Addaptation of Kral Puncher valve
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Addaptation of Kral Puncher valve
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Topic: Addaptation of Kral Puncher valve (Read 2391 times))
skorec
Expert
Posts: 1743
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Real Name: Peter
Addaptation of Kral Puncher valve
«
on:
March 14, 2019, 11:17:11 AM »
Thank the Bob I may try to adapt origin Kral puncher valve to be working with the half of hammer strike energy .
Notice.
Smaller caliber probably should need larger venting hole or smaller balanced chamber by using 24” /.177 barrel ( It may be able to calculate
).
Swappable parts “A” can help too I hope.
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EU, Slovakia
.177 AA S510 Carbine + Delta Optical Titanium 6-24X42 AO for JSB Exact Heavy
.177 Combo (CO2 and PCP ) QB78D + Hawke Vantage 4-12x40 AO for JSB Exact Express
.22 LW/CH moded Noblesse Bullpupn+ Hawke 8-32x56 SF Half MilDot for JSB Jumbo Heavy
.177 LW/CH moded Puncher + KonusPro 6-24x44 for Monster REDESIGNED
177 Poly/NCH moded Puncher ONE-T + KonusPro 6-24x44 for 21gr Piledriver
.177 HW/NCH moded Puncher Pitbull +Hawke Sidewinder 30SF for Monster REDESIGNED+NSA18gr or Piledrivers about 950 FPS
.177 Gamo GX-40 + NikoStriling 6-24x56 for JSB Exact Heavy
spare barrels .177 HW/CH + Hatsan Hercules .177 585mmx15mm TR=18,7
skorec
Expert
Posts: 1743
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Real Name: Peter
Re: Addaptation of Kral Puncher valve
«
Reply #1 on:
March 17, 2019, 06:50:14 AM »
Can control of plenum avoid danger dump shot ?
Air volume inside Puncher valve is approximately 10cm3.. How many cm3 have I to add for .177/50 joule shooting with 55cm barrel ?
«
Last Edit: March 17, 2019, 11:11:19 AM by skorec
»
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EU, Slovakia
.177 AA S510 Carbine + Delta Optical Titanium 6-24X42 AO for JSB Exact Heavy
.177 Combo (CO2 and PCP ) QB78D + Hawke Vantage 4-12x40 AO for JSB Exact Express
.22 LW/CH moded Noblesse Bullpupn+ Hawke 8-32x56 SF Half MilDot for JSB Jumbo Heavy
.177 LW/CH moded Puncher + KonusPro 6-24x44 for Monster REDESIGNED
177 Poly/NCH moded Puncher ONE-T + KonusPro 6-24x44 for 21gr Piledriver
.177 HW/NCH moded Puncher Pitbull +Hawke Sidewinder 30SF for Monster REDESIGNED+NSA18gr or Piledrivers about 950 FPS
.177 Gamo GX-40 + NikoStriling 6-24x56 for JSB Exact Heavy
spare barrels .177 HW/CH + Hatsan Hercules .177 585mmx15mm TR=18,7
skorec
Expert
Posts: 1743
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Real Name: Peter
Re: Addaptation of Kral Puncher valve
«
Reply #2 on:
March 21, 2019, 03:04:22 PM »
Another idea.
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EU, Slovakia
.177 AA S510 Carbine + Delta Optical Titanium 6-24X42 AO for JSB Exact Heavy
.177 Combo (CO2 and PCP ) QB78D + Hawke Vantage 4-12x40 AO for JSB Exact Express
.22 LW/CH moded Noblesse Bullpupn+ Hawke 8-32x56 SF Half MilDot for JSB Jumbo Heavy
.177 LW/CH moded Puncher + KonusPro 6-24x44 for Monster REDESIGNED
177 Poly/NCH moded Puncher ONE-T + KonusPro 6-24x44 for 21gr Piledriver
.177 HW/NCH moded Puncher Pitbull +Hawke Sidewinder 30SF for Monster REDESIGNED+NSA18gr or Piledrivers about 950 FPS
.177 Gamo GX-40 + NikoStriling 6-24x56 for JSB Exact Heavy
spare barrels .177 HW/CH + Hatsan Hercules .177 585mmx15mm TR=18,7
oldpro
GTA
GTA Senior Contributor
Posts: 10981
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Real Name: Travis
Re: Addaptation of Kral Puncher valve
«
Reply #3 on:
March 21, 2019, 03:13:02 PM »
They are all way over balanced so they would be dump valves and very inefficient. You need to adjust the balanced ratios and a few other things as well. But its a good start.
