Air venturia avenger 25 flyers
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Air venturia avenger 25 flyers
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Topic: Air venturia avenger 25 flyers (Read 6240 times))
Tim F
Plinker
Posts: 103
yes
Real Name: Tim
Re: Air venturia avenger 25 flyers
«
Reply #40 on:
May 02, 2022, 11:32:54 PM »
Tom, I just went to "Bison air guns" and they show the "avenger rear shroud boss" in stock. Hope this helps.
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USA, CO, Creede
Tomygun1
Plinker
Posts: 166
yes
Real Name: Tom
Re: Air venturia avenger 25 flyers
«
Reply #41 on:
May 02, 2022, 11:35:21 PM »
Thanks, just ordered it.
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USA, OR, Jacksonville
Spin
Marksman
Posts: 375
yes
Real Name: Jerryy
Re: Air venturia avenger 25 flyers
«
Reply #42 on:
May 06, 2022, 01:14:14 PM »
Quote from: Tomygun1 on May 02, 2022, 11:35:21 PM
Thanks, just ordered it.
I was looking around to Tom If I couldn't find one I was going to spec one of mine out so there would be a drawing and dimensions
that could be wacked out by somebody with the resources and desire.
Another thing that struck my mind is that the picture on the Bison site showed the bushing slid on the barrel reversed from the way
it mounts. The larger dia. shoulder should mount flush against the face of the receiver and the smaller dia. fits into the shroud as does the o-ring.
If the tapped hole for the mounting set screw isn't drilled and tapped through the opposite side and you can drill and then tap it all the way past the opposite side - do it. Use the existing thread to guide the tap. De-burr and get a second set screw(make sure the seat against the barrel with the allen socket end completely below the outside of the mounting boss so it doesn't interfere with the shroud when you slide it on. Tighten slowly trying to keep even torque on each side. Don't bear down too hard. You don't want to scar up the O.D. of the barrel
Check for fit before finally fitting. if it's too loose cut some from aluminum foil. Heavy duty is a bit thicker should you need it. You need to leave a gap where the small button head screw matches the matching tapped hole in the side of the boss. Cleaning and drying boss and barrel and using a small drop of super glue under the bottom of each end of the shim can make things go a lot smoother. Aluminum foil is cheap and a razor blade scrapes off gluing mistakes easily. (if there's a .001 - .002 clearance - don't sweat it.
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USA, WI. Chilton
Tim F
Plinker
Posts: 103
yes
Real Name: Tim
Re: Air venturia avenger 25 flyers
«
Reply #43 on:
May 06, 2022, 09:21:35 PM »
Jerry, thanks for the tips. I will keep these in mind when I install the one from ae swede, haven't received it yet. I think it has a set screw on both sides.
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USA, CO, Creede
Tomygun1
Plinker
Posts: 166
yes
Real Name: Tom
Re: Air venturia avenger 25 flyers
«
Reply #44 on:
May 12, 2022, 03:11:10 AM »
The Bison product aluminum replacement shroud attachment works fine and I fired it today. However the mounting screw hole to attach the shroud was drilled too far forward to allow the shroud to be pulled over the O ring by 1/4”. Easy fix as I will just drill another hole in the shroud to allow proper fitment closer to the breech. Good product otherwise. A step in the right direction.
Tom
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USA, OR, Jacksonville
Tim F
Plinker
Posts: 103
yes
Real Name: Tim
Re: Air venturia avenger 25 flyers
«
Reply #45 on:
May 12, 2022, 10:35:01 PM »
Tom thanks for the update. I am glad you were able to correct the issue. I receive mine from ae swede but, haven't been able to test it as we have been having 25 - 30 mph winds with gust above 40, as soon as we have a break I will be testing the change.
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USA, CO, Creede
Tomygun1
Plinker
Posts: 166
yes
Real Name: Tom
Re: Air venturia avenger 25 flyers
«
Reply #46 on:
May 13, 2022, 11:49:37 PM »
Todays testing took me backwards just a little but I had to satisfy myself that the ammo isn’t the flyer problem. So I retested some that were less accurate and they still were. Returning to what this 25cal Avenger likes best, 25.39gr. and 30.86gr. in both H&N and JSB, it shot well at 80yds but after four nearly touching shots number five always went somewhere else. Next step will be removing the bbl and lapping and polishing it as the bores on these, and many pcp rifles, are pretty sloppy and truth be known shoot better than they should. I’m convinced that while top quality commercial pellets are pretty darn good they have a limit and are susceptible to the slightest variance, especially noticeable beyond 40yds.
So I just ordered a batch of slugs from H&N and Neilson Specialty Ammo in .249 and various weights. After I finish with the bore lapping and polish I will have a lot of testing to do and results will follow. Let’s hear how you are doing with the flyer problem.
