GTA
All Springer/NP/PCP Air Gun Discussion General => Hunting Gate => Topic started by: Nomadic Pirate on March 10, 2016, 02:32:39 AM
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The trades where blowing strong and cold today, perfect conditions to hunt my Ground blind by the feeder.
******WARNING********
Don't try this unless :
You extensively have tested your chosen ammo penetration.
You have a deep understanding of the quarry anatomy and a complete knowledge of where, how and when to shoot.
You have practiced like no other and can put that pellet consistently in Half the size of the intended target all the time, and always on a cold shot,...groups when you shooting a lot mean nothing,that fists shot from cold means everything.
OK, back to previously scheduled programs ;D ;D
I got to my Blind at 1 PM, I was carrying the NP2 loaded with the 21gr Baracuda so I made myself comfortable on the ground and started the waiting Game.
At Quarter to 4 I noticed a real nice Black boar approaching, it got to about 30 yards, stopped, started to circle a bit and took of in a hurry, something spooked it,......Maybe that was good, this boar would have been borderline shootable with the current equipment...I think.
At quarter to 5 this very respectable Blond/Grey young Boar comes in, Its very, very skittish, takes several approaches to the bait only to do a quick Uturn and dart back, I'm trying to turn on the camcorder without doing any damaging movement and every time I'm about to hit start the boar takes off again.
after more than half a dozen times I'm thinking it's gonna go for good anytime now, when all of a sudden he actually comes in.
I start the recorder and now it's time to pick up the rifle without getting busted ;D ;D ;D
I let the Video take over from now :
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CUcyrfIO--4&feature=youtu.be (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CUcyrfIO--4&feature=youtu.be)
I shot many, many Porkers with PCPs, but this one with a 20 FPE break barrel was exhilarating, .....adrenaline was flowing like crazy, believe me ;D ;D ;D
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d124/NorthShoreLB/Harvests/DSCF2085_zpstjdzdyzp.jpg) (http://s34.photobucket.com/user/NorthShoreLB/media/Harvests/DSCF2085_zpstjdzdyzp.jpg.html)
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d124/NorthShoreLB/Harvests/DSCF2086_zps9afcadcu.jpg) (http://s34.photobucket.com/user/NorthShoreLB/media/Harvests/DSCF2086_zps9afcadcu.jpg.html)
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d124/NorthShoreLB/Harvests/DSCF2087_zpsrsyfjy15.jpg) (http://s34.photobucket.com/user/NorthShoreLB/media/Harvests/DSCF2087_zpsrsyfjy15.jpg.html)
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d124/NorthShoreLB/Harvests/DSCF2095_zpsvvh5wayl.jpg) (http://s34.photobucket.com/user/NorthShoreLB/media/Harvests/DSCF2095_zpsvvh5wayl.jpg.html)
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Well done, Manny!!
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Absolutely amazing hunt.
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Wow! I didn't think you could top your previous hunts, but this....just wow.
Great video too, he dropped like a rock.
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Great hunt Manny. David
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Nice one Manny!
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Very impressive brother 8) and your a perfect example of a hunter who does his homework resulting in a successful hunt start to finish. Hunting with a smaller caliber along with the lower power vs PCP just shows all that it can be done if done right. Pinpoint shot placement and super vid Manny 8) and I had no doubt that you would find success. I could hear in the vid that you were amped up for the hunt. ;) Super pics as well bro and thanks for sharing you successful hunt with us. ;D Ed
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This has been an amazing journey you've shared with us from pondering the quest to selecting the gun all the way through to this. What a tribute and testimony to your skills and knowledge. Outstanding project and results Manny. You're like the Peyton Manning of air gun hunting; lots of talent but a mountain of prep work to make it look easy in the end. Congrats.
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Great job Manny, thanks for having us along.
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Awesome hunt Manny! Makes me that much more proud to own my Trail NP2 now! Perfect shot placement, perfect choice of pellet, went down like a rock!
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nice...I with the pirate again.i was thinking of hog hunting here with my 25 Mrod but wasn't sure it could do the job,but now I see it can and will do the job.
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Awesome stuff Manny!!!
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Nice job Manny and the video says it all. I give you a lot of credit for switching to Springers to hunt hogs.
There is not a skull or brain out there that can't be damaged from a 20fpe gun in the US other than a bear and very large antelope/deer like moose, elk and maybe ram, given the proper distance. The 21gr Cuda/Kodiak would have been my choice too if I used a Springer on anything larger than 10lbs. This pellet offers excellent penetration. I got complete pass-through on Groundhogs and possums from 25 to 30 yards out with head shots using the 350 .22 (21.6 fpe) and 21gr Kodiaks.
Congrats on the hog kill with your NP2!
Harry
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So much for the guy who said not to shoot facing you. You really rattled his brains! Very nice!
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So much for the guy who said not to shoot facing you. You really rattled his brains! Very nice!
Huh ??? ??? ?
The head was down and he was offering a square shot at the top of the skull.
You don't take the shot head on if the head is up and facing you, this one was a textbook shot and I waited until he was perfectly in line.
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So much for the guy who said not to shoot facing you. You really rattled his brains! Very nice!
That would be correct if it was facing you but did not have its head down. You want to shoot them when the head is down. That's when they expose the brain to you, and that's what Manny did.
I always shoot raccoons when they put their head down (fox, coyote, etc.). I prefer this type of shot than any other for furbearers or larger critters, and it should be no different for hogs with a "lower" powered airgun.
Harry
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Enjoyed the report and video very much, thanks for sharing with us. Excellent hunt.
Jeff
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Well that's what I meant. I'm well aware that head down is the best shot. Back on topic. Sorry
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When the world collapses will you take me under your wing?
Outstanding work.
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;) Manny, If it ever happens that it all goes into the toilet it is obvious that if you make it past day one you will not go hungry. You are the consummate hunter you do not take a shot until it is near perfect and the results of your many hunts are the proof of your skills and patience. Nicely done again congrats again brother
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Thanks for the video Manny. It goes hand in hand with the anatomy lesson you provided the other day. Perfect shot placement. Head down and 2" above the eyeline.
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Nice job, Manny! Good planning on your part, and a good dose of patience. That .22 break barrel of yours dropped him like a rock!!
Your Crosman looks like my F4 I recently bought, but the F4 is a .177. It's also a NP model. I'm still working on getting break barrels to shoot good for me. Multi pumpers and CO2 shooters, no problem. But these break barrels.....
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Manny, I'm glad the NP2 did what it was designed to do!! Especially in the hands of a skilled craftsman. I do believe there will be more of the same for you!! Good looking pig.
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The video came out well. :) Good job. That will get a lot of views as time goes on.
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Many thanks Manny, I love the video and story. Every time you post I get excited knowing it will be outstanding and another lesson to take to the bank.
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Nice shot!!! That was impressive for a 20 fpe gun!! 8)
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Did you notice in the background the mongoose that took off like a bat out of hades when you took the shot? ;D
Nice job! 8)
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Did you notice in the background the mongoose that took off like a bat out of hades when you took the shot? ;D
Nice job! 8)
I missed the mongoose, but I have seen plenty here on the big island. The little buggers are way to fast to try to shoot. I have seen a few flattened on the roads.
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Did you notice in the background the mongoose that took off like a bat out of hades when you took the shot? ;D
Nice job! 8)
That was a collared dove
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The trades where blowing strong and cold today, perfect conditions to hunt my Ground bling by the feeder.
******WARNING********
Don't try this unless :
You extensively have tested your chosen ammo penetration.
You have a deep understanding of the quarry anatomy and a complete knowledge of where, how and when to shoot.
You have practiced like no other and can put that pellet consistently in Half the size of the intended target all the time, and always on a cold shot,...groups when you shooting a lot mean nothing,that fists shot from cold means everything.
OK, back to previously scheduled programs ;D ;D
I got to my Blind at 1 PM, I was carrying the NP2 loaded with the 21gr Baracuda so I made myself comfortable on the ground and started the waiting Game.
At Quarter to 4 I noticed a real nice Black boar approaching, it got to about 30 yards, stopped, started to circle a bit and took of in a hurry, something spooked it,......Maybe that was good, this boar would have been borderline shootable with the current equipment...I think.
At quarter to 5 this very respectable Blond/Grey young Boar comes in, Its very, very skittish, takes several approaches to the bait only to do a quick Uturn and dart back, I'm trying to turn on the camcorder without doing any damaging movement and every time I'm about to hit start the boar takes off again.
after more than half a dozen times I'm thinking it's gonna go for good anytime now, when all of a sudden he actually comes in.
I start the recorder and now it's time to pick up the rifle without getting busted ;D ;D ;D
I let the Video take over from now :
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CUcyrfIO--4&feature=youtu.be (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CUcyrfIO--4&feature=youtu.be)
I shot many, many Porkers with PCPs, but this one with a 20 FPE break barrel was exhilarating, .....adrenaline was flowing like crazy, believe me ;D ;D ;D
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d124/NorthShoreLB/Harvests/DSCF2085_zpstjdzdyzp.jpg) (http://s34.photobucket.com/user/NorthShoreLB/media/Harvests/DSCF2085_zpstjdzdyzp.jpg.html)
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d124/NorthShoreLB/Harvests/DSCF2086_zps9afcadcu.jpg) (http://s34.photobucket.com/user/NorthShoreLB/media/Harvests/DSCF2086_zps9afcadcu.jpg.html)
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d124/NorthShoreLB/Harvests/DSCF2087_zpsrsyfjy15.jpg) (http://s34.photobucket.com/user/NorthShoreLB/media/Harvests/DSCF2087_zpsrsyfjy15.jpg.html)
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d124/NorthShoreLB/Harvests/DSCF2095_zpsvvh5wayl.jpg) (http://s34.photobucket.com/user/NorthShoreLB/media/Harvests/DSCF2095_zpsvvh5wayl.jpg.html)
Good shooting
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Wow,
A lot of people would poo poo this kind of stuff when others or companies like Gamo do this.
Great hunting Manny.
By any chance did you measure the penetration of the pellet into the skull?
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Thanks for the comprehensive explanation and - very well done!
I bet the next level to the adrenaline addiction.. will be the (gradually) older ones, as the critical cranial vault (front) thickness increases a LOT. As you already told us in the past, at some point you may choose a side head shot.
I still think you should do some penetration tests with the Baracuda Power (copper coated) for comparison. For the same 21 gr, HN says they are 20% harder than the Baracuda.
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Wow,
A lot of people would poo poo this kind of stuff when others or companies like Gamo do this.
I think the difference is, when the big companies do it we wonder how many hogs they wounded to produce the one promotional video of a clean kill. We don't have that worry with Manny.
He's also not using a .177, as the infamous Gamo videos do.
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Wow!!!!!!! I gotta hand it to you that was nothing less than AWESOME! Fantastic video too, a job well planned and executed, a huge congrats on the porker. You've got a big freezer of pork. That seriously makes me want to research the pig hunting in my area cause I've seen them before when unarmed, it can get might tense when you're unarmed cause they're very aggressive. Very cool 8)
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Nice shooting Manny, you made it look easy. I guess gun proven ... ;D
I suspect you could have brought it down with a sling shot if you put your mind to it
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Wow,
A lot of people would poo poo this kind of stuff when others or companies like Gamo do this.