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Katy, Texas
Raptor mini 2 in .25
Huben k1 .22
LCS SK-19
Airacudas
skorec
Expert
Posts: 1743
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Real Name: Peter
Re: Addaptation of Kral Puncher valve
«
Reply #4 on:
April 12, 2019, 01:19:00 PM »
At the first step I have removed back chamber at SS balanced valve and I hope that blended front chamber will be work right but without sticktion issue.
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EU, Slovakia
.177 AA S510 Carbine + Delta Optical Titanium 6-24X42 AO for JSB Exact Heavy
.177 Combo (CO2 and PCP ) QB78D + Hawke Vantage 4-12x40 AO for JSB Exact Express
.22 LW/CH moded Noblesse Bullpupn+ Hawke 8-32x56 SF Half MilDot for JSB Jumbo Heavy
.177 LW/CH moded Puncher + KonusPro 6-24x44 for Monster REDESIGNED
177 Poly/NCH moded Puncher ONE-T + KonusPro 6-24x44 for 21gr Piledriver
.177 HW/NCH moded Puncher Pitbull +Hawke Sidewinder 30SF for Monster REDESIGNED+NSA18gr or Piledrivers about 950 FPS
.177 Gamo GX-40 + NikoStriling 6-24x56 for JSB Exact Heavy
spare barrels .177 HW/CH + Hatsan Hercules .177 585mmx15mm TR=18,7
skorec
Expert
Posts: 1743
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Real Name: Peter
Re: Addaptation of Kral Puncher valve
«
Reply #5 on:
April 13, 2019, 04:24:48 AM »
I tried to calculate haw fast the front/balanced chamber will be filled through very little venting hole.
0,8mm venting hole let us only 0,5m2 but the 4mm transfer port/way let us 12m2 area which is 24 times more.
If we want to have filed fully balanced chamber at momentum the pellet is at the middle of the barrel (Cubature = 3,14*2,25*2,25*300 = 4800 mm3 ) we need to have cubature of balanced chamber 24 times less that means only 190 mm3 (Cubature = 3,14*3,5*3,5*
15/3
= 190 mm3 ).
I will probably need to reduce/shorten my new balanced chamber 3 times.
«
Last Edit: April 13, 2019, 02:09:36 PM by skorec
»
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EU, Slovakia
.177 AA S510 Carbine + Delta Optical Titanium 6-24X42 AO for JSB Exact Heavy
.177 Combo (CO2 and PCP ) QB78D + Hawke Vantage 4-12x40 AO for JSB Exact Express
.22 LW/CH moded Noblesse Bullpupn+ Hawke 8-32x56 SF Half MilDot for JSB Jumbo Heavy
.177 LW/CH moded Puncher + KonusPro 6-24x44 for Monster REDESIGNED
177 Poly/NCH moded Puncher ONE-T + KonusPro 6-24x44 for 21gr Piledriver
.177 HW/NCH moded Puncher Pitbull +Hawke Sidewinder 30SF for Monster REDESIGNED+NSA18gr or Piledrivers about 950 FPS
.177 Gamo GX-40 + NikoStriling 6-24x56 for JSB Exact Heavy
spare barrels .177 HW/CH + Hatsan Hercules .177 585mmx15mm TR=18,7
skorec
Expert
Posts: 1743
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Real Name: Peter
Re: Addaptation of Kral Puncher valve
«
Reply #6 on:
April 13, 2019, 02:15:29 PM »
No any comments to balance chamber cubature calculation ?
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EU, Slovakia
.177 AA S510 Carbine + Delta Optical Titanium 6-24X42 AO for JSB Exact Heavy
.177 Combo (CO2 and PCP ) QB78D + Hawke Vantage 4-12x40 AO for JSB Exact Express
.22 LW/CH moded Noblesse Bullpupn+ Hawke 8-32x56 SF Half MilDot for JSB Jumbo Heavy
.177 LW/CH moded Puncher + KonusPro 6-24x44 for Monster REDESIGNED
177 Poly/NCH moded Puncher ONE-T + KonusPro 6-24x44 for 21gr Piledriver
.177 HW/NCH moded Puncher Pitbull +Hawke Sidewinder 30SF for Monster REDESIGNED+NSA18gr or Piledrivers about 950 FPS
.177 Gamo GX-40 + NikoStriling 6-24x56 for JSB Exact Heavy
spare barrels .177 HW/CH + Hatsan Hercules .177 585mmx15mm TR=18,7
skorec
Expert
Posts: 1743
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Real Name: Peter
Re: Addaptation of Kral Puncher valve
«
Reply #7 on:
April 14, 2019, 02:15:30 AM »
I have just screwed M8 and shorten spring/pin .
