GTA
Airguns by Make and Model => AirForce Airguns => Topic started by: LEE IN VA. on January 18, 2016, 04:14:22 PM
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Saw this on Facebook, hope they cut down on the length.
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Saw this on Facebook, hope they cut down on the length.
You forgot to post the link: https://www.facebook.com/AirForceAirguns/?fref=ts (https://www.facebook.com/AirForceAirguns/?fref=ts)
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hooked me on a 357, cause i love my 45 cal Texan,but then again maybe the 308,decisions ,decisions, ;D
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Are they separate and distinct or will there be a barrel change opportunity as in the others, anyone know?
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.308 man that sounds enticing ..... wonder if they borrowed dougs valve design
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I have a feeling it's going to be just like the texan. Long barrel and big numbers with real heavy bullets.
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PA says they will be available the 29th...Im really curious as to what numbers they are putting out and shot count.the site says 350 fps in .357 and 300 fpe in 308.Thats stroking
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"300 FPE in .308"....
What pressure does the Texan run, and how long is the barrel?.... That pretty much eclipses guns like the DAQ at 185 FPE at 3000 psi.... puts it up there with the Extreme....
Bob
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They have it here at the shot show. Should be a big hit...
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Say's 3000 psi.With those numbers I'd guess its the same lay out as the 45. With the 34 inch barrel.I doubt it will reach those numbers though as the same with the 45 not reaching its 500 fpe claim.Well let me clarify that,Ive not heard of anyone touching those numbers but pretty close.470 fpe with a 350 gr which is not bad at all. Not to mention with only 3000 psi.Wonder what they could do with 4000?
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At 3000 psi, even with a 34" barrel.... my guess is ~ 300 FPE in .357 and ~ 225 FPE in .308.... If they get close to their advertised numbers, the bullets will likely be so heavy as to not be worth using....
Bob
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At 3000 psi, even with a 34" barrel.... my guess is ~ 300 FPE in .357 and ~ 225 FPE in .308.... If they get close to their advertised numbers, the bullets will likely be so heavy as to not be worth using....
Bob
Bob, in your estimation, how well would it capitalize on the BC of the caliber? Ideas on ? X caliber in OAL of the projectile?
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PA says they will be available the 29th
I think that's when they will have more .45's in stock. I didn't see anything on the availability of the 308 or 357. I did hear that barrels aren't interchangeable in the 3 big bore calibers.
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I just looked on PA and its changed.Earlier it had the Texan and a box for the .308,.357 and 45.Now it just shows the 45 pre order?Wonder if they got flooded with ?
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"300 FPE in .308"....
What pressure does the Texan run, and how long is the barrel?.... That pretty much eclipses guns like the DAQ at 185 FPE at 3000 psi.... puts it up there with the Extreme....
Bob
It is an AL tank and all the Airforce guns are 3000 psi max....................Carl
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I would optimize the Sectional Density for the barrel length and pressure.... works universally across all calibers, that's the nice thing about SD.... The graph below will show what I'm talking about.... Bear in mind, it's pretty optimistic, consider it a "lofty goal" for PCPs....
(http://i378.photobucket.com/albums/oo221/rsterne/PCP%20Internal%20Ballistics/SecDensvsPresvsLength_zps152829e8.jpg) (http://s378.photobucket.com/user/rsterne/media/PCP%20Internal%20Ballistics/SecDensvsPresvsLength_zps152829e8.jpg.html)
Since you're not interested in just a single shot, but a string (at least a short one), you want to drop down a bit in SD to allow for the pressure at the middle of your shot string.... So for a 3000 psi fill and a 34" barrel, you might choose an SD of 0.20 for the maximum.... If you don't know how SD translates into bullet weight, here is a pair of graphs that show you that....
(http://i378.photobucket.com/albums/oo221/rsterne/PCP%20Internal%20Ballistics/WeightvsSectionalDensity_zps6c1a8dfe.jpg) (http://s378.photobucket.com/user/rsterne/media/PCP%20Internal%20Ballistics/WeightvsSectionalDensity_zps6c1a8dfe.jpg.html)
A bullet with an SD of 0.20 in .308 cal would be about 130 gr.... and in .357 cal about 180 gr.... For .457 cal it would be about 300 gr.... Those are about the maximum weights I would look to using in a 3000 psi PC with a 34" barrel.... Otherwise, your velocity will be lower than ideal, IMO....
