them together. Later I'll hydro dip it. I've been meaning to try my hand at it. Besides, the hydro dip will both protect the stock, and hide any mistakes! ;D
Cool, you gonna show the process ?
These of any help?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ednVDfBoVL0 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ednVDfBoVL0)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tkp9gn2koXM (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tkp9gn2koXM)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XQn5PdM5mbw (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XQn5PdM5mbw)
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I use Titebond III for my glue ups,
Been thinking how to do it and I have some pretty good Idea, on paper I think I can pull it off, but reality might be different :)
if I remember correctly LOWES has maple too, we'll see when I get to the stores what I can find.
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I'm also in the process of making a stock- I'm just going to be using Home Depot's higher quality plywood for the build. I'm going to laminate them together. Later I'll hydro dip it. I've been meaning to try my hand at it. Besides, the hydro dip will both protect the stock, and hide any mistakes! ;D
Cool, you gonna show the process ?
That's the plan Manny!! I just have to pick up a band saw, and I'll be in business! I'm kind of building the stock like you, as I'm not a stock maker, and I have no skills in inletting...
nced- The first vid is one of the videos that made me feel capable of making a stock in the first place...
Here's a few more:
https://youtu.be/lgHwMVfnfjw
https://youtu.be/aqwhcfQZT8U
The skinning one is one you should take a gander at Manny! This is something I'm really considering doing, before I do the hydro dip...
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Ok, seriously now. Ash, Alder,Maple, Cherry,Walnut all hardwoods in varying degrees of hardness ,all will stain evenly without special preparation and have very little reactive tannin. Beech, Birch and Poplar are hardwoods but are softer, no tannin, Birch takes stain very well, Beech will need a conditioner to stabilize the grain to accept stain. Poplar sometimes will also need prep, your other stock is a good example of Poplar that took stain well. (Marauder stock, Chinese Beech needs prep to maintain consistent color). By "slats" I will assume you are referring to 3/4" thick boards to laminate to a 1 1/2" or 2 1/4" layup. Stay away from Teak,Mahogany, anything with high fragrance (sandalwood, cured pine) softwoods like cedar ,fir,larch. Frost Hardwood in San Diego has a website where you can see all these, they may ship to you. Go high end and use Koa, Ebony and Ribbon Maple for a colorful laminate, maybe a splash of Rosewood at the schnauble and Zebrawood at the grip. The ugly stock in previous post is a laminate made of Birch veneers stained under pressure for color throughout the veneer. I think Asian manufacture. Enjoy. Tom
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Ok, seriously now. Ash, Alder,Maple, Cherry,Walnut all hardwoods in varying degrees of hardness ,all will stain evenly without special preparation and have very little reactive tannin. Beech, Birch and Poplar are hardwoods but are softer, no tannin, Birch takes stain very well, Beech will need a conditioner to stabilize the grain to accept stain. Poplar sometimes will also need prep, your other stock is a good example of Poplar that took stain well. (Marauder stock, Chinese Beech needs prep to maintain consistent color). By "slats" I will assume you are referring to 3/4" thick boards to laminate to a 1 1/2" or 2 1/4" layup. Stay away from Teak,Mahogany, anything with high fragrance (sandalwood, cured pine) softwoods like cedar ,fir,larch. Frost Hardwood in San Diego has a website where you can see all these, they may ship to you. Go high end and use Koa, Ebony and Ribbon Maple for a colorful laminate, maybe a splash of Rosewood at the schnauble and Zebrawood at the grip. The ugly stock in previous post is a laminate made of Birch veneers stained under pressure for color throughout the veneer. I think Asian manufacture. Enjoy. Tom
Thanks, good post,
Not planning on staining, will finish the stock either with Tung oil or spey on Polyurathane.
I was thinking if I can find 1/8" slats I go that way, that would be exeptional, I would be happy with 1/4" but I guess I'll take what I get :)
Would love to do a Purple heart/Poplar combo or something similar.
