GTA
All Springer/NP/PCP Air Gun Discussion General => PCP/CO2/HPA Air Gun Gates "The Darkside" => Topic started by: fatmatic on July 15, 2016, 01:07:03 PM
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A lightweight, short carbine or bullpup that is quiet and accurate, multishot, gets about 20FPE over 60 shots per fill that doesn't cost $1000+
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If you can't find one, you might be able to find somebody to build one for you. A bottled Crosman platform with the right gunsmithing could meet those requirements fairly easily and leave some money in your wallet. Nice looking furniture would run the cost up, but otherwise it looks very achievable.
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Well it would have to be tuned down from 30fpe but the P12 is close
to what you describe and if you can get it on sale or used the
Taipan mutant is perfect just a tad over budget.
You can also find used crickets for under $1000.
Though I wish someone would make a bullpup similar to Hatsan
but not more than 7lbs for the rifle alone.
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Well it would have to be tuned down from 30fpe but the P12 is close
to what you describe and if you can get it on sale or used the
Taipan mutant is perfect just a tad over budget.
You can also find used crickets for under $1000.
Though I wish someone would make a bullpup similar to Hatsan
but not more than 7lbs for the rifle alone.
I've seen the mutant short which is 25fpe and can probably be detuned but +1200 dollars is too much for me to spend.
Nervoustrigger... can you point me to some threads that may have what I am looking for?
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Check out BWaltonpcp.com; he has a couple of tuned bullpups and videos of what they can do. They are UNDER $1000 and put out more power then you're looking for. Regulated and get decent shot count. Not sure about 60, though. Better price and more power then you were originally looking for, but you can't get CLOSE to this quality at that price...
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Is this too much to ask for?
A lightweight, short carbine or bullpup that is quiet and accurate, multishot, gets about 20FPE over 60 shots per fill that doesn't cost $1000+
Sadly, I believe the answer currently is "yes" it is not currently available (at that price limit).
It reminds me of this common saying:
(http://www.moonlightcreative.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/GoodFastCheap.jpg)
I bet a 22 Cricket would make you happy, but they are over your price limit.
Ray
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I'm with wildcatter on a rifle from Baxter. His work is tough to beat. The only possible rub I anticipate is the weight.
In terms of a custom rig based on a Crosman rifle, I was picturing what is essentially a Prod bottle conversion, perhaps with the bottle at the rear. Should be enough money left on the table for a barrel upgrade if the Crosman barrel isn't up to snuff.
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RayK - So true!!
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The only thing stopping you from getting a gun that can meet all your requirements is the last thing you listed. So the way I see it you have two options.
Either save up to get the funds to be able to buy a high end gun that would have and be all you want
or
Start by reevaluating your criterion with regard to all the others. How light do you want it? How dead set are you on that shot count? Is there any wiggle room up or down on the power requirement?
For under a grand, I would suggest a tuned at44 in a bull pup stock. But going that route you will spend almost your whole budget.
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I have a really sweet Evanix Rainstorm .22 thats been regulated and finely tuned going up for sale shortly.
There a carbine too.
New there @ 8 bills and my regulated & tuned one @ 5
Watch the classified or PM me if interested ???
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Motorhead's got a good deal, there and knows his stuff. I'm a BWalton guy - he's done some stuff to my FX Wildcat and has my BT65 .30 Carnivore right now; love what he does. His stuff will be under $1000 and crazy good, but Motorhead may have just come up with a do not miss deal for you....
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I just PMed motorhead :o
But I am still intrigued by something like this as well that I found back in the archive: http://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=94536.msg884822#msg884822 (http://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=94536.msg884822#msg884822)
Its got the power and the shot count.
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I just PMed motorhead :o
But I am still intrigued by something like this as well that I found back in the archive: http://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=94536.msg884822#msg884822 (http://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=94536.msg884822#msg884822)
Its got the power and the shot count.
yea ... and with a WILD ES figure that WOULD NOT equal a consistent POI over those 85 shots :P :P
Just sayin ...
What ever route you go ... if you want a consistent POI start to finish of a fill you need to get ES figures inside 30-40 fps for a non regulated gun and expect ES figures of 10-15 from a regulated gun.
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This is a home build with the regulated 1200psi 13 ci bottle am getting 130 shots at 20 fpe(depending on pellet) at a weight of just over 6lbs with the scope .This will be close to a grand . Start with a disco and a BNM breech in your desired caliber and work your way from there. From mild to wild , your imagination and wallet are the only things that will stop you.
Great way to learn about the internals and get exactly what you want.
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Repeater
short and/or bullpup
light weight
quiet
accurate
60 shots at 20 foot pounds
under $1000
Basically 7 requirements. After thinking about it (and some of the recommendations) getting 5 or even 6 of the 7 requirements isn't all that hard...but getting all 7 at once is a challenge.
Maybe if you define "light weight".
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Yeah I know it's a lot to ask for, especially the money part. I do like the idea of the prod w a bottle as the butt of the gun but not sure how feasible that is. If only the talons were repeaters w the high shot counts then that would be ideal but it's a lot to ask for.
All ideas and comments are welcomed though. I like the researching part of this sport, makes it fun. The only thing is I don't have the know how or tools to tinker but the knowledge is great.