Bob
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A bullet with an SD of 0.20 in .308 cal would be about 130 gr.... and in .357 cal about 180 gr.... For .457 cal it would be about 300 gr.... Those are about the maximum weights I would look to using in a 3000 psi PC with a 34" barrel.... Otherwise, your velocity will be lower than ideal, IMO....
Those are some pretty respectably heavy bullets for an airgun considering that even a .308 Winchester isn't optimally shooting over 180 grains or so (after which you want to start looking to the larger 30-06 cartridge).
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I would optimize the Sectional Density for the barrel length and pressure.... works universally across all calibers, that's the nice thing about SD.... The graph below will show what I'm talking about.... Bear in mind, it's pretty optimistic, consider it a "lofty goal" for PCPs....
(http://i378.photobucket.com/albums/oo221/rsterne/PCP%20Internal%20Ballistics/SecDensvsPresvsLength_zps152829e8.jpg) (http://s378.photobucket.com/user/rsterne/media/PCP%20Internal%20Ballistics/SecDensvsPresvsLength_zps152829e8.jpg.html)
Since you're not interested in just a single shot, but a string (at least a short one), you want to drop down a bit in SD to allow for the pressure at the middle of your shot string.... So for a 3000 psi fill and a 34" barrel, you might choose an SD of 0.20 for the maximum.... If you don't know how SD translates into bullet weight, here is a pair of graphs that show you that....
(http://i378.photobucket.com/albums/oo221/rsterne/PCP%20Internal%20Ballistics/WeightvsSectionalDensity_zps6c1a8dfe.jpg) (http://s378.photobucket.com/user/rsterne/media/PCP%20Internal%20Ballistics/WeightvsSectionalDensity_zps6c1a8dfe.jpg.html)
A bullet with an SD of 0.20 in .308 cal would be about 130 gr.... and in .357 cal about 180 gr.... For .457 cal it would be about 300 gr.... Those are about the maximum weights I would look to using in a 3000 psi PC with a 34" barrel.... Otherwise, your velocity will be lower than ideal, IMO....
Bob
Perfect, exactly what I was looking for! Thanks!
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Of course "optimally" for a .308 Winchester is over 3 times as fast (and 10 times the FPE) of what is "optimal" for an airgun....
Bob
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Of course "optimally" for a .308 Winchester is over 3 times as fast (and 10 times the FPE) of what is "optimal" for an airgun....
Bob
Yes that was my point. It's interesting that the speeds are so different (300% faster in centerfire), yet the optimal weights of the projectiles in the .308 caliber are so close...
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After seeing a pic of all 3 Texans it looks like the .308 and .357 are running a 36" barrel... There is a pic from shot show that has them all I'm a rack. The 2 that they say are .308 and .357 have longer barrels.
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With a comparable shroud on it (.308 or .357) to the .45, that will not fit in my cabinet. Yikes, that is one long gun!
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In. 308,I may have found my next airgun.
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The numbers are already getting inflated. Now Tom Gaylord is saying over 300 fpe in .308 and 400 fpe in .357.
I just shot my .308 with 192 gr and it's making 306 fpe on 3300 psi. I can change the top hat gap and probably get 300 fpe on 300 but I have it setup for light bullets.
I know they are using heavy bullets with rainbow trajectory to get bigger numbers for sales. The texan makes close to it claim but with way to heavy of a bullet.
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I just called Airforce.......The woman didn't have a LOT of info for publication but did say as far as she was aware the barrels of ALL TEXANS are the same length.............Taking Pre-orders but the BEST estimate right now for availability will be mid MARCH.
Pic from the shot show. I mentioned this Pic to the woman and she said it had to just be the angle of camera to give seemingly differing bbl lengths?
Click Pic from the shot show and pic will enlarge enough to view yourself.......
Carl
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Sure looks like the bottom gun has a shorter barrel.
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looks like some longggggg guns!! ;D
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Sure looks like the bottom gun has a shorter barrel.
It is possible, but having done a LOT OF PHOTOGRAPHY i know a WIDE angle lens distorts image reality a lot. I presume this was a CONSUMER CAMERA, or iPhone WIDE ANGLE which are both wide angles, and probably is distortion just because where they stood ? We will all know soon when they release the stats!
Carl
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They are all the same length barrel in the pic it is just the shot angle, very interesting on the FPE and would love to know the shot count expected from them. To be accurate and shoot flat I say a 200 to 225 FPE will more than likely be the max if shooting longer ranges.
I like the idea of the power but them things are sure long!!!!