Great hunting Manny.
By any chance did you measure the penetration of the pellet into the skull?
Gamo uses it to market an air rifle that won't get it done unless you are hunting under extremely controlled circumstances, or unless you are a highly skilled hunter and put in a lot of preparation. Manny is the highly skilled hunter, and revealed to us all his preparation along the way. He put in work to get this done. The gamo marketing videos tell us "hey, this gun can kill a hog. Buy it so you can kill hogs with a pellet gun." That's dangerous and unethical. Manny is showing us how a breakbarrel can get it done, if you do the work and know your limits and the limits of your equipment. Completely different kind of video.
By the way, nice work Manny
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The legend continues... 8)
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Nice work , I do like the comment on cold shot as the first shot POI does vary from following shots.
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Did you notice in the background the mongoose that took off like a bat out of hades when you took the shot? ;D
Nice job! 8)
That was a collared dove
I stand corrected. Watched on a bigger screen with my glasses. ::)
Still funny. ;D
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Very nicely done Manny. I bet most don't realize the actual time, effort and hunting skill, it takes to get a hunt like this on video without something going wrong. No guided ranch hunt here.
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NICE 👍 Way to go manny
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Ok. So Manny looks like you made crosmans site!
http://www.crosman.com/connect/turn-out-the-light-with-nitro-piston-2/?hvid=1OzytO&utm_content=buffer95bdf&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=buffer (http://www.crosman.com/connect/turn-out-the-light-with-nitro-piston-2/?hvid=1OzytO&utm_content=buffer95bdf&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=buffer)
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Great shot Manny! Dropped him like lightning!
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All I can say is wow. Congrats Manny! I was eating getting ready for work just glancing over my Facebook and see a picture of the Pirate with a hog from Crosmans news feed. I almost spit my food out! Lol. Then I have to rush over here and get the scoop. I just want to say thanks for taking on the challenge and sharing everything with us here. You are one of the guys that make this board awesome! Now if I have time I'm going to rub it in to those boys over at Hatsan. Lol. Gosh this is great being to live through you guys for us that are trapped in city lives and get little quality outdoor time. Amazing. T
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Ok. So Manny looks like you made crosmans site!
http://www.crosman.com/connect/turn-out-the-light-with-nitro-piston-2/?hvid=1OzytO&utm_content=buffer95bdf&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=buffer (http://www.crosman.com/connect/turn-out-the-light-with-nitro-piston-2/?hvid=1OzytO&utm_content=buffer95bdf&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=buffer)
Cool! Well deserved too.
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gracious all I can say is wow. Congrats Manny! I was eating getting ready for work just glancing over my Facebook and see a picture of the Pirate with a hog from Crosmans news feed. I almost spit my food out! Lol. Then I have to rush over here and get the scoop. I just want to say thanks for taking on the challenge and sharing everything with us here. You are one of the guys that make this board awesome! Now if I have time I'm going to rub it in to those boys over at Hatsan. Lol. Gosh this is great being to live through you guys for us that are trapped in city lives and get little quality outdoor time. Amazing. T
Totally agree with all of that and well said.
For the bolded part, you're in Wisconsin! You guys have woods all over! ;D We have nothing but corn here (away from Chicago). Unfortunately I'm in a crowded suburb. :(
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I love it! Locking the legs of what is probably a 100lb porker with a 20 foot pound break barrel! One fpe per five pounds of flesh is quite something. I know if you can punch into the brain, it's game over but I still didn't expect it to go down as if struck by lightning.
I bet your adrenaline was going. I got a little bit of that just watching :)
If anyone was going to do it, it was you. Well done!
Oh and speaking of adrenaline, where do you go from here? Jump from a limb onto the pig's back and administer a Peruvian necktie? ;D
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Ok. So Manny looks like you made crosmans site!
http://www.crosman.com/connect/turn-out-the-light-with-nitro-piston-2/?hvid=1OzytO&utm_content=buffer95bdf&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=buffer (http://www.crosman.com/connect/turn-out-the-light-with-nitro-piston-2/?hvid=1OzytO&utm_content=buffer95bdf&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=buffer)
Haha, check that out :)
if you posted on the Yellow a few years back that I would eventually be on the Official Crosman site they would have laughed at you like crazy :) :)
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I would have thought you would be the one to be on crosmans page before a paper puncher so it not surprise me at all...how big of a hog can the 25 Mrod put down with a well placed shot?i like to seek opinions from people that have been there and actually done that.
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But it wasn't as the quoted text:
And when it did, in the words of Crosman friend and host of InsideOutdoorsTV Dave Poteat, he “put it right between the lookers”.
It was, as Manny consistently states is best, 2" above "right between the lookers". This sort of linguistic inaccuracy can be what leads others to attempt the same thing, but with incorrect data as to shot placement.
Sigh, Crosman.
Nice work, Manny!
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Ok. So Manny looks like you made crosmans site!
http://www.crosman.com/connect/turn-out-the-light-with-nitro-piston-2/?hvid=1OzytO&utm_content=buffer95bdf&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=buffer (http://www.crosman.com/connect/turn-out-the-light-with-nitro-piston-2/?hvid=1OzytO&utm_content=buffer95bdf&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=buffer)
Haha, check that out :)
if you posted on the Yellow a few years back that I would eventually be on the Official Crosman site they would have laughed at you like crazy :) :)
Like I said, that video is going to get a lot of views.
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I was going to southern ohio to hunt hogs with my crossbow but now I taking the 25 Mrod,thanks pirate.i dont think I be making a video just yet.
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you know, Manny,... a few months ago you said you were done with airguns, and going back to traditional self bows. Now your back with a 20 ft lb springer, slinging Kodiaks at hogs. Love it!
Can you give us some chrony numbers for your setup? is it bone stock or did you go through it?
Ed
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Awesome job! Has you twice on their instagram page too! Congratulations!
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you know, Manny,... a few months ago you said you were done with airguns, and going back to traditional self bows. Now your back with a 20 ft lb springer, slinging Kodiaks at hogs. Love it!
Can you give us some chrony numbers for your setup? is it bone stock or did you go through it?
Ed
Nawh, hah......I said I was done with PCPs :) :)
than a member here put the springer bug in my ear and of course I had to take that challenge :) :)
The gun is bone stock, didn't even touch the trigger adjustment screws,
she shoots the Baracudas at 650 fps.
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I would have thought you would be the one to be on crosmans page before a paper puncher so it not surprise me at all...how big of a hog can the 25 Mrod put down with a well placed shot?i like to seek opinions from people that have been there and actually done that.
Assuming that you max out your stock Marauder ( should be about 45 FPE right ? ) ......now is very important you use the right ammo, my choice would be the Benjamin dome if they shoot well,
if you do you anatomy homework ( I had a long thread with lots of pictures in the past ) and get close you should be good with a decent size hog, you can take a bigger saw than a boar.
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But it wasn't as the quoted text:
And when it did, in the words of Crosman friend and host of InsideOutdoorsTV Dave Poteat, he “put it right between the lookers”.
It was, as Manny consistently states is best, 2" above "right between the lookers". This sort of linguistic inaccuracy can be what leads others to attempt the same thing, but with incorrect data as to shot placement.
Sigh, Crosman.
Nice work, Manny!
"Hollywood talk"....... the emphasis is more on saying something cool rather than accurate.
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I love it! Locking the legs of what is probably a 100lb porker with a 20 foot pound break barrel! One fpe per five pounds of flesh is quite something. I know if you can punch into the brain, it's game over but I still didn't expect it to go down as if struck by lightning.
I bet your adrenaline was going. I got a little bit of that just watching :)
If anyone was going to do it, it was you. Well done!
Oh and speaking of adrenaline, where do you go from here? Jump from a limb onto the pig's back and administer a Peruvian necktie? ;D
Small bore pistol Hog hunting ?
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I don't know, I kinda feel like any other capable airgun is a step up from a breakbarrel.
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Pistol hunting would be more walking/offhand than Blind/HAMbush hunting ;D ;D ;D
But yeah I agree that it's hard to top Break barrel hog Hunting ;)
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I don't care what anyone says. That's a cool shot right there. And done with a break barrel too.
Pip! Instant wooden leg syndrome. 8)
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Yeah, I'll never underestimate the power of a .22 caliber break barrel air rifle! That pig dropped like he'd been shot with my 45-70 Pedersali/Remington Rolling Block!!
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Don't know if i missed it in the video but how many yards away were you? Awesome kill!
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Good job Manny,I knew you would do it. My break barrel gole is a coyote. It would have to be a front on head shot at twenty yards but a good 22 Cal break barrel would do it. Again good job. Wolfer
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Don't know if i missed it in the video but how many yards away were you? Awesome kill!
-/+ 17 yards
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Thanks all,...appreciate the comments.
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Great stuff Manny. I was watching the video, saying to myself wait for it wait for it...squeeze, and the hog dropped. Great video. Can't say that enough. Congrats. I could hear the excitement in your breathing. Well done.
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Many thanks for sharing Manny, what a super story from planning to perfect execution. I hope to join the piggy club soon, as last weekend about 20 piglets, two sows, and a boar crossed a ridge right in front of me, but not close enough for a shot. Will try again tomorrow and will have the .25 Condor on the prowl.
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Congrats on a very successful hunt, & thank you for sharing this story. A lot of people get hung up on using a large caliber or more power when they go out hunting. You have just proven that all that size & power though they may be nice to have are not really needed, & that more can be done with less if you know your equipment, what you are doing & take the time to do the prep work and practice.
Manny if you arent careful you are going to run out of new methods for taking hogs before long ya know. So after you tire of springers whats next? Hog hunting with a wrist rocket & ball bearings perhaps :D
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Nice hunt Manny,
Pretty good size hog for a springer as well. I know Crosman is loving it ;D
Great Video and thank you for the experience, I have seen you shoot a few hogs on video and that one is the best ;D
Good luck on the small bore pistol hunt when you get ready. Any idea of what pistol you may use?
William
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Thanks everyone, ...appreciate it.
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Nice hunt Manny,
Pretty good size hog for a springer as well. I know Crosman is loving it ;D
Great Video and thank you for the experience, I have seen you shoot a few hogs on video and that one is the best ;D
Good luck on the small bore pistol hunt when you get ready. Any idea of what pistol you may use?
William
Don't know yet, don't even know if I'll get one.
There's a few that are coming into the market soon and are really interesting but I'm not sure yet, kinda want to wait for reviews and at the same time I'm itching to preorder one and be amongst the first to start up :) :)
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Solid Advert for that platform no doubt,good shooting
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Regarding bones, I was "sure" about getting more penetration with the Baracuda Power (copper coated, 20% harder) than the Baracuda Match.
Just to let you know, I didn't do reliable penetration tests yet, but, yesterday, to my 350 I got some numbers from the chronograph:
Round numbers..
HN FTT 5.53 - 14.66 gr ... "20" fpe
HN BM 5.53 - 21.14 gr ......"22" fpe
HN BP 5.53 - 21.14 gr ..... "17" fpe !?!?
Any thoughts about this fpe behavior?
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Regarding bones, I was "sure" about getting more penetration with the Baracuda Power (copper coated, 20% harder) than the Baracuda Match.