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For me, digging into questions like yours often leads me to re-thinking myown urges. So researching reasonably priced rifles with as many of the features as you wanted got me to looking at a lot of the new toys out there.
HAven't found anything over the counter that would cover all 7 of your wants. 60 shots at 20 foot pounds doesn't go well with light weight (here I'll just assume under 8 pounds scoped and ready to go...so call it 6.5 to 7 pounds naked).
Bullpups turn out to be surprizingly heavy for such stumpy rifles...esp ones that can manage 60 shots @ 20foot pounds.
Yeah...I could "cheat". Actually find .25's get quite efficient and quiet when only tossing pellets out at low-low speeds (but still making it to 20 foot pounds)...but somehow I suspect that the idea of soft-balling 31gr at 540-550fps wouldn't "do it".
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Having spent a lot of time playing with and tuning on my Bullboss, I can tell you it can do everything you want, except the weight part. The hammer tension on that gun has so much adjustment, you could probably make it shoot 15 fpe if you wanted. Throw a regulator in, and you're still well under the $1000 mark.
The weight part can be potentially made better by swapping to a short cylinder and a standard QE(not long) barrel/shroud. I'm pretty sure those barrel parts would be an easy direct replacement, and I know the short cylinder works on it. That would take over half a pound off of it, and make it a hair over 33" long. Either way, the difference in shouldering it compared to the standard long gun is night and day.
I only bring that up, because I've been messing with mine since I got it to see what all it is capable of doing. It is capable of being made to do almost anything you want, but again, not light weight.
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This one ticked all the boxes:
(http://i920.photobucket.com/albums/ad47/abbababbaccc/sidelever-2_zpsfd93743d.jpg) (http://s920.photobucket.com/user/abbababbaccc/media/sidelever-2_zpsfd93743d.jpg.html)
80+ shots at 20 fpe, really quiet, light, front cocking, free floating BSA barrel, 10 shot magazine. Bought a used Gamo Dynamax for 200 eur, added some misc. parts + lots of sweat and curses and turned it in to a bullpup for around 300 eur total. I'm actually going to use that stock and rail system for another bullpup build shortly. What you could do is to buy a used Gamo Dynamax or BSA Scorpion and then buy a bullpup kit for that from guntuning. Total cost should be around 600-800$.
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This one ticked all the boxes:
(http://i920.photobucket.com/albums/ad47/abbababbaccc/sidelever-2_zpsfd93743d.jpg) (http://s920.photobucket.com/user/abbababbaccc/media/sidelever-2_zpsfd93743d.jpg.html)
80+ shots at 20 fpe, really quiet, light, front cocking, free floating BSA barrel, 10 shot magazine. Bought a used Gamo Dynamax for 200 eur, added some misc. parts + lots of sweat and curses and turned it in to a bullpup for around 300 eur total. I'm actually going to use that stock and rail system for another bullpup build shortly. What you could do is to buy a used Gamo Dynamax or BSA Scorpion and then buy a bullpup kit for that from guntuning. Total cost should be around 600-800$.
How did you get 80 shots out of it and how did it shoot?
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This one ticked all the boxes:
(http://i920.photobucket.com/albums/ad47/abbababbaccc/sidelever-2_zpsfd93743d.jpg) (http://s920.photobucket.com/user/abbababbaccc/media/sidelever-2_zpsfd93743d.jpg.html)
80+ shots at 20 fpe, really quiet, light, front cocking, free floating BSA barrel, 10 shot magazine. Bought a used Gamo Dynamax for 200 eur, added some misc. parts + lots of sweat and curses and turned it in to a bullpup for around 300 eur total. I'm actually going to use that stock and rail system for another bullpup build shortly. What you could do is to buy a used Gamo Dynamax or BSA Scorpion and then buy a bullpup kit for that from guntuning. Total cost should be around 600-800$.
That's nice! So is a Dynamax the same as a BSA Scorpion then? We don't have the Dynamax here in the states that I know of. If you have to start with a Scorpion, then you're looking around $600 out of the gate aren't you? The BSAs are nice shooter from what I hear though.
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How did you get 80 shots out of it and how did it shoot?
Hmm, that 80 shots could have been with extra long tube and 15" barrel - standard tube made 70+ shots at 22 fpe and 15" barrel while the standard barrel is 18.5". Just dialed down the hammer tension and added a blast tamer. Accuracy was normal BSAs sub 1/2" groups at 50M. .22 was too wind sensitive at long range so I later converted it to .25 bolt action with normal stock for BR.
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Indeed most PCP's tuned down to @ 20 ft range will give give you a bunch of shots.
In near equal set up M-rods for instance, at 30 ft lbs @ 40 shots, at 20 ft lbs near 80 shots.
Yup, saving air gives ya more.
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Hatsan Bullboss
It's their lighter bullpup. It's got a shrouded barrel with sound suppression so its nice and quiet. It makes 38 fpe in .22, but can be tuned down pretty easily (or you can get a regulator) to get closer to 20 fpe. 60 shots should be no problem if it's tuned down. It's a repeater style PCP so you've got multiple shots. Pyramyd has it for like $650 I think.
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Hatsan Bullboss is not a bad idea; they seem underpriced for what they can do...
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some very fine suggestions in this thread. Thanks for all the input