GTA
All Springer/NP/PCP Air Gun Discussion General => Air Guns And Related Accessories Review Gates => Air Gun Review Gate => Topic started by: Privateer on November 11, 2016, 09:19:00 PM
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Just received the MACR made by Inovairtech today.
I'll be looking at this and giving MY honest thoughts and observations in an on going way.
I know it will never be a 200 FPE type Air Gun and that's OK with me.
I bought it used so I have no obligation to pull any punches.
If it can be improved in any area? I'll be doing it and explaining why I did it.
The reason I bought this is several fold.
The cool factor. I'm a sucker for that and admit it. Had a few SMG .22's due to that.
The two barrels that came with it. .257 and .357
The power range. It's well within my power needs and the range I have to shoot.
The cartridges. As I still hand pump? It's within my ability and equipment to handle right now.
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1st step was the visual inspection after unpacking.
Now this thing came heavy! 37 pounds of heavy in the box!
It was well packed but UPS managed to shatter the extending butt stock.
I had planned to replace that anyway so that is not an issue to me.
I can say from my point of view? You'd be hard pressed to find a cheaper, no frills butt stock.
Maybe it's an Air Soft version? Can't say but it is not Military grade from what I can see.
The Magazine was my next look.
Made of metal and delrin not to bad.
I am a bit leary of the slop in it. Then the pins to hold the bottom part in place!
Those pins are just waiting to pop out! No retension guards of any kind.
No shoulder, no clip, nothing. I had to push 2 back in place just after unpacking.
More on the mag later.
Bolt.
Slop. Lots of slop.
My main concern is when the Gun is not cocked. The bolt slides forwards and backwards about 2.5 inches.
No type locking to stop that so you have clatter when not cocked.
The bolt also has some slop side to side/up down. I'll be adding buttons for that.
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How do you add buttons to a bolt?
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How do you add buttons to a bolt?
That is one thing I'll be posting about.
This is not a PB bolt so there are differences if your thinking of those.
I'll need to tear it down to really decide how I want to do it.
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I took the magazine apart today to do some work.
(http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n12/privateer_2006/Air%20Rifles/MACR/100_1826.jpg)
Here you can see that the pins that hold the bottom on can and do move.
(http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n12/privateer_2006/Air%20Rifles/MACR/100_1822.jpg)
The Delrin parts are injection molded.
(http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n12/privateer_2006/Air%20Rifles/MACR/100_1827.jpg)
The pins are intended to be an interference fit is my guess.
Now I don't intend to crawl a mile with this in a Drag bag but it's an issue if the Gun bounces up and down in a Van going to Kentucky.
My thought is to add a spring and ball to the end pins to lock them in place and a rare earth magnet for the center pin.
I'll also do some shape work as you can see in this pic the ends extend to far!
(http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n12/privateer_2006/Air%20Rifles/MACR/100_1825.jpg)
Side to side is sloppy at the bottom also so I'll add something there to take care of that.
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Thanks for the review Jeff
Will be following your progress on the rifle.
Dave
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While I get things together for the magazine here's some shots of a cartridge apart.
The red looking dots are Jim's Old school buttons for a scale.
(http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n12/privateer_2006/Air%20Rifles/MACR/100_1831.jpg)
(http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n12/privateer_2006/Air%20Rifles/MACR/100_1833.jpg)
And if your wondering if that little Cartridge holds air good?
OH YEA! It does!!
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I wanted to tighten up the part of the magazine the cartridges are pushed by.
There was a .075 overall gap. I reduced that to .055 overall.
Another use for Jim's Old skool buttons!
;D
(http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n12/privateer_2006/Air%20Rifles/MACR/Jim-Old-skool.jpg)
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Thank you for photos Jeff
I was wondering what the inside of the cartridge looked like.
Very interesting.
Dave
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Very interesting indeed!
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Hand pumped a few times so far with the G6 pump.
26 pumps put me at 3000 PSI.
18 pumps puts me at a hair under 2000 PSI.
Pumping is VERY easy!!
;D
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Easy hand pumping is a definite plus... I can't wait to see some numbers, groups, and pictures of the finished product!
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I have to get some money built up to get some better rounds to really test with.
All I have is JSB .25 25 grn pellets right now.
Not the best to give a good review.
I will put them over the Chony just to see what it tells us.
Right now? I don't have a lot of faith in them judging from the PB type reports.
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Here's the .357 barrel.