William
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yea I'd like the 357 for a field hunter.Im already getting 4 shots at 250 fpe out my recluse though so it would be hard to drop a grand for a gun twice as long and little power increase.
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You can pre order the .357 ad .308 at PA now to be first up to receive when they come in. The guns are same as .45 barrel and over all length of 48". Estimated in stock date for the 30 and 357 is 3/30/16. Restock of .45 is 1/29.
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Maybe they should be called the Arizona and New Mexico ?
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Here's a video from the shot show with a little more information.
https://youtu.be/QMjZ2f-Ezl8
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Maybe they should be called the Arizona and New Mexico ?
U.S.A. Texas
U.S.A. Arizona
U.S.A. New Mexico
I like it!!!
Bob
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Though it would be out of order but would give Texas the larger caliber perhaps naming for republics?
Texan- .45
Vermonter- .357
Lakotah- .308
Lakotah was never a rebublic but I for one support that movement.
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I was trying for a parody on Battleships.... U.S.S.....
Bob
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What would the velocities be for a 90-100gr projectile to reach around 300 ft lbs?
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What would the velocities be for a 90-100gr projectile to reach around 300 ft lbs?
1163fps for the 100gr, however Im guessing they are talking about reaching the 300fpe with a 240gr moving around 750fps??? Not an ideal situation for most folks I assume, but hopefully we will know soon.
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What would the velocities be for a 90-100gr projectile to reach around 300 ft lbs?
1163fps for the 100gr, however Im guessing they are talking about reaching the 300fpe with a 240gr moving around 750fps??? Not an ideal situation for most folks I assume, but hopefully we will know soon.
Yea anything above 150-160gr isn't very appetizing at all! I dont shoot over 300gr with my texan and with Josh Porter's 314 gr hp's im getting 817 fps wich is about the limit i like to use due to drop. I like light and fast so im hoping that .308 that is coming out will allow me to reach out to 150 yds with "hopefully" a narrow trajectory. We will see!
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Yea anything above 150-160gr isn't very appetizing at all! I dont shoot over 300gr with my texan and with Josh Porter's 314 gr hp's im getting 817 fps wich is about the limit i like to use due to drop. I like light and fast so im hoping that .308 that is coming out will allow me to reach out to 150 yds with "hopefully" a narrow trajectory. We will see!
Ive shot some 255gr HP with good results thus far, now testing a swaged 270gr, had same POI as the 255gr. Ive only had this a couple of weeks, but so far so good. Same boat, Im considering a .308 in something.
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Well I pre ordered one in .357. I got a condor .257, a Windy City in 357 so this goes good with them. I always liked the Texan, just wasn't sure of the 457. Now in .357 I think it will be a very good gun. I will be putting a carbon fiber tank on it. Yeah it is long but it will be light. My AZ tuned Rapid and my RX2 are both about the same length.
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Yea this is my second Texan and its messing up alot. Accuracy out of no where just now went to &^^&! Ive checked everything. Shot with and without my moderator and still grouping horrible. I dont understand but is very frustrating for a thousand dollar gun. Im waiting for taxes and im thinking about a slayer in .357 but the "one year" warranty has me a bit on edge. I know the gun is not proven yet and Tom has to allow his buisness to succeed but one year has me very iffy:/. Ive dreampt of hunting with the slayer several times wich is weird because they felt very real. My family has a weird gift for seing things to come, its happened to several of us. Anyway im tired of spending my money on things that dont perform like they should and the Slayer is probably the best quality gun out there, theres no doubt about that. The reviews are all solid and from what i hear from the best "Doug Noble" the Slayer is the truth! Im not doubting that its the best quality big bore slug shooting .357 out right now and by saying that im not saying other companies such as "extreme bigbores" or any others arent very well American made guns, but rather Toms is the best as far as consistancy. Getting six "very accurate" shots at nearly the very same fps without a rapid decine after the first two wich is what every big bore "slug shooter" out there has missed as far as i know. Ive only been into airguns a couple years but i read and research alot and theres nothing out there right now that compares to Toms Slayer! I will probably get one anyway along with a .257 from Doug Noble hopefully.. Im not happy with my Texan at all. I was at first but after these problems im having i nust dont want to deal with it anymore. Very frustrated i must say!!