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EU, Slovakia
.177 AA S510 Carbine + Delta Optical Titanium 6-24X42 AO for JSB Exact Heavy
.177 Combo (CO2 and PCP ) QB78D + Hawke Vantage 4-12x40 AO for JSB Exact Express
.22 LW/CH moded Noblesse Bullpupn+ Hawke 8-32x56 SF Half MilDot for JSB Jumbo Heavy
.177 LW/CH moded Puncher + KonusPro 6-24x44 for Monster REDESIGNED
177 Poly/NCH moded Puncher ONE-T + KonusPro 6-24x44 for 21gr Piledriver
.177 HW/NCH moded Puncher Pitbull +Hawke Sidewinder 30SF for Monster REDESIGNED+NSA18gr or Piledrivers about 950 FPS
.177 Gamo GX-40 + NikoStriling 6-24x56 for JSB Exact Heavy
spare barrels .177 HW/CH + Hatsan Hercules .177 585mmx15mm TR=18,7
skorec
Expert
Posts: 1743
yes
Real Name: Peter
Re: Addaptation of Kral Puncher valve
«
Reply #8 on:
May 05, 2019, 05:24:09 AM »
I wanted to taste my new redesigned SS balanced valve at my Pitbull project but I was not successful because valve is whiffing/leaking at filing up the air reservoir tube.
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EU, Slovakia
.177 AA S510 Carbine + Delta Optical Titanium 6-24X42 AO for JSB Exact Heavy
.177 Combo (CO2 and PCP ) QB78D + Hawke Vantage 4-12x40 AO for JSB Exact Express
.22 LW/CH moded Noblesse Bullpupn+ Hawke 8-32x56 SF Half MilDot for JSB Jumbo Heavy
.177 LW/CH moded Puncher + KonusPro 6-24x44 for Monster REDESIGNED
177 Poly/NCH moded Puncher ONE-T + KonusPro 6-24x44 for 21gr Piledriver
.177 HW/NCH moded Puncher Pitbull +Hawke Sidewinder 30SF for Monster REDESIGNED+NSA18gr or Piledrivers about 950 FPS
.177 Gamo GX-40 + NikoStriling 6-24x56 for JSB Exact Heavy
spare barrels .177 HW/CH + Hatsan Hercules .177 585mmx15mm TR=18,7
oldpro
GTA
GTA Senior Contributor
Posts: 10981
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Real Name: Travis
Re: Addaptation of Kral Puncher valve
«
Reply #9 on:
May 05, 2019, 06:38:10 AM »
It will most likely never seal the ratio is to far off just by looking at it.
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Katy, Texas
Raptor mini 2 in .25
Huben k1 .22
LCS SK-19
Airacudas
skorec
Expert
Posts: 1743
yes
Real Name: Peter
Re: Addaptation of Kral Puncher valve
«
Reply #10 on:
May 05, 2019, 09:03:54 AM »
YES sealing valve diameter is 0,5mm larger then balanced chamber diameter
.
I need to ask my machinist to swap my tap M8x1,5 screw by embedded tube whit smaller diameter and machine the derlin poppet to cca 4,5mm ?