(http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n12/privateer_2006/Air%20Rifles/MACR/100_1835.jpg)
Looks cool until you really look at things.
Let's take a closer look at the Air Stripper.
(http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n12/privateer_2006/Air%20Rifles/MACR/100_1836.jpg)
(http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n12/privateer_2006/Air%20Rifles/MACR/100_1837.jpg)
Seems to me that's nothing more then a giant hunk of whatever hanging on the end of the barrel with no functioning value beyond the hype selling angle.
Perhaps it reduces recoil by 70%?
This Gun would be better off with a Rocker1 LDC in a lot of ways!
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LOL! That's a serious "air stripper" for sure right there :(
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So I pulled that Stripper off the .357 barrel today.
One set screw holds it on and then things get interesting!
The actual barrel is inside the big silver looking part.
OK. Was kind of thinking the barrel was a liner but it's a hefty barrel.
The outer sleeve is mostly show and does the part of allowing the cartridge to seat.
Still not sure how the barrel is seated in the outer part.
I suspect maybe threaded but still need to get it apart to really know for sure.
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So the barrel fits tight in the outer shell or is there space between the barrel and shell? I never would have guessed it was two pieces.
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It has a small area around the barrel.
So the silver outer part is almost like shroud.
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Perhaps they're just using a TJ liner as intended?
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Perhaps they're just using a TJ liner as intended?
OK. That sounds reasonable.
:D
Here's a picture.
(http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n12/privateer_2006/Air%20Rifles/MACR/100_1841.jpg)
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that is a WEIRD setup... At least it's better than that MODOC rifle, using an ALUMINIUM barrel... yeesh.
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I've been interested in the air cartridge rifles for a while . Not a whole lot of info from people who have bought them . Looking forward to this thread .
that is a WEIRD setup... At least it's better than that MODOC rifle, using an ALUMINIUM barrel... yeesh.
I was interested in the MODOC until I found out that it had an aluminum barrel . If they wanted to save weight I'd think they would use a steel barrel liner and an aluminum outer barrel .
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Here's the .357 barrel.
(http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n12/privateer_2006/Air%20Rifles/MACR/100_1835.jpg)
Looks cool until you really look at things.
Let's take a closer look at the Air Stripper.
(http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n12/privateer_2006/Air%20Rifles/MACR/100_1836.jpg)
(http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n12/privateer_2006/Air%20Rifles/MACR/100_1837.jpg)
Seems to me that's nothing more then a giant hunk of whatever hanging on the end of the barrel with no functioning value beyond the hype selling angle.
Perhaps it reduces recoil by 70%?
This Gun would be better off with a Rocker1 LDC in a lot of ways!
Jeff
It appears that the barrel goes all the way to the front of the stripper so that it is really just for show since the air is released past where the strippers holes are at or is the picture not showing us how the air is vented thru the holes in the stripper.
Mike
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That 'Air Stripper' piece is only to keep the outer part centered.
And for it's looks. It serves no other functional purpose.
Here's a pic of the cartridges and how they fit in the breech end.
(http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n12/privateer_2006/Air%20Rifles/MACR/100_1844.jpg)
Here's the breech end.
(http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n12/privateer_2006/Air%20Rifles/MACR/100_1846.jpg)
The .357 and .257 cartridge ends side by side.
(http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n12/privateer_2006/Air%20Rifles/MACR/100_1849.jpg)
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Ok that makes sense then and I guess the shroud is to improve the appearance versus the raw metal barrel it has.
Mike
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Ok that makes sense then and I guess the shroud is to improve the appearance versus the raw metal barrel it has.
Mike
That and the breech end needs to be as it is to align the cartridge to the barrel.
Take a look at the Barracuda by Inovairtech and you see the same thing just a different way of doing it.
I'd like to take the barrel completely out of the outer part but I'm not sure yet exactly how it's mounted in.
The threaded part seems to be a press fit and I don't know if the barrel itself is threaded or pinned in place.
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looking at the pics of the barrels and cartridges I can see what you mean. The outer portion looks to be thicker than just a shroud normally would be so I believe it adds some rigidity to the inner barrel as well as improve the looks.
It would be interesting to see if it is meant to be removed or not and how easy it is to do so as well.
Mike
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IF the inner barrel can be removed without destroying stuff?
Would be easy to make say a true .25 out of it.
Or even a .22 if one wanted.
Granted they don't want you doing that BUT!
Give a Guy a lathe and you can't stop him.