Just to let you know, I didn't do reliable penetration tests yet, but, yesterday, to my 350 I got some numbers from the chronograph:
Round numbers..
HN FTT 5.53 - 14.66 gr ... "20" fpe
HN BM 5.53 - 21.14 gr ......"22" fpe
HN BP 5.53 - 21.14 gr ..... "17" fpe !?!?
Any thoughts about this fpe behavior?
Not sure what your asking here!
Will this be enough for penetrating a hogs skull like Manny did on this one!!!!
Or if you asking why is there a difference in FPE compared to weight and pellet!!!
All pellets are different, shape, weight style and balance and dont forget what seals in the barrel better. What you get out the end of the barrel is what you get! Just because they weight the same or lighter means nothing!
William
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If those are accurate muzzle energies, 22fpe versus 17fpe for pellets of the same weight, then something very strange is going on. A normally expected variation in bore friction and/or skirt sizing doesn't explain it.
Not sure how much rounding you have going on there but that's the difference between 600fps and 685fps.
Is that repeatable over 5 shots with each pellet? In the 17fpe result, you didn't alter the angle you were shooting across the chronograph, did you? Or testing using artificial light?
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Regarding bones, I was "sure" about getting more penetration with the Baracuda Power (copper coated, 20% harder) than the Baracuda Match.
Just to let you know, I didn't do reliable penetration tests yet, but, yesterday, to my 350 I got some numbers from the chronograph:
Round numbers..
HN FTT 5.53 - 14.66 gr ... "20" fpe
HN BM 5.53 - 21.14 gr ......"22" fpe
HN BP 5.53 - 21.14 gr ..... "17" fpe !?!?
Any thoughts about this fpe behavior?
What does H&N BM and H&N BP mean ?
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Another great one Manny!
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Regarding bones, I was "sure" about getting more penetration with the Baracuda Power (copper coated, 20% harder) than the Baracuda Match.
Just to let you know, I didn't do reliable penetration tests yet, but, yesterday, to my 350 I got some numbers from the chronograph:
Round numbers..
HN FTT 5.53 - 14.66 gr ... "20" fpe
HN BM 5.53 - 21.14 gr ......"22" fpe
HN BP 5.53 - 21.14 gr ..... "17" fpe !?!?
Any thoughts about this fpe behavior?
What does H&N BM and H&N BP mean ?
Manny - Barracuda Match and Barracuda Power.
Trigger, I think the difference might be that the BPs are copper coated and might not seal as well causing a loss of speed.
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A difference of 85 FPS is nothing if the pellet does not seat good. My Springer is like that, a slightly loose pellet is 80 to 90 fps different (slower), also if i seat a pellet that was shooting 750 FPS into the barrel approx. 1/8" it will now shoot 660 FPS just because I seated it. I guess due to it not flaring out tighter after seating or something, and I experimented with this a lot so I know it is fact.
So each pellet will do its own thing and nothing has to be wrong with the chronograph or the gun!
William
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Regarding bones, I was "sure" about getting more penetration with the Baracuda Power (copper coated, 20% harder) than the Baracuda Match.
Just to let you know, I didn't do reliable penetration tests yet, but, yesterday, to my 350 I got some numbers from the chronograph:
Round numbers..
HN FTT 5.53 - 14.66 gr ... "20" fpe
HN BM 5.53 - 21.14 gr ......"22" fpe
HN BP 5.53 - 21.14 gr ..... "17" fpe !?!?
Any thoughts about this fpe behavior?
What does H&N BM and H&N BP mean ?
Manny - Barracuda Match and Barracuda Power.
Trigger, I think the difference might be that the BPs are copper coated and might not seal as well causing a loss of speed.
More likely extra drag causing the loss of speed.
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Well, that's a surprise to me. I did some skirt flaring experimenting with an XS46U that happened to be a 22fpe rifle and only saw a modest 15-20fps difference at most. I didn't try any PBA, lead-free, or coated pellets but they weren't just soft JSBs either because that was one of the few rifles I've ever had that wouldn't group well with some flavor of JSB.
You're saying 85fps is nothing. It's something to me :) But I guess if the skirt were woefully undersized and the alloy very hard, maybe so. However in that case I would have thought the shooter would notice the difference in how they seated.
Can someone comment on the hardness of the Baracuda Power? For example, can you squeeze the skirt between your thumb and forefinger and be unable to deform it?
It also leads me to wonder about the conventional wisdom that springers will obturate the skirt more than a comparably-powered PCP.
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More detailed info, and a correction - Baracuda Power are not 5.53, but 5.50.
Btw, before the chrony disappointment, the BP were grouping even better than the BM and I was getting very happy..
The crony is of a shooting Club (mostly PB), where I usually do the airgun shooting. I could swear the shooting angles were "almost the same". Chrony about "2" m from the muzzle. Artificial light. I don't know if it is accurate, but, by now, I think it doesn't matter when we are interested in the comparison between the pellets.
Ten rounds to each pellet, and in a row.
HN FTT 5.53 14.66 - average = 783 fps ... 20 fpe
HN BM 5.53 21.14 - average = 679 fps ... 21,7 fpe
HN BP 5.50 21.14 - average = 606 fps ... 17,2 fpe
For the BP, even being 5.50, I didn't feel any loosies at all. When loading, the feeling was similar, with all of the 3 different pellets matching the rule of thumb = not a kind of loose, not too tight.
Unfortunately, I buy my pellets from Portugal or Canada, and don't have BM 5.50 available to include in the comparison.
Anyway, I keep thinking if the bad surprise could be from the copper coated x barrel's internal dynamics.. ???
I'll try to ask HN by email.
.......................
Edited: email sent!
I'll also repeat the chrony ..
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SO . . . . .
How did you cook up that squealer ?
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Nice video! Keep em coming...along with all the lessons
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Regarding bones, I was "sure" about getting more penetration with the Baracuda Power (copper coated, 20% harder) than the Baracuda Match.
Just to let you know, I didn't do reliable penetration tests yet, but, yesterday, to my 350 I got some numbers from the chronograph:
Round numbers..
HN FTT 5.53 - 14.66 gr ... "20" fpe
HN BM 5.53 - 21.14 gr ......"22" fpe
HN BP 5.53 - 21.14 gr ..... "17" fpe !?!?
Any thoughts about this fpe behavior?
Not sure what your asking here!
Will this be enough for penetrating a hogs skull like Manny did on this one!!!!
Or if you asking why is there a difference in FPE compared to weight and pellet!!!
All pellets are different, shape, weight style and balance and dont forget what seals in the barrel better. What you get out the end of the barrel is what you get! Just because they weight the same or lighter means nothing!
William
Also alloy (some are harder than others, which can also effect sealing in the barrel)...
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That was awesome!! Good shooting ;D
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Regarding the Baracuda Power 5.50 (only head size available).
Yes, you were right.
HN has prompt answered:
"(..) The copper plating process makes the pellet more resistant against pressure and deformation. (..) the pellet reacts with less adaption to the barrel. (..) we also noticed a lower velocity in comparison with unplated Baracudas. This is the “price” for a more resistant surface and less lead fouling.(..)"
And, yes, as an airgun shooter I have to be always persistent.. Baracuda Power with bigger head sizes?
HN has prompt answered:
"(..) Bigger or smaller sizes result in poor accuracy or a much more curved path of pellet flight due to much less velocity.(..)"
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Well, there we have it. I'm still curious as to how hard the skirts are, even if very informal. Would you mind commenting on how hard it is to deform a skirt between your thumb and forefinger? One of each?
Copper has a Brinell hardness around 35 whereas if memory serves, lead alloys used in pellets range from single digits up to 20 or so for those with more antimony like Crosman Premiers. So unless the copper is particularly thick, the overall hardness may not be much different.
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Doesn't look like the copper pellets are a valuable option.
Thanks all for the comments, indeed appreciate it.
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"Would you mind commenting on how hard it is to deform a skirt between your thumb and forefinger? One of each?" (nervoustrigger)
No visible deformation, to both (BM and BP). >:( :o >:( :o
Well, maybe, as usual, the problem can be just - the shooter. ;D
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What? Let me see your bloody fingers :)
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Excellent shooting. Great video
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Excellent shooting. Great video
Thanks,
One thing I always say when hunting with PCPs is that I can't take credit for the shooting, those guns are just lazers put the crosshairs in the spot and pull the trigger.
Well, in this case I think I will take credit for making a good shot :) :) :)
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Well, in this case I think I will take credit for making a good shot :) :) :)
Take credit, don't take credit, noodle, don't noodle ... we know who to blame for that tasty guy's demise --- don't be modest, it was a great shot and you put in all the preparation work ;D
I'm just glad you shared the hunt with us - Thanks Manny!!!
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Gotta admit, it's been a week now ans I'm still high on this hunt,
Yes I did all my penetration testing but when you have a decent size hog in the Crosshairs your mind starts to question a bit, couldn't really draw reference from those latest Gamo videos because they where shooting Racoon sized piglets, also all my practice was in a controlled enviroment at paper now I was sitting on a log holding against a tree with a feeding/moving animal and when you watch the video you can tell there's some pretty strong gusts coming through,
So,....when all the dots connected you can imagine the high, that it has carry over for a week now, Pretty darn stoked with this hunt :) :) :)
On stand by now, planned was a bowhunt on the other mountain range but weather is not cooperating at the moment :(
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How can the weather not cooperate it is always sunny and 85 degrees with a light breeze off the ocean ;) ;D ;D. So when is the hunt with the wrist rocket sling shot planned if David could take down a 9ft giant a mere 400 hog should be no problem ;D ;D
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How can the weather not cooperate it is always sunny and 85 degrees with a light breeze off the ocean ;) ;D ;D. So when is the hunt with the wrist rocket sling shot planned if David could take down a 9ft giant a mere 400 hog should be no problem ;D ;D
Funny you say that. There are videos of dudes shooting aspirin out of the air with slingshots and making a lot of crazy trick shots with them. I bet if you had one strong enough, with a nice tungsten carbide ball, you could kill almost anything
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There's a big difference between a "slingshot" & a sling. You get a lot my horsepower out of a sling than a slingshot, wrist-rocket, etc.
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This much i can attest to.
A ball bearing or marble launched from a powerful slingshot is nothing to play about with or take lightly. My brothers and i used to hunt with these things when i was a lot younger, and we more often than not had complete pass through shots on lots of iguanas and possums when taking body shots.
The key is finding the right weight of projectile in relation to the maximum propulsion force of the bands.
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Pellet thread or a pig kill thread ? ::)
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Pellet thread or a pig kill thread ? ::)
Threads take tangents, it's part of informative discussions.
Tell you what, there's Forums out there that would edit/nuke everything that goes slightly astray from the OP subject,.....I sure rather have it this way where grown ups can freely talk without censorship.
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Pellet thread or a pig kill thread ? ::)
Threads take tangents, it's part of informative discussions.
Tell you what, there's Forums out there that would edit/nuke everything that goes slightly astray from the OP subject,.....I sure rather have it this way where grown ups can freely talk without censorship.
+1. I dont see harm in a question getting answered if its still about airguns and hunting ;) The question kinda pertains to this thread so no harm imho.