Tom
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USA, OR, Jacksonville
Tim F
Plinker
Posts: 103
yes
Real Name: Tim
Re: Air venturia avenger 25 flyers
«
Reply #47 on:
May 14, 2022, 12:26:39 AM »
Tom, I installed the new rear barrel bushing. All went well with the installation, had a break in the wind this morning and took a few shots at 25 and 35 yards. I was able to put 5 shots in each group, measured 3/8", had to stop at this point as the high wind had returned. This is an improvement as before the groups were more like strings. The next break in the wind I will go to the range and stretch it out to 50 and 100 yards. The flyers become apparent at 100. Will be interesting to see if polishing the barrel helps, if so, I may give that a try. Thanks for the update.
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USA, CO, Creede
Tim F
Plinker
Posts: 103
yes
Real Name: Tim
Re: Air venturia avenger 25 flyers
«
Reply #48 on:
May 14, 2022, 10:18:55 PM »
Went to the range this morning, shot well at 35 yards, 1 ragged hole, less than 3/8". At 50 yards group opened up to 11/4". I think my tune is to low. Regulator was set at 1500 and hs 2 in. Reset Regulator to 2100 hs still at 2 in, will see how this works next time I have range time.
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USA, CO, Creede
Tomygun1
Plinker
Posts: 166
yes
Real Name: Tom
Re: Air venturia avenger 25 flyers
«
Reply #49 on:
May 16, 2022, 04:50:50 AM »
Like a bulldog I won’t let go of this flyer problem until I at least achieve average rimfire accuracy. Not only with my 25cal Avenger but with others I am working with and today it was my Cayden 22cal. Same problem at 75yds, four of five shot well and then one has a mind of it’s own. Only when I switched to slugs was there an improvement by 1/2” of grouping, and while the groups could be better there were no flyers. Avenger 25cal slug testing to come soon after my order of slugs arrive. So far my impressions are that slugs are more forgiving than pellets beyond 50yds just due to their nature and ballistic coefficient. Pellet flaws become apparent at this range and their performance just gets worse the farther you shoot. I have shot some enviable 85yd groups with 25cal pellets but they aren't repeatable. The imported bbls. on these lower priced pcp rifles do not match the quality usually found in decent rimfire rifles and I am now equipped to lap and polish these to get the most out of them and I think the answer is in the bore.
Tom
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USA, OR, Jacksonville
Spin
Marksman
Posts: 375
yes
Real Name: Jerryy
Re: Air venturia avenger 25 flyers
«
Reply #50 on:
May 16, 2022, 03:02:48 PM »
Tom I think that for the performance you are looking for you might do yourself a world of good to settle in, set up a crony and start adjusting the hammer spring (in Both directions) incrementally by 1/8 turns. Tuning for best results can be a matter as small as that simple 1/8th turn
either up or down and it can make a BIG difference in consistency and accuracy. You can adjust the hammer spring tension up or down without gassing off the rifle. Make your adjustment After shooting and before re-cocking the action. Write down your settings and results including cal. make, model, and weight.
Going into slugs you want to kick up velocities into the high 800's to mid 900's. They will function below that yes, but you won't get full capability. Also their flight might not fully stabilize at moderate distances but self correct father down range.
And be careful! Air rifle slugs generally have much, much higher sectional density and higher B.C. and you have to be cautious and aware that slug will travel much farther and with more energy than a Diablo Pellet, through the air or bouncing off the ground or a object. A bit more caution than usual is called for.
«
Last Edit: May 16, 2022, 03:07:34 PM by Spin
»
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USA, WI. Chilton
Tim F
Plinker
Posts: 103
yes
Real Name: Tim
Re: Air venturia avenger 25 flyers
«
Reply #51 on:
May 17, 2022, 04:33:13 PM »
Tom it seems to me that there is an instability in pellets as they get further out. I am going to order slugs from avs and get a chronograph and follow Spins lead. PD season starts here in about a month and would like to use the avenger.
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USA, CO, Creede
Trucker3573
Sharp Shooter
Posts: 799
yes
Re: Air venturia avenger 25 flyers
«
Reply #52 on:
May 17, 2022, 05:14:13 PM »
Whoever had the reg set at 1500……yes that is much too low on a 25 cal. Mine is 2100-2200 and I think on the absolute lower end of the useable range. Mine is super accurate out to 50 and I know they are capable but I think 75 and 100 consistently is much to expect from it.
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USA, MI
avator
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GTA Senior Contributor
Posts: 50175
The best "Bad Dog" I ever had.
Real Name: Bill
Re: Air venturia avenger 25 flyers
«
Reply #53 on:
May 17, 2022, 05:16:29 PM »
Mine is at 2300 and does a great job at 50 for 6 8 shot mags from 4300.
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From deep within the Rabbit Hole, Alabama
Charter Member Of The Secret Squirrel Society 20FEB202
Tomygun1
Plinker
Posts: 166
yes
Real Name: Tom
Re: Air venturia avenger 25 flyers
«
Reply #54 on:
May 17, 2022, 08:10:36 PM »
With long range accuracy being my goal with the 25cal Avenger my testing has led me to setting the reg @3000psi and I fill to 4000psi and get 4 mags per fill. I learned to back off the hammer spring by 1 3/4 turns after recording hammer bounce on the db meter and that corrected it. This setting drives a 21gr pellet @946fps through my chronograph and the heavier ones a little slower. While I plan on losing some velocity with slugs what I give up in speed should be worth it past 50yds with better BC, less velocity fall off at long distance compared to lighter pellets, and better wind bucking ability.