:)
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IF the inner barrel can be removed without destroying stuff?
Would be easy to make say a true .25 out of it.
Or even a .22 if one wanted.
Granted they don't want you doing that BUT!
Give a Guy a lathe and you can't stop him.
:)
You got that right. Its just to hard to leave it alone when it can always be made better IMO. ;D
On a side note how did that dominator that you got from me and had Rocker1 install the 177 barrel in turn out and do you still have it.
Mike
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Rocker1 still has it. I'm in no rush and he is a busy Guy.
;)
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Ok I knew it was awhile ago that you were getting it worked on by him. He does do great work and stays busy I am sure. got a LDC from him and very happy with it also.
Let me know when you get and how it turns out.
Mike
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Speaking of Rocker1
He's sending me some .357 Bullets to test in the MACR.
So I should have some real world numbers soon in .357
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Started some work to quite down the report.
(http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n12/privateer_2006/Air%20Rifles/MACR/100_1851.jpg)
(http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n12/privateer_2006/Air%20Rifles/MACR/100_1852.jpg)
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That is one long air gun! I hope it does well with the numbers. I'm curious to see what kind of energy those little cartridges can make.
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Definitely not a woods or brush gun with that looong barrel. Should produce some good numbers with the cartridges.
Mike
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Started the change to .357 from .257 today.
In less then a minute the .257 barrel is off and the .357 barrel is on.
(http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n12/privateer_2006/Air%20Rifles/MACR/100_1853.jpg)
Here's a couple looks into the breech end with barrel off.
(http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n12/privateer_2006/Air%20Rifles/MACR/100_1854.jpg)
(http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n12/privateer_2006/Air%20Rifles/MACR/100_1855.jpg)
The last step is to change the front of the carts out.
Mine came with cart ends rather then separate carts for each cal.
(http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n12/privateer_2006/Air%20Rifles/MACR/100_1856.jpg)
I'll pump 4 of them to match the PSI Rick lists in his review and use the JSB .35 pellets as he did to see if we match on FPS.
I also have 4 different Bullets from Nielson to test after that.
Special Thanks to Rocker1 and Nielson for those bullets!
At some point I'll need to make a block to charge the carts.
The only way to get 5 carts to the same PSI is to charge them at the same time is my thinking.
Granted I could be wrong but it would be much easier to do it that way.
I have trouble wrapping my head around getting 4500 PSI in each cart with a 4500 PSI tank?
Shouldn't each cart have a lower actual PSI?
The couplers seem to be nothing more then Hydraulic couplers which I can buy local at very good prices.
Being in the Construction business has some perks. ;)
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Don't let that cat watch too much. You wouldn't want it knowing how the guns work,lol! You could also get a good hand pump to top them off/match the charge with if you wanted too.
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I agree, filling a number of them at the time time is the best way to achieve equal fill pressures. Trying to pump them individually to the same pressure is tough because you need to bleed each one after filling at the exact same rate to achieve the same pressure inside them. When filling several at the same time you will bleed off exactly the same with them all, thus increasing your chances of equally filled cartridges.
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The rear 'buffer' tube for the butt stock is a commercial version. Not a Mil-Spec.
Now here's a question.
Given the pressure it takes to arm the bolt can I find a spring that might help do that and not cause to much power needed to pull the bolt back?
Personally I'd prefer a stronger pull into my shoulder then having to grip the gun so tight in a forward motion.
Some type of spring would also cure the bolt from sliding around on it's own.
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Don't let that cat watch too much. You wouldn't want it knowing how the guns work,lol! You could also get a good hand pump to top them off/match the charge with if you wanted too.
Need this book.
(https://scontent.fyhz1-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-0/p206x206/12400744_10153839376466241_3983789279956281298_n.jpg?oh=1004033fa5b4d25f9a07e5603e58dd79&oe=58FA8AE8)
(https://scontent.fyhz1-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/12391075_10153839405971241_4833509720799418434_n.jpg?oh=e41634a54deb75656698dee3bc28e05f&oe=58C9BC56)
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That was great! I just need one for my dog now...
Now, back on topic.... Jeff, what kind of fpe are you expecting the gun to make?
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Jeff, what kind of fpe are you expecting the gun to make?
In .357?
I'm not expecting anything more then the review by Rick Eustler that shows the JSB .35 81 grn at 720 FPS for about 93 FPE.
Or Inovairtechs posted stats with a 125 Grn Bullet at 700 FPS for about 130 FPE.