Manny I wish I could use airguns for hunting big game in MT it would bring that rush back to hunting for me. We dont have wild pigs and the largest animal I can hunt with an airgun here is a coyote. I might have to give that a go it should provide some good adrenaline rush calling one in close enough for the .25 Mrod to take a good head shot. So now that you have taken a large animal with a low powered break barrel will you give it another try or was it a one and done deal?
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Pellet thread or a pig kill thread ? ::)
Tangents are acceptable as long as they don't hijack the thread entirely ;) ;D
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I would like to tell you my point of view.
Manny, he knows, is in a challenge much bigger than this specific and very successful chapter. Even when you have done all the preparation and you have accomplished your part as the shooter, you can’t be sure if the pellet will penetrate enough to actually reach the brain. Once you have chosen the frontal headshot, there is the ultimate and critical borderline to cross – the cranial vault thickness. Manny knows all that and, also, that a good part of the adrenaline, he is looking for, comes from this uncertainty, once you are not using a super PCP.
That thickness increases a LOT as the hog gets older. Manny knows that. There will be other chapters, eventually with older hogs, so, what kind of pellet should be used to maximize the chances? Manny has chosen well the Baracuda Match. But, considering the critical penetration feature, could be available a better option?
Beyond congratulating Manny for his excellent performance, I just wanted to contribute.
I’ve noticed the HN Baracuda Power that, theoretically, should be better regarding penetration, and I’ve suggested to Manny to do some penetration tests. As his profile is to be extremely focused on all this, Manny could had also noticed by himself.
After I’ve simply suggested, it happens I’ve also noticed that bad surprise regarding fpe. I realized I could be inducing to an error or, at least, a waste of money, time and expectations. So, I just wanted to alert Manny, and whoever may be interested about what is behind the scenes, about that tricky perception = same weight, copper plated, 20% harder.
Unfortunately, HN has confirmed to the Baracuda Power what some people here was already suspecting = its harder surface implies in poorer adaption to the barrel.
So, at least to those able to know what I’m talking about, I sincerely can’t agree to consider this information even near of a kind of ‘off topic’.
Marcos
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I usually don't care too much if a thread wanders a little. If it veers totally off and never comes back to the OPs question, then it becomes a problem. I've been known to gently suggest taking a TOT discussion somewhere else.
Is it off topic to discuss whether a thread went off topic? :o
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Pellet thread or a pig kill thread ? ::)
Threads take tangents, it's part of informative discussions.
Tell you what, there's Forums out there that would edit/nuke everything that goes slightly astray from the OP subject,.....I sure rather have it this way where grown ups can freely talk without censorship.
+1. I dont see harm in a question getting answered if its still about airguns and hunting ;) The question kinda pertains to this thread so no harm imho.
Manny I wish I could use airguns for hunting big game in MT it would bring that rush back to hunting for me. We dont have wild pigs and the largest animal I can hunt with an airgun here is a coyote. I might have to give that a go it should provide some good adrenaline rush calling one in close enough for the .25 Mrod to take a good head shot. So now that you have taken a large animal with a low powered break barrel will you give it another try or was it a one and done deal?
Now that I know for a fact that I can take a hog up to this size, break barrels are going on the back burner, ......there if needed in the future.
I want to get into air pistol hunting where it's more of a walk, spot and stalk affair rather than blind/Hambush hunting,
something interesting looks like it's coming to the market so I'm keeping my eye open ;)
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Ok I can be patient when I need to I am curious as to which PCP pistol you are going to end up with
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Lol I love that "hambush" ;)
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;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
That term got coined several years back in my Bowhunting days.
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I have the chance to hunt hogs in southern ohio,a guy has a farm and sees them alot.he says it looks like some may be over 120lbs.i think with a good shot the 25 Synrod should put one down.i never hunted hogs yet.the pirate has inspired me to go for it...any tips for me?going to bait them in I think?thanks pirate.
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Baiting will always make for a more conducive hunt and as long you study well where and when to shoot them the .25 Marauder will be fine.
I don't know about those hogs over there but the hogs here have no curiosity what so ever, once they feel even in the slightest that there's something amiss they are gone in a flash.
Either way, have fun and don't get discouraged if you don't get one in the fist outing or even in the fist few.
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Baiting will always make for a more conducive hunt and as long you study well where and when to shoot them the .25 Marauder will be fine.
I don't know about those hogs over there but the hogs here have no curiosity what so ever, once they feel even in the slightest that there's something amiss they are gone in a flash.
Either way, have fun and don't get discouraged if you don't get one in the fist outing or even in the fist few.
Manny, your post made me wonder why they are so spooky there. What are there natural predators? I would think they're not over hunted there. Maybe it's just the close quarters and short visability of the jungle?
Up here there are coyotes, and in some places cougars and bobcats.
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...your post made me wonder why they are so spooky there.
They've all heard of Manny by now...
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They've all heard of Manny by now...
Well there's that... :D
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Baiting will always make for a more conducive hunt and as long you study well where and when to shoot them the .25 Marauder will be fine.
I don't know about those hogs over there but the hogs here have no curiosity what so ever, once they feel even in the slightest that there's something amiss they are gone in a flash.
Either way, have fun and don't get discouraged if you don't get one in the fist outing or even in the fist few.
Manny, your post made me wonder why they are so spooky there. What are there natural predators? I would think they're not over hunted there. Maybe it's just the close quarters and short visability of the jungle?
Up here there are coyotes, and in some places cougars and bobcats.
No natural predators but they are hunted hard with dogs here, very much the Hawaiian foremost hunting method.
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No natural predators but they are hunted hard with dogs here, very much the Hawaiian foremost hunting method.
Thanks Manny, I had no idea they would allow that. I'm sure the hogs do a lot of damage there.
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Hogs here in California in my County do Thousands of dollars of damage every year to the ag industry. I am battling them right now in oat fields. Cal fish and game make them out to be this great game annimal when they are nothing but a damaging nuisance pest. When my career is over I don,t want to say I killed all of the pigs I want to say I killed the last one. I need more Manny's. Wolfer
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Indeed they are,
Tough animals that procreate very fast.
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I still go back to watch that video and get a big grin on my face :) :)
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I still go back to watch that video and get a big grin on my face :) :)
Me too ;) Great hunt, great video (classic, like High Noon)
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Baiting will always make for a more conducive hunt and as long you study well where and when to shoot them the .25 Marauder will be fine.
I don't know about those hogs over there but the hogs here have no curiosity what so ever, once they feel even in the slightest that there's something amiss they are gone in a flash.
Either way, have fun and don't get discouraged if you don't get one in the fist outing or even in the fist few.
Manny, your post made me wonder why they are so spooky there. What are there natural predators? I would think they're not over hunted there. Maybe it's just the close quarters and short visability of the jungle?
Up here there are coyotes, and in some places cougars and bobcats.
No natural predators but they are hunted hard with dogs here, very much the Hawaiian foremost hunting method.
Hunting with dogs here has became a sport in itself with dogs train to track and find the hogs, then they release the pit bull's that will go in, latch onto the hog and hold it down. Then they can tie it up and keep it alive until there done hunting. Not my cup of tea.
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It's a sloppy, noisy, intrusive hunting method.
No hunting done by Humans, all they do is follow the dogs that do the hunting itself, if there's dogs hunters in the area ( even a large area ) your day is done, they ruin it for everybody else, done.
Dogs don't differentiate from grown hogs to babies hogs, they'll tear anything apart, .....milking saw ? no problem just tear it up :(
I honestly despise those slobs, no finesse just pure disruption.
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Hey Manny did you get look at the Hatson 125 . Just wondering if you looked at other choices. Hope all is well. Wolfer
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Hey Manny did you get look at the Hatson 125 . Just wondering if you looked at other choices. Hope all is well. Wolfer
Well, I used to have a Walther Talon .25 ( basically a 125 ) a Torpedo 100 in .22 a Hatsan 135 in .22 and one of those break barrel Hatsan pistols so I'm pretty familiar with the Hatsan models,
also I had several Crosman Nitro pistons and in the end I think I prefer the Benjamin/Crosmans
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Manny thanks for the reply. Got this thing about taking a coyote with a break barrel. Thanks again. Wolfer
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Manny
You really need to retitle the vid in NP2 format
People buying these shooters can use your experience
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That is the one thing that has been in the back of my mind since embarking into this,
I don't want to make people think this is an easily achievable feat, even I with all the work that I put into it, wouldn't make an habit of this,....not something that can be taken lightly.
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Manny, if you're up to a little tinkering, I have a little write-up on making the trigger like "buttah".
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I don,t take anything lightly when it comes to killing coyotes. Have been working on getting them to slow down when coming to the by trying some different types of attention props. It's not going to be easy and I won,t and can,t chance calling one and not taking it. I will have my calling rifle and shotgun with me when I try.It has been a education everyday trying to figures these guys out. Thanks again for your advice. Wolfer
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Thanks.
Yeah, I worry more about the general population ( Forum dwellers are more educated/responsible......well most :) )
I worry about those that watch the U tube or see the pictures and think " if it's that easy I'm gonna do it too "
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We pack hunt in Texas in County's bigger then entire mainland States
Your in a box surrounded by water,thats the sucky part of small town living as we say here.
Taking pigs with dogs and NO FIREARMS is what real hunting is about
Push a spear into a 280lb+porker and survive,you can say you have hunted
Popping one with a pellet gun is pretty nifty too :)
It's a sloppy, noisy, intrusive hunting method.
No hunting done by Humans, all they do is follow the dogs that do the hunting itself, if there's dogs hunters in the area ( even a large area ) your day is done, they ruin it for everybody else, done.
Dogs don't differentiate from grown hogs to babies hogs, they'll tear anything apart, .....milking saw ? no problem just tear it up :(
I honestly despise those slobs, no finesse just pure disruption.
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We pack hunt in Texas in County's bigger then entire mainland States
Your in a box surrounded by water,thats the sucky part of small town living as we say here.
Taking pigs with dogs and NO FIREARMS is what real hunting is about
Push a spear into a 280lb+porker and survive,you can say you have hunted
Popping one with a pellet gun is pretty nifty too :)
It's a sloppy, noisy, intrusive hunting method.
No hunting done by Humans, all they do is follow the dogs that do the hunting itself, if there's dogs hunters in the area ( even a large area ) your day is done, they ruin it for everybody else, done.
Dogs don't differentiate from grown hogs to babies hogs, they'll tear anything apart, .....milking saw ? no problem just tear it up :(
I honestly despise those slobs, no finesse just pure disruption.
Ho Well, to each their own.
Never seen the sport in poking a tired, scared Hog ( even with a knife ) after it's been chased, battered and is held by dogs from both ears and both legs, just not my cup of tea,....wanna say you have hunted ? Go look for and find a hog in thick jungle terrain, no firearm back up, alone, no dogs and take a -/+ 10 yards shot with a homemade primitive bow,....but than again, that is a discussion for a different venue.
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Correct in some respects
Bow = Distance
Spear = you feel every quiver of the life leaving the animal
as you hold the spear engaged to the last quiver of life.
9/10 failed to hold their lunch,7/10 wouldnt engage at all
Grown Man Business isnt about opinion or being a male species
We do 10 hunts a month in reasonable weather,we are Charity and all donated funds go to Cancer
WE have well over 4K males that failed the man test in 6 yrs.
They are better men today without question
We pack hunt in Texas in County's bigger then entire mainland States
Your in a box surrounded by water,thats the sucky part of small town living as we say here.