It looks to me that it all comes back to the bore for fine consistent accuracy. I haven’t received my order for slugs yet but will probably play around with pellets this afternoon. I’ll report anything that looks promising.
Tom
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USA, OR, Jacksonville
Tomygun1
Plinker
Posts: 166
yes
Real Name: Tom
Re: Air venturia avenger 25 flyers
«
Reply #55 on:
May 17, 2022, 10:01:09 PM »
Well this was interesting at 75yds.. I tested two pellets, H&N 27.47gr, and JSB 25.39gr. The H&N which had shot well previously at 50yds only gave acceptable hunting accuracy at 75yds and nothing to brag about. By the time I got to the JSB’s the reg pressure had dropped to 2700psi (reg creep) and these shot more accurately.
But here’s the strange part, the first group of JSB’s strung out horizontally only, and the second group strung out vertically only. One group measured 1.560”H, and the next measured 0.825”V. But both groups only measured, get this; .014” and .075 but in the opposite direction of each other. Huh?
I believe in cause and effect so it seems I'm still looking for the cause. Before anymore testing with reg pressure I plan to ‘properly’ lap the bbl on this and a Cayden rifle I am also working with and then do a comparison with pellets and slugs. The goal has always been consistent long range accuracy from 75yds and beyond.
In the meantime let’s hear what works for you.
Tom
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USA, OR, Jacksonville
Tim F
Plinker
Posts: 103
yes
Real Name: Tim
Re: Air venturia avenger 25 flyers
«
Reply #56 on:
May 19, 2022, 01:21:12 AM »
Tom, these are very interesting results. I hand pump at this point, so only fill to 33-3400 psi. I have noticed at times that it seems my accuracy is better at lower pressure, 26-2800 psi. I will have to pay closer attention to this as I test in the future. I have had these vertical and horizontal strings as you described from time to time. What type of rod are you going to use to polish your bore. I have some jb polishing compound but, unsure what type of rod to used. Will be interesting to see changes after you polish. I wonder if the head size on the pellets is to small to stabilize the pellet for longer range. In Steven's ytub where he is testing the avenger 25 with his avs slugs, he found that .254 worked better. I have tried to measure jsb 25.39 pellets and was getting .2495 - .250. Any thoughts.
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USA, CO, Creede
Tomygun1
Plinker
Posts: 166
yes
Real Name: Tom
Re: Air venturia avenger 25 flyers
«
Reply #57 on:
May 19, 2022, 01:51:15 AM »
Do yourself a favor and buy a compressor, hand pumping takes all the fun out of it. For about $360 on Amazon I think you can still buy a fully self contained ac/dc model that can also work from your truck battery in the field. I love mine. Also for lapping the bore Amazon sells 3M polishing paper and one pack comes with 6 different grits. Cut appropriate size strips to glue to a dowel or cleaning rod with rubber cement. They are color coded by grit and I would be cautious about using the coarser grits. The JB by itself is not up to the job.
Many others seem to prefer their regulator backed off but my goal is accuracy at longer ranges so Im not willing to give up the velocity and will keep it set high.
It takes about 3 or 4 minutes to charge from 3000psi to 4000psi that I fill to and at full power I get more than 4 mags from a fill.
Im still taking advice on slug diameter and YouTube videos recommend the smaller diameter but testing will tell, I ordered .249 I think.
Tom
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USA, OR, Jacksonville
DMR214
Sharp Shooter
Posts: 576
yes
Real Name: Rick
Re: Air venturia avenger 25 flyers
«
Reply #58 on:
May 19, 2022, 10:25:29 AM »
Following
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USA, TX, Dallas
Tim F
Plinker
Posts: 103
yes
Real Name: Tim
Re: Air venturia avenger 25 flyers
«
Reply #59 on:
May 21, 2022, 03:21:51 PM »
Tom, I did a test on pellet head size. I measured the remaining pellets in the tin. The majority were .2470 - .2475 and .2480 - .2485, also had 7 that were. 2445 - .2465 and a group of 16 that was .2490 - .2495. I first shot a 3 shot group with each heads size.
.2490 - .2465 had a flyer shot the remaining
4 shots. Had 2 groups about a 1/2
apart.
.2470 - .2475 had a flyer as well out of it's 3 shot
group.
.2480 - .2485 grouped well so I shot 2 more for a
5 shot group that measured
Tried to post a pic of the target but, couldn't get it to attach.
1/4" CC.
.2490 - .2495 grouped well also, did a 5 shot
group of 5/16" CC.
Could be an indicator I am seeing flyers at 100 yards. Will try a test at 100 yards with the better groups when I can.
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USA, CO, Creede
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