Now that's with 4500 PSI in the carts.
Given that other brands of PCP sometimes do better with lower PSI per shot?
Who knows. I've not seen shot strings with different PSI's.
And accuracy is more important to me. So if I find 3000 PSI is more accurate then FPE is not that important to me.
After all. How much FPE do I need to kill a beer bottle at 100 yards?
Now the crazy Yote around here? I think I still have enuff FPE for it.
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Tested the cocking force need for the bolt today.
I'm looking at over 40.5 pounds!
I used a very scientific approach.
I attached a 5 gallon bucket to the bolt handle and added water until full.
40.5 pounds was all the bucket would hold and it still did not fully cock the bolt.
This is important to me for several reasons.
1. Would be to add a Gas Spring to assist cocking and deal with the return pull needed.
2. Have a liner actuator built to turn it into a semi-auto.
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A short video with Neilson's 128 grn .357 boattail at 3000 PSI.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0IQIGM1ywfg&feature=youtu.be (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0IQIGM1ywfg&feature=youtu.be)
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Have to take 1 cart apart after a miss fire today.
:o
I did find a video that shows the same miss fire on a MAC30.
I'm wondering if it was a false fill in both cases.
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Have to take 1 cart apart after a miss fire today.
:o
I did find a video that shows the same miss fire on a MAC30.
I'm wondering if it was a false fill in both cases.
As in accidental discharge? Was it in the gun or before loading? Hope there wasn't a pellet.
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Both my miss fire and the one I saw in a review were loaded in the gun and fired.
The rounds never left the carts.
That is what makes me wonder if it was a faulty fill.
I'll find the video I saw and post a link to the time his happened.
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Did it sound like air came out? I had it once where apparently I didn't release the air from the cart quick enough when I filled it and it must have all escaped on the bleed. Since it isn't a very large "tank" to begin it is difficult to determine when this happens.
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I had just changed over to the .357 heads so I wonder if it kind of jammed and bleed out on the first fill as you describe.
Second fill it worked fine.
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A video we did today.
https://youtu.be/Avhm6cvkuc8 (https://youtu.be/Avhm6cvkuc8)
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Sounds good to me. Did you get all the bugs worked out yet.
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Hi,
I'm having some trouble searching for the coupler to refill the cartridge...
inovairtech website is down, i emailed them and they say the coupler is currently out of stock.
Its been half year already and they are still out of stock...
I would love to ask if there is any place where i can get the coupler?
or the full spec of the coupler so i can go find a shop to purchase it?
have 7 cartridge but no coupler to refill....
been half year already since my previous coupler broke.
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So I got a chance to pick up the MAC 35 the other day new in box along with 12 cartridges. It has been inside storage so in very good shape no rust in barrel. I have been researching this thing for some time found out I have the newer G7 cartridges so happy about that.. I did get to put a couple of rounds thru it and after a few tweaks to the trigger assembly, fire lap the barrel the MAC should be a welcome addition to my collection. I have torn the MAC down and have began to refine the things that are needed mainly trigger setup, and barrel refinement. Have a idea for the cartridge to increase volume a bit will post updates. I know this thread is old but these air rifles have potential as a good 50 yard tack driver.
Bluekaci I have a line on the fill couplers PM and I will send you supplier.
March18 2019 Got the barrel back from my GS had him do a good cleaning and re-crown, there was some rust in there from it sitting from previous owner. He got it cleaned up and recrown, it as the original crowning job was not very good. He did a great job, it looks darn good. Almost done with trigger redesign, i did not like the spring and pin setup on the sear. The new mods seem to be working I will be getting the MAC reassembled hopefully get it to the range by weeks end.
3/23 Took the MAC out to the range today to see how she does with the changes that we have been working on. I must say I am quite pleased with the results, at 50 yds she was very accurate see image of target. using 3000 to 4000psi in the cartridge and a 89 grain pellet 890fps. With the work and some adjustments this has turned out to be one of my favorites. Let face no tank = way more fun at the range and less to haul around. This is a beautiful air gun when setup properly and making a few modest changes to the trigger. I went nuts on the barrel I wanted it as close to perfect as possible. So far the modifications have proven that is a very nice 50 yd air gun and I am glad that I made the purchase, while I know there are detractors on here if you take the time to clean up the machining and rough quality control you will end up with a very nice air gun, And lets face it how many people can say they own a cartridge firing air gun.