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EU, Slovakia
.177 AA S510 Carbine + Delta Optical Titanium 6-24X42 AO for JSB Exact Heavy
.177 Combo (CO2 and PCP ) QB78D + Hawke Vantage 4-12x40 AO for JSB Exact Express
.22 LW/CH moded Noblesse Bullpupn+ Hawke 8-32x56 SF Half MilDot for JSB Jumbo Heavy
.177 LW/CH moded Puncher + KonusPro 6-24x44 for Monster REDESIGNED
177 Poly/NCH moded Puncher ONE-T + KonusPro 6-24x44 for 21gr Piledriver
.177 HW/NCH moded Puncher Pitbull +Hawke Sidewinder 30SF for Monster REDESIGNED+NSA18gr or Piledrivers about 950 FPS
.177 Gamo GX-40 + NikoStriling 6-24x56 for JSB Exact Heavy
spare barrels .177 HW/CH + Hatsan Hercules .177 585mmx15mm TR=18,7
mann
Expert
Posts: 1436
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Real Name: Mark
Re: Addaptation of Kral Puncher valve
«
Reply #11 on:
May 05, 2019, 09:27:17 AM »
I believe you will need to have the sealing side and the balance side at about 70 percent ratio or less meaning your balance side side of the poppet should be 70 percent of your sealing side or less 65 percent works better . Your vent hole needs to be around the .052 of a inch or 1.32 mm or a tad larger
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USA Rushford MN
oldpro
GTA
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Posts: 10981
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Real Name: Travis
Re: Addaptation of Kral Puncher valve
«
Reply #12 on:
May 05, 2019, 12:41:23 PM »
Between 50-65% of cross section is ideal to get a good long tuning spread anything more and you quickly lose tuning spread.
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Katy, Texas
Raptor mini 2 in .25
Huben k1 .22
LCS SK-19
Airacudas
skorec
Expert
Posts: 1743
yes
Real Name: Peter
Re: Addaptation of Kral Puncher valve
«
Reply #13 on:
May 05, 2019, 01:59:51 PM »
OK - diameter 5-5,5mm of balanced chamber should be OK.
Next to M10x1 Pitbull air inlet I have add also some screw insert to use M8x1 gauge which will be also working as degassing screw. My machinist had serious problem adapted it to original SS balanced valve thread.
Travis - which type of thread is there ?
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EU, Slovakia
.177 AA S510 Carbine + Delta Optical Titanium 6-24X42 AO for JSB Exact Heavy
.177 Combo (CO2 and PCP ) QB78D + Hawke Vantage 4-12x40 AO for JSB Exact Express
.22 LW/CH moded Noblesse Bullpupn+ Hawke 8-32x56 SF Half MilDot for JSB Jumbo Heavy
.177 LW/CH moded Puncher + KonusPro 6-24x44 for Monster REDESIGNED
177 Poly/NCH moded Puncher ONE-T + KonusPro 6-24x44 for 21gr Piledriver
.177 HW/NCH moded Puncher Pitbull +Hawke Sidewinder 30SF for Monster REDESIGNED+NSA18gr or Piledrivers about 950 FPS
.177 Gamo GX-40 + NikoStriling 6-24x56 for JSB Exact Heavy
spare barrels .177 HW/CH + Hatsan Hercules .177 585mmx15mm TR=18,7
rsterne
Member 2000+fps Club
Bob and Lloyd
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Real Name: Bob
Re: Addaptation of Kral Puncher valve
«
Reply #14 on:
May 05, 2019, 02:15:24 PM »
I try and use 67% of diameter as my design point for my simplified balanced valve.... I know Travis favours less balancing (harder to open but easier to tune)….
Bob
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1750 CO2 Carbine, .177 Uber-Pumper, .22 Uber-Carbine, .25 Discovery, 2260 PCP 8-shot Carbine, 2260 HPA (37 FPE), 2560 HPA (52 FPE), XS-60c HPA in .30 cal (90 FPE), .22 cal QB79 HPA, Disco Doubles in .22, .25 & .30 cal, "Hayabusa" Custom PCP Project (Mk.I is .22 & .25 cal regulated; Mk.II is .224, .257, 7mm, .308 & .357; Mk.III is .410 shotgun and .458 cal), .257 "Monocoque" Benchrest PCP, .172/6mm Regulated PCP and .224/.257 Unregulated, Three regulated BRods in .25 cal (70 FPE), .30 cal (100 FPE) & .35 cal (145 FPE), .257 Condor (180 FPE).
skorec
Expert
Posts: 1743
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Real Name: Peter
Re: Addaptation of Kral Puncher valve
«
Reply #15 on:
May 06, 2019, 11:05:25 AM »
OD of balanced chamber 5,5mm ?