Taking pigs with dogs and NO FIREARMS is what real hunting is about
Push a spear into a 280lb+porker and survive,you can say you have hunted
Popping one with a pellet gun is pretty nifty too :)
It's a sloppy, noisy, intrusive hunting method.
No hunting done by Humans, all they do is follow the dogs that do the hunting itself, if there's dogs hunters in the area ( even a large area ) your day is done, they ruin it for everybody else, done.
Dogs don't differentiate from grown hogs to babies hogs, they'll tear anything apart, .....milking saw ? no problem just tear it up :(
I honestly despise those slobs, no finesse just pure disruption.
Ho Well, to each their own.
Never seen the sport in poking a tired, scared Hog ( even with a knife ) after it's been chased, battered and is held by dogs from both ears and both legs, just not my cup of tea,....wanna say you have hunted ? Go look for and find a hog in thick jungle terrain, no firearm back up, alone, no dogs and take a -/+ 10 yards shot with a homemade primitive bow,....but than again, that is a discussion for a different venue.
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My point exactly, you don't do the hunting just the killing.
Take pleasure for the act, and feel the quivering......again, I rather do the hunting.
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If you some how think its easy to run hogs down your a sandwich or two short for the day work Sir
Real pack hunting isnt what media sources show you it is
Man and Dog hunting go back a very good ways
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Ho well, I'm out,
I'm not here to debate this, ......Still think that dog hunting is lame :) :)
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You get the WIN Manny!!
Again thanks for thread
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:D Not to digress but as my dad always said at the end of the day and first thing in the morning as long as you like the guy in the mirror you can;t be all bad or all wrong. When I lived in Virginia there were guys who ran deer with dogs and I understand why some of them did it . When deer are pushed they will invariably run in a large circle. I never hunted that way but to each his own
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Thanks.
Yeah, I worry more about the general population ( Forum dwellers are more educated/responsible......well most :) )
I worry about those that watch the U tube or see the pictures and think " if it's that easy I'm gonna do it too "
Most of em (me included) couldn't sit for four hours waiting for the right shot, even if they had the right baiting in the right place at the right time. Never mind hunting or shooting skills! Yes, you made it look easy, no, it's not - not even close...
I think I'll go watch it again ;D
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Manny your video is fantastic on so many levels and a viewer can take away much from it. I know I did. My first impression of the hunt was the skilled take down and next that beautiful healthy animal causing me to wonder more about the natural habitat. I'd enjoy hearing more about your environment and general numbers of hogs in the area. Probably like anywhere, good years and bad years?
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Great shot!
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I've got a lot of time in behind hounds chasing lions, bears and it is a good clean method of hunting. I have killed a hog in my younger days with a knife,don,t know how many critters I've taken in my 62 years but the killing of anything with a knife is just not for me. I,ve put the hammer down on a lot coyotes in traps and snares over my career have never made a game of it.Not trying to offend anyone just my own personal view. Wolfer
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Manny your video is fantastic on so many levels and a viewer can take away much from it. I know I did. My first impression of the hunt was the skilled take down and next that beautiful healthy animal causing me to wonder more about the natural habitat. I'd enjoy hearing more about your environment and general numbers of hogs in the area. Probably like anywhere, good years and bad years?
Thanks a lot,
Well, climate here is very moderate year long, there's no natural predators, fruit, nuts, roots, worms, snails and all kinds of food is plentiful,
water also is plentiful, steep remote mountains with very thick vegetation make for great cover/hiding,.....so they do thrive and live live great :)
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Thank you Manny. Elevation?
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Thank you Manny. Elevation?
Elevation on this hunt, or elevation of the mountains around here ?
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More on mountains around there. With the thick tropical brush I can imagine some thin trails with ledges.
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OK than,
there's 2 mountain ranges on my island, the one I was hunting this time is lower and is in the plus 2000 feet range, I hunt usually in the 800-1200 feet range.
the other one tops in the plus 4000 feet range and when I hunt it I stay around the 2000 feet mark,..more or less.
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I been at it hard and not seen a hog close to shoot yet.i back at it in the morning.
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Incredible, how far were you from it in the blind.
May i suggest a nice balsamic glaze for the finali!?
loved it
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Dang, this thread still going :) :)
Well, thanks fist of all, Distance was 17 yards.
Keep at it Mark, .....it will happen eventually.
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Nice shooting Manny... Impressive 😎
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Hey Manny got my Summit Nitro 2 on Friday,have put about 250 pellets through it. I. Have a good dealing about this gun. Will keep you updated on hunt success after getting it tuned. On a unrelated note a good friend of mine has been surfing for a long time 45 years about is taking me for my first attempt. That's what happens by a campfire in the high country hunting camp with a little Jack added. Will happen on my 62 birthday. Just before buck season. Wolfer
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Once again a great job, thanks for sharing.
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since the pirate inspired me I post this here.i also may add that I was wore out in this picture from stalking this thing for 500 yards or so and shooting it with a 25 Synrod.it was a ton of work and for a 160lb hog one needs a more powerful gun that a stock 25 Synrod.
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So, ....you got that one with a Marauder .25 ?
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yep the 25 Synrod.it wore me out but worth it.
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Cool, well done.
Pretty exciting to Hog hunt with a lowly pellet gun, right ?
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it was a good hunt and it wore me out,the 25 needed more power but stopped it.hills are steep,the hogs liked to stay on the old logging roads so my partner forced them around too me and they started to root around in some leaves then I shot him in the head,looked like he was going down but wouldn't fall I put one in his lung and he went down after going some distance around the mountain.i may try it again if I get more power tuned in my Syrod.
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Congratulations for the accomplishment!
Would you mind to tell us about which pellet and the headshot placement (front or side)?
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I used the 33.9 JSB hit it one inch above/between the eyes, as he rooted in the leaves.the single lung is what put it down after going around the mountain.i feel the 25 Synrod in its present state of tune is not enough to drop a 160lb hog in its tracks.i not tore into the head yet to see just what damage pellets caused...as it quartered away I put one in his lung and it coughed blood leaving a good trail for many hundreds of yards...say what you will about shot placement but I been there with that size hag and a stock 25 Syrod seems weak on game that size...I was 25 yards above it on the side of a mountain...I do know its gonna tastes great...
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Congrats Mark. I'll bet that was an adrenaline rush.
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thank you.it was the toughest hunt I ever was on.
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Yeah, the stock Marauder might be a bit on the weak side to hunt sizable hogs,...also the JSB would have not been my pellet of choice, Benjamin or Baracuda would have be what I would have concentrated on.
Nominal FPE is a bit deceiving in this situations, I rather use a pellet that is harder in composition and that travels a bit faster, I don't think a Marauder shoots those soft 34gr JSB at much speed right ?
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I wouldn't have used the 34gr JSB either. The velocity in a stock Mrod is around 780-790fps with the power turned up. For game that big I 'd want to be around 850-900 with a hard pellet. The JSB's are too soft for deep penetration through a hard surface.
Try a Condor .25 with a 31gr Baracuda, or a Sumatra .25 with a 28.4gr EunJin if you can on those bigger hogs. 70fpe with a stock Condor (24" barrel @ 1,000fps) will do the job with a 31gr Cuda "between the eyes". 80fpe with a heavier hammer even better.
Harry
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A Sumatra Carbine .22 using EunJin 28gr and 32gr is a great gun for taking down boars with a precise brain shot,
also it's so light that makes for a great Hunter on those long stalks :)
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I wouldn't have used the 34gr JSB either. The velocity in a stock Mrod is around 780-790fps with the power turned up. For game that big I 'd want to be around 850-900 with a hard pellet. The JSB's are too soft for deep penetration through a hard surface.
Try a Condor .25 with a 31gr Baracuda, or a Sumatra .25 with a 28.4gr EunJin if you can on those bigger hogs. 70fpe with a stock Condor (24" barrel @ 1,000fps) will do the job with a 31gr Cuda "between the eyes". 80fpe with a heavier hammer even better.
Harry
Harry, EunJin .25 cal are 35gr and 43gr...the 35gr I've never found to be great on any gun,
Sumatra 25s also love the 31gr Baracuda and 28gr Benjamin.
Dang,......9000 posts ?
Gotta get a life :(
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I wouldn't have used the 34gr JSB either. The velocity in a stock Mrod is around 780-790fps with the power turned up. For game that big I 'd want to be around 850-900 with a hard pellet. The JSB's are too soft for deep penetration through a hard surface.
Try a Condor .25 with a 31gr Baracuda, or a Sumatra .25 with a 28.4gr EunJin if you can on those bigger hogs. 70fpe with a stock Condor (24" barrel @ 1,000fps) will do the job with a 31gr Cuda "between the eyes". 80fpe with a heavier hammer even better.
Harry
Harry, EunJin .25 cal are 35gr and 43gr...the 35gr I've never found to be great on any gun,
Sumatra 25s also love the 31gr Baracuda and 28gr Benjamin.
Dang,......9000 posts ?
Gotta get a life :(
Happy 9000!
;D
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9001! Heck NP, when do you get the time to hunt? LOL!!!
pv
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I did think about a different pellet choice but I went with the highest grain.i am getting SSG and H.E. valve to up the power in the 25.i may try again will more power.i also thought about a 30 cal barrel...I have also seen a 257 I looking into...thanks.
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For the bigger ones, as there is a MUCH thicker and, most probably, harder bone to the front headshot, what do you think about alternatives to hit the brain:
- side headshot (between eye and ear);
- eye shot;
Assuming when the nose is pointing to the shooter as 6 o'clock, what should be the 'angle(s)' to an eye shot hit the brain? In this case, also vertical head positioning should be taken in consideration?
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For the bigger ones, as there is a MUCH thicker and, most probably, harder bone to the front headshot, what do you think about alternatives to hit the brain:
- side headshot (between eye and ear);
- eye shot;
Assuming when the nose is pointing to the shooter as 6 o'clock, what should be the 'angle(s)' to an eye shot hit the brain? In this case, also vertical head positioning should be taken in consideration?
all good points.i thinking of cutting the skull open just to see if that what I should try...
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Trying to learn more about small calibers airguns x bigger hogs .., maybe the heart could be (also) a placement.
If still in time to available crude ribs.., I would also try to shoot those "first" ones (low ends) to learn if they would be a though shield to the heart.
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interesting topic,for body shots the softer jsb 34 grains have advantages i think. but dunno how tough the skin with fat layer is on the chest where the vital organs are ?
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I wouldn't even remotely consider the body shot on hogs with a small bore PCP and pellets.
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I am pretty sure GTA member Bullfrog has wily hog on his property that took 2 or 3 slugs from 7.62×54r that still lives today. No doubt he can place the shot, he can shoot just fine. My stepson's dad and grandpa both shot one several times together with a .30/06 and 12 guage slugs before it fell. They kill them all the time, usually with one shot. More often than not, one solid hit from a powerful centerfire rifle will bowl them over, drt. A lot of dudes kill them with just 5.56 fmj right through the shoulder. But sometimes they don't die. I wouldn't expect a pellet .25 cal and below, through the lungs or heart, to give even a 50/50 chance of recovery on a hog- and forget about killing quickly. He will run a long way before boeeding out. Not like an arrow, blood loss is too slow. Not like a bullet, not enough shock or penetrstion. And trying to get the perfect heart shot lined up through the ribs... might as well be a brain shot.