If it wasn't so expensive I would love to do one in Zebrawood,
I did this one for my 1st Marauder pistol
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d124/NorthShoreLB/guns/008-7.jpg) (http://s34.photobucket.com/user/NorthShoreLB/media/guns/008-7.jpg.html)
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d124/NorthShoreLB/guns/002-19.jpg) (http://s34.photobucket.com/user/NorthShoreLB/media/guns/002-19.jpg.html)
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d124/NorthShoreLB/guns/001-17.jpg) (http://s34.photobucket.com/user/NorthShoreLB/media/guns/001-17.jpg.html)
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d124/NorthShoreLB/guns/003-15.jpg) (http://s34.photobucket.com/user/NorthShoreLB/media/guns/003-15.jpg.html)
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d124/NorthShoreLB/guns/004-14.jpg) (http://s34.photobucket.com/user/NorthShoreLB/media/guns/004-14.jpg.html)
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d124/NorthShoreLB/guns/005-14.jpg) (http://s34.photobucket.com/user/NorthShoreLB/media/guns/005-14.jpg.html)
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d124/NorthShoreLB/guns/007-8.jpg) (http://s34.photobucket.com/user/NorthShoreLB/media/guns/007-8.jpg.html)
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OK big question now,
Been looking at prices online and I don't think there's anyway I can get any quality woods, so....
I'm thinking I will do a Poplar Red oak combo, again so basically the only problem with Red oak is that it will turn dark with the matal contact ?
if that's it I can live with it,.....thanks in advance for the responses
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OK big question now,
Been looking at prices online and I don't think there's anyway I can get any quality woods, so....
I'm thinking I will do a Poplar Red oak combo, again so basically the only problem with Red oak is that it will turn dark with the matal contact ?
if that's it I can live with it,.....thanks in advance for the responses
"it will turn dark with the metal contact"
The darkness is corrosion. Is it possible to seal oak sufficiently to prevent tannic acid from passing through the coating to the steel in a humid environment...........I really don't know. I do know that my brother coats his R9 action in a layer of RIG before attaching the stock to prevent rusting. While I'm a "fair weather hunter" my brother occasionally gets "rained on" when hunting tree squirrels in West Virginia or the "old home place" in Virginia. Perhaps this would be a solution to "oak wood rusting of steel".
https://www.brownells.com/gun-cleaning-chemicals/oils-lubricants/rust-prevention/rig-universal-gun-grease-prod31842.aspx (https://www.brownells.com/gun-cleaning-chemicals/oils-lubricants/rust-prevention/rig-universal-gun-grease-prod31842.aspx)
From the above...........
"Clean, Easy-To-Apply Grease Protects Your Firearms From Rust.
Long-known and highly respected by shooters, this clean, viscous grease is easy to apply to your pet gun and provides absolute rust prevention during long-term storage. One thorough application of a thin film will protect your rifle, handgun, shotgun, or muzzleloader from rust and corrosion."
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Thanks, I got it now in my Amazon cart,
How about painting the inside of the stock with a rust preventer ?
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An other question,
Lets say I find 1/8" slats of Poplar, if I soak them in stain for days will that stain go all the way inside the wood ?
Thanks
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An other question,
Lets say I find 1/8" slats of Poplar, if I soak them in stain for days will that stain go all the way inside the wood ?
Thanks
Yep it will.
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Even faster if you apply pressure.
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Rather than stain, you might want to consider wood dye.
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Rather than stain, you might want to consider wood dye.
I was reading that Rit dye and drano works good,
How about Rit dye and stain ?
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Something else I was thinking about,
Lets say I get a bunch of Poplar slats, I stain them befoire gluing them and even if the stain doesn't go all the way through I will still get the 2 tone effect as I shape the stock right ?
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You will end up with thin lines of color and wide bands of white (assuming poplar.)