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And the length is just hard to deal with in the field. I use the rl shroud wich has been very nice as far as noise and an increase in accuracy but its a buffalo gun now lol. Im not doubting the quality of Toms Slayer line at all, i just hope when i get mine soon i wont have to buy another gun for a while. Theres not much quality anymore even when you pay for it and im tired of spending my money just to be let down. Im nearly convinced the Slayer will be the best and worth the extra money than my Texan. Wich is the main reason im more than likely getting one from Tom, "quality"!! Thats all i want is to get what im paying for and the slayer is the best candidate and this is not just "my" opinion either. But man is my wife is going to "kick my a#% when i tell her im getting this gun:/ Trying to explain to a woman that spending more on something well made will save money in the long run is a long shot. Unless shes buying something of course!
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Yea this is my second Texan and its messing up alot. Accuracy out of no where just now went to &^^&! Ive checked everything. Shot with and without my moderator and still grouping horrible. I dont understand but is very frustrating for a thousand dollar gun. Im waiting for taxes and im thinking about a slayer in .357 but the "one year" warranty has me a bit on edge. I know the gun is not proven yet and Tom has to allow his buisness to succeed but one year has me very iffy:/. Ive dreampt of hunting with the slayer several times wich is weird because they felt very real. My family has a weird gift for seing things to come, its happened to several of us. Anyway im tired of spending my money on things that dont perform like they should and the Slayer is probably the best quality gun out there, theres no doubt about that. The reviews are all solid and from what i hear from the best "Doug Noble" the Slayer is the truth! Im not doubting that its the best quality big bore slug shooting .357 out right now and by saying that im not saying other companies such as "extreme bigbores" or any others arent very well American made guns, but rather Toms is the best as far as consistancy. Getting six "very accurate" shots at nearly the very same fps without a rapid decine after the first two wich is what every big bore "slug shooter" out there has missed as far as i know. Ive only been into airguns a couple years but i read and research alot and theres nothing out there right now that compares to Toms Slayer! I will probably get one anyway along with a .257 from Doug Noble hopefully.. Im not happy with my Texan at all. I was at first but after these problems im having i nust dont want to deal with it anymore. Very frustrated i must say!!
I have run into this problem with a number of Texan s there seems to be an issue with the hammer spring after a while its not opening the valve consistently . As with all the ones I have worked on ,valve lock has started to occur at 3000 psi and then at 2800 psi then at 2500 psi . We fixed the problem by making a new hammer spring that is longer than the factory spring which we now sell . We were filling the Texans to 250 bar to check when there would be valve lock with the new hammer spring and the rifle was shooting spot on and we were getting velocities of 997 fps with a 220 grain pellet and 925 fps with a 272 grain bullet. we did not encounter any problem with the burst disc at that pressure
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I am having issues with my Texan as well. I can shoot an acceptable group, change targets and shoot the same bullet and it is all over the place. I am shooting tethered on top of it. I have taken my shroud off but it has not fixed the problem. I have halted all my 45 caliber testing since I can not rely on my gun. I have a friend who fixes airguns who is going to take it and fix but I have not had a chance to see him. I am sure we will get it back into shooting where it was.
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Mine is doing the exact same as yours nick. I went out today for an hour to test some slugs and i only shot six so to not waste all of them. Four days ago she was shooting! And now.. She doesnt know where to spit:( ive tried everything i know to help and it wont shoot. Just out of no where.. The day before i took some good long range shots on a couple fox. Glad i got those before it started to act up. Theres a warranty on these. I might have to send it in again.
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Well that's one thing to be greatful for in being poor. If I had the money this is exactly where it would have gone. Was really excited about this gun in .357.
Hope the kinks get sorted out before I come into more money than pocket change. Emphasis is on actual "change". Summer work is better and hope these get fixed by summers end. Itching for a big bore and white tail season of 2016.
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What distant are you shooting this and what kind of pellets? Mine at 30 yards are grouping within an inch or less. I have a RL shroud on the gun.
Yea this is my second Texan and its messing up alot. Accuracy out of no where just now went to &^^&! Ive checked everything. Shot with and without my moderator and still grouping horrible. I dont understand but is very frustrating for a thousand dollar gun. Im waiting for taxes and im thinking about a slayer in .357 but the "one year" warranty has me a bit on edge. I know the gun is not proven yet and Tom has to allow his buisness to succeed but one year has me very iffy:/. Ive dreampt of hunting with the slayer several times wich is weird because they felt very real. My family has a weird gift for seing things to come, its happened to several of us. Anyway im tired of spending my money on things that dont perform like they should and the Slayer is probably the best quality gun out there, theres no doubt about that. The reviews are all solid and from what i hear from the best "Doug Noble" the Slayer is the truth! Im not doubting that its the best quality big bore slug shooting .357 out right now and by saying that im not saying other companies such as "extreme bigbores" or any others arent very well American made guns, but rather Toms is the best as far as consistancy. Getting six "very accurate" shots at nearly the very same fps without a rapid decine after the first two wich is what every big bore "slug shooter" out there has missed as far as i know. Ive only been into airguns a couple years but i read and research alot and theres nothing out there right now that compares to Toms Slayer! I will probably get one anyway along with a .257 from Doug Noble hopefully.. Im not happy with my Texan at all. I was at first but after these problems im having i nust dont want to deal with it anymore. Very frustrated i must say!!