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alright understood,i never shot a hog in my life but i know i have to wait em up instead of walking up to them for sure now.
Its a waste to wound the hog and scare the others for a long time,i rather shoot one another day/night then.
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I have killed quite a few depredation hogs with 22 Cal centerfires. Bullet weights from 43 to 55 grains and have not had any survive. This being said shot placement is critical. Most were 125 yrds and less with standing shots only taken. But again these were taken with high fps center fire varmit cals. My biggest was with a REM 222 at about 90 yrds with a high shoulder shot that vapor locked him,50 grain softpoint. This hog was well over 250 lbs in a large open flat. No experience with air on hogs due to the fact we can,t take here in my great state with air guns. Manny by far has the most knowledge and experience at this game, he's a bad !!!s.Pretty good boyer also, is kind of a legend with his craftsman ship and native wood self bows. Wolfer
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UPDATE I cooking the hog now
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UPDATE I cooking the hog now
Yeahhhhh :) :)
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I have killed quite a few depredation hogs with 22 Cal centerfires. Bullet weights from 43 to 55 grains and have not had any survive. This being said shot placement is critical. Most were 125 yrds and less with standing shots only taken. But again these were taken with high fps center fire varmit cals. My biggest was with a REM 222 at about 90 yrds with a high shoulder shot that vapor locked him,50 grain softpoint. This hog was well over 250 lbs in a large open flat. No experience with air on hogs due to the fact we can,t take here in my great state with air guns. Manny by far has the most knowledge and experience at this game, he's a bad !!!s.Pretty good boyer also, is kind of a legend with his craftsman ship and native wood self bows. Wolfer
:) :) :) Thanks Brother,....Don't know about the Legend part, but..... I can held my own :)
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I have killed quite a few depredation hogs with 22 Cal centerfires. Bullet weights from 43 to 55 grains and have not had any survive. This being said shot placement is critical. Most were 125 yrds and less with standing shots only taken. But again these were taken with high fps center fire varmit cals. My biggest was with a REM 222 at about 90 yrds with a high shoulder shot that vapor locked him,50 grain softpoint. This hog was well over 250 lbs in a large open flat. No experience with air on hogs due to the fact we can,t take here in my great state with air guns. Manny by far has the most knowledge and experience at this game, he's a bad !!!s.Pretty good boyer also, is kind of a legend with his craftsman ship and native wood self bows. Wolfer
:) :) :) Thanks Brother,....Don't know about the Legend part, but..... I can held my own :)
Legend!
8)
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ill ask just to keep the thread alive ;) wouldnt a 51 grain boat tail bullet at 900 fps in the vital organ area within lets say 50 yards slow the pig down that much that a quick deadly follow up shot is possible ?
If not fine,but sometimes its hard to just let game walk if you see them !
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Not entirely sure but from all I have seen from the really successful Pellet rifle hunters especially for larger game seem to prefer the fuse box for quick humane kill shots since the pellet rifles do not deliver 900 fps down range that speed is 1 to 3 feet from the muzzle. The pellet relies on penetration and there is little hydro-static shock delivered to the target so fuse box kills seem to be best and if you plan to eat the meat no searching for the pellet required :D
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ill ask just to keep the thread alive ;) wouldnt a 51 grain boat tail bullet at 900 fps in the vital organ area within lets say 50 yards slow the pig down that much that a quick deadly follow up shot is possible ?
If not fine,but sometimes its hard to just let game walk if you see them !
You might get a double lung penetration but might not and either way I think a long tracking session will follow,
You might be successful with a direct heart shot, but at that point you might as well go for the brain shot, they are about the same size,
but the Heart is protected by shield and ribs, also the brain shot drops it there a heart shot even if successful will still require tracking.
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I had a long track to follow,hog i shot had huge bone over his shoulder.pellet removal coming(sawsall)up,didnt fine the pellet that got to the lung.
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alright so patience and selfcontrol then here.
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Any time you force the shot you run the risk of injuring the prey vs a clean and humane kill
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ill ask just to keep the thread alive ;) wouldnt a 51 grain boat tail bullet at 900 fps in the vital organ area within lets say 50 yards slow the pig down that much that a quick deadly follow up shot is possible ?
If not fine,but sometimes its hard to just let game walk if you see them !
You might get a double lung penetration but might not and either way I think a long tracking session will follow,
You might be successful with a direct heart shot, but at that point you might as well go for the brain shot, they are about the same size,
but the Heart is protected by shield and ribs, also the brain shot drops it there a heart shot even if successful will still require tracking.
Manny,
Great shot and a question ? With your Crosman, what velocity were you getting with Kodiaks, just curious ?
wll2506
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Thanks Will,
650 fps with the Baracuda 21gr
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Thanks Will,
650 fps with the Baracuda 21gr
Great, thank you for the info. I can't get that fpe out of my most of my springers but with my my Hatsan 95 and 125's I can. (No problem with the PCP's)
My Hatsan EDGE gives me 665fps with 18.1 gr Exact Heavies, but that is not quite enough and the pellet does not have the penetration of a Kodiak. My B19 clone is medium power 655fps with Exacts, and that is a good gun, but not a 20fpe gun by a long shot.
Your video and explanation of what you did to harvest this animal is great and reiterates the importance of pellet placement and "ENERGY On TARGET"
wll2506
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another great hunt, story, and video Manny.
Well done, and thanks for sharing.
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another great hunt, story, and video Manny.
Well done, and thanks for sharing.
Thanks Brother,
You guys might not realise how much I appreciate all this kind of comments.
Since the beginning I've tried as much as I possibly can not to just post kill pictures but also bring everybody along in the preparation for different hunts, .....explain the hunting methods,
where, how and when to shoot, the constant necessity to study anatomy and quarry natural interaction with the enviroment,
extreme testing of the intended weapon and ammo chosen, and even the end result after the hunt with the meal on the table :)
In the end the Kill is the smallest part of the hunt, there's much revolving around it to make it happen,
OK, just came back from surfing and had a couple of drinks and got keyboard happy :) :)
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another great hunt, story, and video Manny.
Well done, and thanks for sharing.
Thanks Brother,
You guys might not realise how much I appreciate all this kind of comments.
Since the beginning I've tried as much as I possibly can not to just post kill pictures but also bring everybody along in the preparation for different hunts, .....explain the hunting methods,
where, how and when to shoot, the constant necessity to study anatomy and quarry natural interaction with the enviroment,
extreme testing of the intended weapon and ammo chosen, and even the end result after the hunt with the meal on the table :)
In the end the Kill is the smallest part of the hunt, there's much revolving around it to make it happen,
OK, just came back from surfing and had a couple of drinks and got keyboard happy :) :)
That's the main part of what makes your hunting posts so enjoyable to read.
Ditto for Shadows (Ed's) posts. They read like a detailed, informative story.
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another great hunt, story, and video Manny.
Well done, and thanks for sharing.
Thanks Brother,
You guys might not realise how much I appreciate all this kind of comments.
Since the beginning I've tried as much as I possibly can not to just post kill pictures but also bring everybody along in the preparation for different hunts, .....explain the hunting methods,
where, how and when to shoot, the constant necessity to study anatomy and quarry natural interaction with the enviroment,
extreme testing of the intended weapon and ammo chosen, and even the end result after the hunt with the meal on the table :)
In the end the Kill is the smallest part of the hunt, there's much revolving around it to make it happen,
OK, just came back from surfing and had a couple of drinks and got keyboard happy :) :)
The really great thing is you make us all feel like we too can do it and you show us how!
All you have to do is get to know the rifle really well, know which pellet can hit the bull over and over, know that one MUST understand the first cold shot may not go where the warmed-up rifle puts them, so fully investigate how it behaves first shot and at what the expected temperature may be, know the anatomy, FPE at POI, the feeding habits of the game, and like you be patient knowing it may take many hours for the shot to show itself.
Still your skills are exemplary as many will mess up due to the adrenalin of the moment, but we learn so much from your posts --- THANK YOU!!!!
(To those who didn't learn and have to chase their quarry for hours ... study up and see how the master does it ;) ;) ;) --- Thanks again Manny ;D
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Besides sharing Manny's adventures, I'm being educated about the chances of different shot placements for - a hog's clean kill - with a 20+ fpe springer .22 and the good penetration of the Baracuda pellet.
I'm assuming the secure distance would be up to 20 yards.
For the younger ones - go for a careful frontal headshot.
For the bigger/older ones..
- a frontal headshot most probably won't penetrate the thicker cranium vault to hit the brain;
- a side headshot is a trickier/riskier way to the brain, and may deviate;
- even with a successful penetration, a perfect shot to the heart won't make a huge wound channel to produce a huge bleeding; so, a lot of suffering and tracking.
At last, and for the bigger ones, could a shot through the eye be a feasible way to a clean kill? If so, what shooting angle should be considered for the "perfect" eye shot?
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OK, just came back from surfing and had a couple of drinks and got keyboard happy :) :)
This is the kind of thing that makes it really hard to like you!!! Enjoy, my friend!!
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I'd not recommend a shot to the eye itself Marcos. If at all possible a shot just behind the eye with the pellet travelling towards the opposite side of the head or towards the back of the head will always be the better shot.
The thing to remember when taking shots at larger animals with smaller calibers is that the smaller pellet carries less energy, so we need to make the absolute most of what limited energy it carries to the target. Easiest way to do that is to select the spot with the least amount of mass in front of the vital organ you want to hit. With a shot to the eyeball, the pellet has to pass through the eye, then the cranial cavity to reach the brain then must still have enough energy left to do sufficient damage to the brain for an effective kill. Then you have to consider there may be deflection of the pellet that'd cause you to miss your mark and wind up witu less than the ideal results you would be looking for and result in a badly injured animal running off & suffering for weeks or dying hours later after becoming irretrievable.
Its just simpler to just take the profile shot or the full frontal shot at a range you know the pellet will perform well at.
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Besides sharing Manny's adventures, I'm being educated about the chances of different shot placements for - a hog's clean kill - with a 20+ fpe springer .22 and the good penetration of the Baracuda pellet.
I'm assuming the secure distance would be up to 20 yards.
For the younger ones - go for a careful frontal headshot.
For the bigger/older ones..
- a frontal headshot most probably won't penetrate the thicker cranium vault to hit the brain;
- a side headshot is a trickier/riskier way to the brain, and may deviate;
- even with a successful penetration, a perfect shot to the heart won't make a huge wound channel to produce a huge bleeding; so, a lot of suffering and tracking.
At last, and for the bigger ones, could a shot through the eye be a feasible way to a clean kill? If so, what shooting angle should be considered for the "perfect" eye shot?
Not a fan of the Eye shot with a small bore, not that I have any data to back it up :) ...since I've never actually tried it.
Anyway, lets look at some skull pictures and try actually figure out the possible dynamic of an Eye shot with a small bore.