Heat, pressure, steam, and a wood with generous pores to accept the dye or stain will guarantee the color will be consistent all the way through each slat.
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You will end up with thin lines of color and wide bands of white (assuming poplar.)
Heat, pressure, steam, and a wood with generous pores to accept the dye or stain will guarantee the color will be consistent all the way through each slat.
Yeah, was afraid of that.
how about using Rit-dye ?
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To test your theories without breaking the bank, buy some popsicle sticks. You can try different stains, dyes, pressures, color schemes, etc. and see what the end result might be before moving up to the bigger, costlier pieces.
You can also see how the adhesives will hold with the additives and shape to see if you got the desired color pattern.
I've never tried RIT. I have heard that certain colors may not turn out the correct shade, or desired shade.
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So really the best way is to be able to buy 2 different woods, hopefully I can find them,....still kinda wanna risk with using red oak :)
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Another idea that might be appealing would be to check with cabinet shops for scraps. It might be cheaper than buying whole planks.
If you get enough different types/colors, you can cut them to a uniform size and glue them up. When you start carving you could get a checkerboard pattern, or cut the pieces in the center in the shape of an eagle so that when you removed the wood from the sides, the eagle would show through as a solid piece.
Alot of these I have done with plexiglass and they turned out pretty good. Wood patterning gave a different effect, and was very dependent on the glue used for structural integrity.
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......Plexiglass,
Now that's an other idea,....How about a laminate made of Poplar and some kind of dark plastic sheets or plexiglass ? I might have to look at possibilities like that when I go to LOWES
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It would be unique with a glowing line of color. Would just need a glue that would bond them together solidly. The Lowe's here only has clear and frosted plexi. I haven't checked out the hobby stores lately to see what they have.
Clear painted black on both sides and then sanded down should give a translucent black line. I think it would have a neat 3D appearance.
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Something to think about :)
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Just made this laminate stock from Lowes poplar.
It's for a CCS 2400KT I have ordered.
Has a coat of oil on it but I plan to finish it with truck bed spray paint.
BTW, if you put poplar in the sun the green will turn light brown.
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I would wonder if paint on plexiglass would maintain its bond over time. Maybe use a tinted epoxy instead. You could scuff-up the plexiglass lightly with some 150 grit to insure bonding.
pv
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Maybe a solid plexiglass stock? :o
Invisible gun... ;D
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Manny
A friend of mine was into DIY stocks, I seen him use a food saver Vacuum sealer,
he would color/stain his 1/8" wood slabs/slates with excess material,
then put them in a long bag 6+ " longer than the overall length of the wood,
then vacuum the bag, stopping and sealing the bag when he saw the liquid come past the ends of the wood etc.
He had a very uniform coloration to the wood, as the vacuum sucked the stain/dye into the wood pores etc.
I wish, I had taken him up on his offer to make a stock for me.
Tia,
Don
An other question,
Lets say I find 1/8" slats of Poplar, if I soak them in stain for days will that stain go all the way inside the wood ?
Thanks
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Get yourself a sheet of furniture grade Baltic Birch Plywood! ;)
Takes stain great. You can cut your slats as long or as short as you want. Try 1/4 inch thick.
Plexiglass will need to be roughed up and will cost more.
Whatever you do, share it here! :D
-Y
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OK, Got it!.....Search GTA....=>....Measure twice...=>...Cut once....=> Sand to fit.
Having skipped the first step, I wanted to have a first try at making some grips that fit my hand. I had some leftover oak (Lowes) that was the right size. I'm happy with the results except.. well.. I now read this thread.
So, the 2240 grip frame is not steel, if I chamfer the grip slightly away from the tube, do the corrosion concerns go away? I kind of like the light color contrast, would sealing it with satin urethane solve the corrosion problem as well? These were meant to be my trial grips, but they came out well enough that I want to use them for a while, maybe carve on them a bit more to refine the fit.
This is a great thread, perhaps make it a sticky?