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Well here we go with waiting for the new Texans. Last week over at PA it said expected delivery 3/13/16, now it says 5/31/16. I wonder how many more times this date will get pushed back.
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What distant are you shooting this and what kind of pellets? Mine at 30 yards are grouping within an inch or less. I have a RL shroud on the gun.
Im shooting mostly around 50-100 yds.. I use several diff types of ammo both for hunting and plinking. I was almost touching holes with roundball at 100yds on my rest with both .457 hornady n .454 hornady(.454 shot an inch lower with 50-60fps less over the chrony at 15ft) and .457 speers.. Josh Porters 314gr i was getting less than "5 grouping at 220yds laying down using just my bipod now im getting 3-4" with roundball at 50yds. Texan is my first big bore. I dont think i could ever go buy a dragon slayer or an evanix sniper after first owning and experiencing one of the most powerful production air rifles on the market lol (its not the "most" powerful) so im pretty dissapointed cause i know theres other guns out there built much better than the Texan. They cost about double the price but hey. One slug that didnt do well at all out of the Texan was rl 241 gr arc hunters until i bought the rl shroud. Randy's shroud stiffens the barrel harmonics to give better accuracy and before it messed up i was getting 1 1/2 - 2" grouping at almost 50yds. Acceptable for Mi Whitetail😊
Yea this is my second Texan and its messing up alot. Accuracy out of no where just now went to &^^&! Ive checked everything. Shot with and without my moderator and still grouping horrible. I dont understand but is very frustrating for a thousand dollar gun. Im waiting for taxes and im thinking about a slayer in .357 but the "one year" warranty has me a bit on edge. I know the gun is not proven yet and Tom has to allow his buisness to succeed but one year has me very iffy:/. Ive dreampt of hunting with the slayer several times wich is weird because they felt very real. My family has a weird gift for seing things to come, its happened to several of us. Anyway im tired of spending my money on things that dont perform like they should and the Slayer is probably the best quality gun out there, theres no doubt about that. The reviews are all solid and from what i hear from the best "Doug Noble" the Slayer is the truth! Im not doubting that its the best quality big bore slug shooting .357 out right now and by saying that im not saying other companies such as "extreme bigbores" or any others arent very well American made guns, but rather Toms is the best as far as consistancy. Getting six "very accurate" shots at nearly the very same fps without a rapid decine after the first two wich is what every big bore "slug shooter" out there has missed as far as i know. Ive only been into airguns a couple years but i read and research alot and theres nothing out there right now that compares to Toms Slayer! I will probably get one anyway along with a .257 from Doug Noble hopefully.. Im not happy with my Texan at all. I was at first but after these problems im having i nust dont want to deal with it anymore. Very frustrated i must say!!
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Hey fellow airgunners! Has anyone heard any more info on the new .308 and .357 Texans coming out? Shot strings? Accuracy? Fpe numbers?? Im contiplating getting one in .308 along with a slayer in .357 soon as taxes come. I would go for the texan tho to save the money if it was about 10" shorter! Lol
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My biggest question on the new calibers is.......Will the barrels be interchangeable like in the Talon/Condor riffles? I would love to put the .308 on my Texan for shoots and giggles. Someone please tell me they will.
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My biggest question on the new calibers is.......Will the barrels be interchangeable like in the Talon/Condor riffles? I would love to put the .308 on my Texan for shoots and giggles. Someone please tell me they will.
Word is, no, they will not be interchangeable :(
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I have to admit, that makes me a little sad. Thanks for the heads up Prouzy
Rick
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I know what you mean. It was on my mind when I originally purchased the Texan, having wanted a .308 for some time. Still wondering the differences that would make this an issue, but overall very happy with .457. What would it take to have conversion, in this case downsizing? Though, Im also intrigued by the Extreme option of running on lower pressures with options to higher pressure.