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d124/NorthShoreLB/002_zpsc9e37b1c.jpg) (http://s34.photobucket.com/user/NorthShoreLB/media/002_zpsc9e37b1c.jpg.html)(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d124/NorthShoreLB/013_zpsce001169.jpg) (http://s34.photobucket.com/user/NorthShoreLB/media/013_zpsce001169.jpg.html)
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d124/NorthShoreLB/001-2-1-1.jpg) (http://s34.photobucket.com/user/NorthShoreLB/media/001-2-1-1.jpg.html)
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d124/NorthShoreLB/DSCF1856_zpsqkibrtl1.jpg) (http://s34.photobucket.com/user/NorthShoreLB/media/DSCF1856_zpsqkibrtl1.jpg.html)
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d124/NorthShoreLB/DSCF1417_zpsaotrihpy.jpg) (http://s34.photobucket.com/user/NorthShoreLB/media/DSCF1417_zpsaotrihpy.jpg.html)
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d124/NorthShoreLB/DSCF1416_zpshths3j6u.jpg) (http://s34.photobucket.com/user/NorthShoreLB/media/DSCF1416_zpshths3j6u.jpg.html)
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d124/NorthShoreLB/DSCF1618_zpsqmhf6imo.jpg) (http://s34.photobucket.com/user/NorthShoreLB/media/DSCF1618_zpsqmhf6imo.jpg.html)
Ok now, we have several different pictures from different angles,
what do we see ? .......I see a pretty deep optical cavity with a difficult angle to reach the brain, also you can tell there's no direct route to the brain and you still have to punch a hole on the skull bone.
What do I see happening ?
you have to get that pellet to go past a significant amount of tissue in the eyeball, by the time it reaches the concave bone who knows where it's going to actually hit and unless you hit that concave square it could skip and be redirected in many ways end might not even penetrate and just bounce around.
I consider the Eye shot with a small bore a very low percentage shot and I won't even considerate it on a Porker,.......now if someone comes up with some serious data and proves it to be a conducive shot I'll be happy to change my mind and use it :) :)
as it is now the more used and proven options have showed that they work and work well.
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Very nice Manny, Dropped him quick, I've been trying to get a friend of mine to get the Trail NP2, I'll show him the video and the pictures, I think that will convince him, great shooting there and some Piggy for the BBQ..................
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thanks kevin.
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Manny, thank you for your comments, pictures and .. patience.
My hypothetic scenario is – whatever the reason, you only have FEW opportunities to hog hunting; you did all the careful preparation, waited for a long time at the blind, and ONLY the older ones are showing up; distances ok, they stay for enough time.., but ONLY the older ones. Once you have the commitment with yourself for a clean kill, to shoot - or NO!? ???
“(..)the more used and proven options have showed that they work and work well.”
Being 8+ k miles away from you.. ;D, I would dare to disagree – the above is true if you are with a 20+ fpe for the younger or with a powerful PCP for all of them.
At the current point of my education for a hog clean kill (20+ fpe), and without the eye shot option, I would not try the other options for the older ones, and just let them go.
(or get the PCP “100” fpe I borrowed just in case) ::)
Seriously, trying to explore more this theoretical option.
“(..) you have to get that pellet to go past a significant amount of tissue in the eyeball, by the time it reaches the concave bone (..)”
I’m considering the Baracuda Match because the accuracy we can have for the shot placement we choose.
So, with the Baracuda 21 gr, to the first part of the way (tissue in the eyeball), I’m pretty optimist considering the great job done by Bob/rstern –
http://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=42959.msg401137#msg401137 (http://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=42959.msg401137#msg401137)
As to the base to my optimism, please notice the medium he has used was, in his pretty objective feelings, “(..) maybe pretty accurate for a combination of hide, muscle, and bone.... (..)”.
Without hide and bone.., piece of cake through the tissue in the eyeball?
To the second part (“concave bone”), I’m just GUESSING this bone would be "significantly" more fragile (thickness + hardness) than the frontal head bone (for the OLDER). Maybe you can have your expert feelings checking this?
About the (hypothetic) careful ‘positioning’, and considering the skull at the left on your 4th picture, it SEEMS to me: a) the blind has to be on the ground for an “horizontal” shot; b) the hog head has to be also “horizontal” (not down, when eating corn on the ground); c) the angle should be “4” or “8” o’clock (at 6 o’clock the hog is looking right to you).
What do you think?
(if you please, don’t forget your hunter patience.. ;D)
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I will get back to this later, just came back from Polo and don't have much energy ;D ;D ;D
One thing,
No matter what, **wait for the perfect shot or let it walk !!**
The one hog I lost I was shooting a .357 at 200 FPE, it was getting late and was starting to rain hard so I took a non perfect shot thinking the power and caliber would bail me out.
Guess what,......That hog span a 360 degree turn and run away never to be seen again :o
I learned my lesson.
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So when are you going to take a hog with .177?
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So when are you going to take a hog with .177?
:) ....I guess I could power up my Daughter's Disco and see if I can get 20+ FPE and than see if she's accurate with the Baracudas
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Interesting....hog with a .177. If anyone can get it done brother Manny can. ;) We have some hogs running around here up north and it's a shoot on sight and just report their location. I would more then enjoy getting up there with one of my Magnum .177 springers and put in the time scouting, setting up and dropping some bacon. We be watching brother Manny and have no doubt your up for the challenge. Ed
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So when are you going to take a hog with .177?
I've shot 2 white lipped peccary with the .177 already, so I am 100% certain its easily doable. But I will say this much, ammo selection & velocity are very important, & the pin point precision needed becomes almost critical. I recommend nothing under 13 grains, hard alloy, & moving no slower than 1050 fps. At least thats what I used & it was very effective on both occasions. The .177 just zips right into the brain case, and stays there.
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Interesting....hog with a .177. If anyone can get it done brother Manny can. ;) We have some hogs running around here up north and it's a shoot on sight and just report their location. I would more then enjoy getting up there with one of my Magnum .177 springers and put in the time scouting, setting up and dropping some bacon. We be watching brother Manny and have no doubt your up for the challenge. Ed
x2 on Manny being up for the challenge, but I have no doubt you could pull it off cleanly and ethically too Ed. You guys are a rare breed.
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I wish there were some hogs here in the San Diego area that were accessible, almost all are on the Indian reservations and they don't like anyone hunting on the REZ, besides Ca won't let you hunt hogs with any air gun, no matter what caliber it is, just small game and upland birds are legal, plus the Feds came through and shot most of the hogs from helicopters, what a waste of hogs and hog tags, the pigs here are smart, they stay on the REZ, no one can get them there, except the Indians, huh funny, I'm 1/4 American Indian and I can't hunt on the REZ because my Grand Parents wouldn't take a number, that's OK.
I'll just substitute Coyotes for Hogs.
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So when are you going to take a hog with .177?
:) ....I guess I could power up my Daughter's Disco and see if I can get 20+ FPE and than see if she's accurate with the Baracudas
I will be watching the hunting gate.... ;)
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I maxed out the HammerSpring on my daughter's Disco,
Zero it in with Baracuda 10.5gr and they stack at 20 yards, next sunny day I'll get the chronograph out to see what is the true energy so I know if I need to buy some of those 16gr pellets.
In the meantime I tested penetration on a taped tight 1/2" Phonebook and I was getting complete pass through,
........that alone tells me that I'm already looking good :) :)
Those .177 pellets are soooo cute ;D ;D ;D
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In the meantime I tested penetration on a taped tight 1/2" Phonebook and I was getting complete pass through,
........that alone tells me that I'm already looking good :) :)
Those .177 pellets are soooo cute ;D ;D ;D
Lol.. Are you thinking about the EunJin, or Barracuda's?
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I know absolutely nothing about those heavier .177 pellets so I'llneed to do some research
I would think the EunJin might be a bit big for Crosman barrels but I love the looks of those EunJin,
H&N Barcuda, H&N Sniper, Skenco New Boy I will test all those, all if the gun turns out to be powerful enough of course.
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H&N Piledriver.
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The Piledriver is too heavy for a stock Disco.
The H&N Sniper Magnums work real nice, especially for long range.
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Agree, those 21gr pellets probably need a much more powerful gun,
I was reading reviews of EunJin in Crosman barrels and I believe I was wrong :) :) I might have to ad them to the pellets to check, again, depending what the Chrono says,
Been raining here lately so I'm on hold, have new Phonebooks ready to check penetration also.
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Killer footage man !! Like you, I've killed quite a few with PCP's but am now getting all set to go on a hunt with my spring and gas pistons. That's really my ultimate goal. Thanx for the video.
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No, thank you Robby for watching.
Good luck with the next step.
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Perfect shot placement. Great video,thx for sharing!
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Not a fan of the Eye shot with a small bore, not that I have any data to back it up :) ...since I've never actually tried it.
Anyway, lets look at some skull pictures and try actually figure out the possible dynamic of an Eye shot with a small bore.
what do we see ? .......I see a pretty deep optical cavity with a difficult angle to reach the brain, also you can tell there's no direct route to the brain and you still have to punch a hole on the skull bone.
What do I see happening ?
you have to get that pellet to go past a significant amount of tissue in the eyeball, by the time it reaches the concave bone who knows where it's going to actually hit and unless you hit that concave square it could skip and be redirected in many ways end might not even penetrate and just bounce around.
I consider the Eye shot with a small bore a very low percentage shot and I won't even considerate it on a Porker,.......now if someone comes up with some serious data and proves it to be a conducive shot I'll be happy to change my mind and use it :) :)
as it is now the more used and proven options have showed that they work and work well.
Couldn't you take some test shots on a hog harvested another way prior to dressing it and then examine the penetration?
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Eye shots are a no go without a lot of power. I've unfortunately hit 3 coons in the eye with a 42fpe .25 Mrod in the eye,with a polymag watched them dance, went to recover body, had a 1 eyed coon growling at me when I got to the body. Wasn't aiming for the eye but they tend to move at just that second. I've hit 1 in the eye with a 63fpe mrod eunjin and was successful, but was aiming for top of head and it moved, and it was smaller. My 2 cents. Keep up the good work Manny.
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Eye shots are a no go without a lot of power. I've unfortunately hit 3 coons in the eye with a 42fpe .25 Mrod in the eye,with a polymag watched them dance, went to recover body, had a 1 eyed coon growling at me when I got to the body. Wasn't aiming for the eye but they tend to move at just that second. I've hit 1 in the eye with a 63fpe mrod eunjin and was successful, but was aiming for top of head and it moved, and it was smaller. My 2 cents. Keep up the good work Manny.
Interesting insight and based on skull shape I would assume hogs would result in similar outcomes with lesser positive results due to increased thickness of the skull overall.
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From my perspective, it's still inconclusive.
When I've mentioned the possibility for an adult hog, it was not just "a shot in the eye". To get the proper channel to the hog brain, I presume you have to be at the "same" ground level and shoot at a proper angle.
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There's no channel.
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Unless you are at the right angle, and using high power, eye shots are a bad choice.. There is thick rounded bone in there..
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Unless you are at the right angle, and using high power, eye shots are a bad choice.. There is thick rounded bone in there..
BINGO !
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Can a moderator move this thread please ?
thanks a bunch
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Can a moderator move this thread please ?
thanks a bunch
Where would you like it moved to?
Edit: Ooops, I see it was already moved.
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This was a great story and really cool video.
Do you ever Ram or Goat hunt?
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Well, perhaps one more alternative for the shot placement when you are limited with 20+ fpe?