«
Last Edit: May 06, 2019, 11:22:47 AM by skorec
»
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EU, Slovakia
.177 AA S510 Carbine + Delta Optical Titanium 6-24X42 AO for JSB Exact Heavy
.177 Combo (CO2 and PCP ) QB78D + Hawke Vantage 4-12x40 AO for JSB Exact Express
.22 LW/CH moded Noblesse Bullpupn+ Hawke 8-32x56 SF Half MilDot for JSB Jumbo Heavy
.177 LW/CH moded Puncher + KonusPro 6-24x44 for Monster REDESIGNED
177 Poly/NCH moded Puncher ONE-T + KonusPro 6-24x44 for 21gr Piledriver
.177 HW/NCH moded Puncher Pitbull +Hawke Sidewinder 30SF for Monster REDESIGNED+NSA18gr or Piledrivers about 950 FPS
.177 Gamo GX-40 + NikoStriling 6-24x56 for JSB Exact Heavy
spare barrels .177 HW/CH + Hatsan Hercules .177 585mmx15mm TR=18,7
skorec
Expert
Posts: 1743
yes
Real Name: Peter
Re: Addaptation of Kral Puncher valve
«
Reply #16 on:
May 09, 2019, 10:24:29 AM »
I have added part n 4 to adjust right amount of balanced chamber volume
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EU, Slovakia
.177 AA S510 Carbine + Delta Optical Titanium 6-24X42 AO for JSB Exact Heavy
.177 Combo (CO2 and PCP ) QB78D + Hawke Vantage 4-12x40 AO for JSB Exact Express
.22 LW/CH moded Noblesse Bullpupn+ Hawke 8-32x56 SF Half MilDot for JSB Jumbo Heavy
.177 LW/CH moded Puncher + KonusPro 6-24x44 for Monster REDESIGNED
177 Poly/NCH moded Puncher ONE-T + KonusPro 6-24x44 for 21gr Piledriver
.177 HW/NCH moded Puncher Pitbull +Hawke Sidewinder 30SF for Monster REDESIGNED+NSA18gr or Piledrivers about 950 FPS
.177 Gamo GX-40 + NikoStriling 6-24x56 for JSB Exact Heavy
spare barrels .177 HW/CH + Hatsan Hercules .177 585mmx15mm TR=18,7
SilentMatt
Sharp Shooter
Posts: 542
Real Name: Matt
Re: Addaptation of Kral Puncher valve
«
Reply #17 on:
May 09, 2019, 10:39:38 AM »
Peter, the gauge thread is 1/8 NPT.
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Lakeview, AR
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mann
Expert
Posts: 1436
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Real Name: Mark
Re: Addaptation of Kral Puncher valve
«
Reply #18 on:
May 09, 2019, 05:54:03 PM »
You can get a greater amount of adjustment from the valve by using ba smaller transfer port also but it can restrict power output
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USA Rushford MN
skorec
Expert
Posts: 1743
yes
Real Name: Peter
Re: Addaptation of Kral Puncher valve
«
Reply #19 on:
May 13, 2019, 03:40:20 AM »
Thank you Matt
Mark,
Yes I know but via right size/length of part n.4 I want to reach that valve always will closing before pellet reach ½ of barrel length also at fully opened transfer air way/ports.
YES by choked air transfer way or heavier pellets the valve will closing quicker I hope.
Reducing the noise and decreasing jog of gun is most important for me. On another side too short valve opening need too to use higher pressure which can deform pellet skirts.
It is probably also the reason why bullets/slugs are preferring at last time.
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EU, Slovakia
.177 AA S510 Carbine + Delta Optical Titanium 6-24X42 AO for JSB Exact Heavy
.177 Combo (CO2 and PCP ) QB78D + Hawke Vantage 4-12x40 AO for JSB Exact Express
.22 LW/CH moded Noblesse Bullpupn+ Hawke 8-32x56 SF Half MilDot for JSB Jumbo Heavy
.177 LW/CH moded Puncher + KonusPro 6-24x44 for Monster REDESIGNED
177 Poly/NCH moded Puncher ONE-T + KonusPro 6-24x44 for 21gr Piledriver
.177 HW/NCH moded Puncher Pitbull +Hawke Sidewinder 30SF for Monster REDESIGNED+NSA18gr or Piledrivers about 950 FPS
.177 Gamo GX-40 + NikoStriling 6-24x56 for JSB Exact Heavy
spare barrels .177 HW/CH + Hatsan Hercules .177 585mmx15mm TR=18,7
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Addaptation of Kral Puncher valve