It would be in the neck, targeting the spine. An imaginary line, starting in the eye, passing by the base of the ear and finishing symmetric of the eye relatively to the ear? If you miss the spine, the hog could have an "easy" recover?
I am just trying to learn with you, experimented hog hunters.
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This was a great story and really cool video.
Do you ever Ram or Goat hunt?
Thanks,
We have Muflon on other islands on state lands, and Goats on this island are only on state lands,........ can't airgun hunt on state lands :(
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ugh that is a terrible hunting law!
This was a great story and really cool video.
Do you ever Ram or Goat hunt?
Thanks,
We have Muflon on other islands on state lands, and Goats on this island are only on state lands,........ can't airgun hunt on state lands :(
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What's up Manny?? I saw that you said you used the 21gr H&N Baracudas. Were they the match, and if so, what head size? I've tried the 21gr Baracuda Powers for greater penetration, however, there must be something to the copper plating process that damages the skirt of the pellet because one out of every 4 or 5 is bent badly. The FTT Powers are the same way. If I carefully go through each pellet, the Powers may still be the best bet, but "dang" that gets old. Just let me know which one you used if you get a minute. Going to be taking my NP2 on a hog hunt here very shortly.
Thank you, Robby
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Hey Robby, man that was some time ago :) I believe it was the regular Baracuda,
I did have a look at those copper pellets, for real accuracy lead is still king :)
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Thank you Manny!! I meant to ask you that many months ago. I have contacted H&N about the problem with the copper plated pellets (the same guy that got me the .25 cal. Hornets last year), so we'll see. I use H&N pellets more than any other brand, so hopefully they will look into the problem. Thanks again Manny for your reply!!
Robby
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ohh im so tempted! not far from me pigs are stupid.. heres proof
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kFWlUfDkbUc (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kFWlUfDkbUc)
now to find someone there that will let me shoot 1.. or 2
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Come out here,pigs are far from stupid
You wont shoot one with anything less then big bore PCP out to 100yds
If your blind is set up right you can get them in to about 20 yds if they are over 100lbs
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Cool video and a big pig for a .22 headshot! Some, even on here, say my Striker 1000x is too small. Not after watching Keith Warren, but those were small. You out did him by a wide margin. I've got a Benjamin Trail NP XL725 .25cal I'm going to hunt them with about half an hour southwest of me. With H&N hornet .25's @ 23.16grain. That'll come out to about 680/25.00. That trail gas ram makes a low, " THUNG" when you fire. Then you can here the pellet SMACK @ POI. Wanna smack some piggy noggin's! Thanks again for the story & video!
(http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/640x480q90/923/bAVivh.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/pnbAVivhj)
(http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/640x480q90/922/ZszH2l.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/pmZszH2lj)
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Well, perhaps one more alternative for the shot placement when you are limited with 20+ fpe?
It would be in the neck, targeting the spine. An imaginary line, starting in the eye, passing by the base of the ear and finishing symmetric of the eye relatively to the ear? If you miss the spine, the hog could have an "easy" recover?
I am just trying to learn with you, experimented hog hunters.
Didn't notice this till now.
When shooting with lower energy airguns, avoid the neck shot on pigs. There's no guarantee you'll hit the spine, or hit it hard enough to cause sufficient damage to drop the animal. The skin on a hog's neck isn't soft, & there's a lot of fat & muscle around the spine that your little .177 or .22 pellet needs to go through to reach the spine. So it'll likely just run off with a pellet in it's neck, & that ain't right whether you're shooting it as a pest or for meat.
Brain shots are the only shots you want to take to increase your chances of successfully dropping the animal on the spot, particularly those side profile rain shots.
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Also remembering a wounded boar might charge you. The upper tusk sharpens the lower tusk, and brothers, they know how to use them. Pigs are omnivores as well. I'll go with the earhole shot to the mid-brain myself. Unless it's facing me head down, then between the ears/eyes. A downward angle in either place could scramble the medulla oblongata that connects brain and spinal chord.
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a 22 short always worked perfect in the ear when i was 10yo on our cattle farm.
we had hogs for butchering and i did the honor of putting them down at 10yrds with
a cooper singleshot and RP 22 shorts.
never had one walk away much less survive.
i remember shooing oil cans...yes metal oil cans !! and the 22 short would not make it completely through the can from 10yrds. 40gr @ 900fps = 72fpe
the rp box said "estimated" 40gr rn and 900fps..... ;D
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Great shooting, the size of your quarry, harvested with the tools at hand never ceases to amaze me.
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Just thought you might like to check out my latest Airgun Shooter video? I tested the H&N Hornets in both .22 and .25 calibers. I tested them in my Hatsan Striker 1000x .22, and Benjamin Trail NP XL725 .25 magnum. I also finally found a lost chronograph APP upload from the .25cal H&N FTT's.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SXKLJVHtpG0 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SXKLJVHtpG0)
And here are the chronograph readouts-
Striker 1000x/H&N hornet, .22cal, 16.2gr;
(http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/640x480q90/923/brUKak.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/pnbrUKakj)
Trail NP XL725/H&N hornet, .25cal, 24.38gr;
(http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/640x480q90/923/lVI8jc.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/pnlVI8jcj)
Trail NP XL725, .25cal, H&N FTT, 19.91gr;
(http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/640x480q90/923/d42wnJ.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/pnd42wnJj)
And lastly, JSB King .25, 25.39gr;
(http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/640x480q90/924/121yP7.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/po121yP7j)
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The trades where blowing strong and cold today, perfect conditions to hunt my Ground blind by the feeder.
******WARNING********
Don't try this unless :
You extensively have tested your chosen ammo penetration.
You have a deep understanding of the quarry anatomy and a complete knowledge of where, how and when to shoot.
You have practiced like no other and can put that pellet consistently in Half the size of the intended target all the time, and always on a cold shot,...groups when you shooting a lot mean nothing,that fists shot from cold means everything.
OK, back to previously scheduled programs ;D ;D
I got to my Blind at 1 PM, I was carrying the NP2 loaded with the 21gr Baracuda so I made myself comfortable on the ground and started the waiting Game.
At Quarter to 4 I noticed a real nice Black boar approaching, it got to about 30 yards, stopped, started to circle a bit and took of in a hurry, something spooked it,......Maybe that was good, this boar would have been borderline shootable with the current equipment...I think.
At quarter to 5 this very respectable Blond/Grey young Boar comes in, Its very, very skittish, takes several approaches to the bait only to do a quick Uturn and dart back, I'm trying to turn on the camcorder without doing any damaging movement and every time I'm about to hit start the boar takes off again.
after more than half a dozen times I'm thinking it's gonna go for good anytime now, when all of a sudden he actually comes in.
I start the recorder and now it's time to pick up the rifle without getting busted ;D ;D ;D
I let the Video take over from now :
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CUcyrfIO--4&feature=youtu.be (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CUcyrfIO--4&feature=youtu.be)
I shot many, many Porkers with PCPs, but this one with a 20 FPE break barrel was exhilarating, .....adrenaline was flowing like crazy, believe me ;D ;D ;D
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d124/NorthShoreLB/Harvests/DSCF2085_zpstjdzdyzp.jpg) (http://s34.photobucket.com/user/NorthShoreLB/media/Harvests/DSCF2085_zpstjdzdyzp.jpg.html)
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d124/NorthShoreLB/Harvests/DSCF2086_zps9afcadcu.jpg) (http://s34.photobucket.com/user/NorthShoreLB/media/Harvests/DSCF2086_zps9afcadcu.jpg.html)
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d124/NorthShoreLB/Harvests/DSCF2087_zpsrsyfjy15.jpg) (http://s34.photobucket.com/user/NorthShoreLB/media/Harvests/DSCF2087_zpsrsyfjy15.jpg.html)
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d124/NorthShoreLB/Harvests/DSCF2095_zpsvvh5wayl.jpg) (http://s34.photobucket.com/user/NorthShoreLB/media/Harvests/DSCF2095_zpsvvh5wayl.jpg.html)
I'm curious too how my Hatsan 30 would do on anything to this point... I've noticed that penetration is related to speed with this pellet/bullet combo and it doesn't have a lot of that... thump it does have... 8)
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So much for the guy who said not to shoot facing you. You really rattled his brains! Very nice!
Huh ??? ??? ?
The head was down and he was offering a square shot at the top of the skull.
You don't take the shot head on if the head is up and facing you, this one was a textbook shot and I waited until he was perfectly in line.
That is exactly right... a .308 can't kill a pig if its looking at you... and hit square between the eyes even... from a novice when he shot it... and now know better... ;D
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Excellent shooting. Really shows what gas rams can do when properly applied to the situation
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Very interesting to read about and to see your adventures. Excellent.
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I wonder what kind of pellet you used?
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Baracuda 21gr
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Thanks Manny,
sorry for the question, you had stated what you used in your initial post. i should have read instead let your video completely took over my logic. thats how exciting your video is especially knowing you used a Nitro. LOL
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Thanks Manny,
sorry for the question, you had stated what you used in your initial post. i should have read instead let your video completely took over my logic. thats how exciting your video is especially knowing you used a Nitro. LOL
:) :) thanks,...that was exciting indeed.
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Wow, that's how it's done! Nice, humane kill.
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As always, great shooting Manny! Nice to see your still giving them porkers *(&^! And doing so with a break barrel.
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Thanks fellas.
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Manny...by any chance did you ever recover the skull or take any pics of it? I have a similar set up going on...from the blind to the feeding area (I'm actually cutting up coconuts, avocados and breadfruits and putting them in the area) to a gas ram break barrel. The feeding area is actually quite a bit closer...I haven't taken exact measurements, but it's right around 13-15 yards.
I'll also be ordering some Eun Jinns, Barracudas, and some other copper-plated varieties to test for accuracy and power.
I was curious about how deep the penetration was.
I know better, but man, you make it look like you've been doing it with your eyes closed and not even breaking a sweat.
I've been taking closer note of cold shots and I've been working like a madman on my accuracy.
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Manny...by any chance did you ever recover the skull or take any pics of it? I have a similar set up going on...from the blind to the feeding area (I'm actually cutting up coconuts, avocados and breadfruits and putting them in the area) to a gas ram break barrel. The feeding area is actually quite a bit closer...I haven't taken exact measurements, but it's right around 13-15 yards.
I'll also be ordering some Eun Jinns, Barracudas, and some other copper-plated varieties to test for accuracy and power.
I was curious about how deep the penetration was.
I know better, but man, you make it look like you've been doing it with your eyes closed and not even breaking a sweat.
I've been taking closer note of cold shots and I've been working like a madman on my accuracy.
Sorry brother I can't remember if I collected the skull on this one,
...Don't buy Copper pellets !!!!!
I don't know what Gas ram you have but I would bet the EunJin won't work.
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all good, my man...no worries. 8) So no go on the coppers? Got it. I'll be using a Gamo Magnum in .22. It shoots about 960 FPS with the Crosman 14.3 Ultra Magnum Domes.
And also a no go on the EunJin? Dang. Ok...so I'll guess I'll pick up a tin of Barracudas. Any other harder-than-normal pellet recommendations?
I want to make sure that I get good penetration.
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Stick with the Baracuda,
use the money you save from buying other pellets to get some Baracuda match in different head sizes to find the best one for your rifle.
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deleted.