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Author Topic: Crosman 140  (Read 1088 times))

Offline Rick67

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Re: Crosman 140
« Reply #20 on: May 08, 2022, 10:20:16 AM »
Who's going to buy it ?? Don't look at me... already  spent too much on guns this month, and i already have one. ;D

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Im on a buying freeze!!


Fine specimen!
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Offline LOKEY

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Re: Crosman 140
« Reply #21 on: May 08, 2022, 01:21:27 PM »
I have 3 of these "mystery" one piece breech/barrel 140 marked Crosman's all of which  are dated 269 which is Feb '69.  I also have a 1400 marked Crosman dated 169 which is Jan '69.  This indicates the "mystery" 140's were manufactured AFTER the 1400 was put into production.  The following is my view as to what the "mystery" guns are.

The '68 gun control act was signed into law and became effective in Oct of '68.  Sears responded by getting out of the gun business almost immediately after its signing.  As a result, Crosman lost it's biggest and best customer.  I believe Crosman reacted by deciding to adopt the Sears one piece breech/barrel (without the Sears scope grooves) and butt stock/pump handle configurations as a revised 140 and started marking un-grooved one piece breech/barrels as 140's; this is consistent with what Crosman did when they adopted the one piece breech/barrel with the 150 pistols.  At some point Crosman changed it's mind and decided to call the Sears configuration a new model, the 1400.  My Jan '69 1400 has a black barrel spacer and butt plate; the Sears guns had a white barrel spacer and no butt plate.  As a result of the name change and butt plate upgrade, Crosman had left over obsolete parts:  the 140 marked one piece breech/barrels, Sears white barrel spacers and butt stock/pump handles.  I believe Crosman used these obsolete parts to assemble the "mystery" guns.

So far, I've not been able to determine how these factory assembled parts guns were marketed and sold.

Also, should these parts guns should be considered a unique model separate from the 140 and 1400 or a variation of one or the other???  Keep in mind, these were manufactured after the two piece breech/barrel 140 was discontinued and the one piece breech/barrel 1400 adopted.

I've seen about 8 or 9 of these guns over the years, and all of them, including my 3 were in rough, rode hard and put away wet condition.

Sears did not get out of the gun business after the ‘68 GCA. They continued selling guns, both house branded (JC Higgins, Ted Williams, Sears) and brand named, well into the 80’s.

The idea that certain combinations of features makes a ‘parts gun’ or ‘mystery gun’ of leftover parts, is just silly. It boils down to the manufacturer and the buyer arriving at a contract for ‘X’ number of guns at ‘X’  price, usually with features that differentiate it from the run of the mill. Throw in the buying power of the National chain to hold the price down, and you had lots of value shoppers.

The above certainly complicates things for collectors who like everything to be in proper order., but the business and manufacturing world didn’t operate that way.

I think both is correct. The 68 GCA forced Sears to stop the mail order guns but they still sold them in house.
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Offline TerryM

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Re: Crosman 140
« Reply #22 on: May 08, 2022, 04:05:59 PM »
  Been looking at old Sears catalogs.  Through the 50s, Sears handled Daisy, Crosman and Sheridan guns with their respective names and model numbers.  During the 60s, the Ted Williams and J.C. Higgins names were used.  By 1969 they had gone back to calling a Daisy a Daisy and a Crosman a Crosman.  The pictures tell the story, they are from 1959, 1960, 1967 and 1971 catalogs.

     

       
  • TX
Crosman model#
101, 108, 110, 112, 113, 114 (x3), 118,
120, 140, 180 (x3), 187, 400, Mark II, 1377, 1322, 150, 122CG, Sears 126.19311, Ted Williams Match Rifle (2nd variant 160)  Self made 180-400-114 hybrid carbine
Benjamin model#
312, 317, 342, 237, Discovery
Sheridan:
Blue Streak (x2: '64, '67)
F model CO2 Blue Streak (converted to bulk fill)

Offline LOKEY

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Re: Crosman 140
« Reply #23 on: May 08, 2022, 06:28:22 PM »
  Been looking at old Sears catalogs.  Through the 50s, Sears handled Daisy, Crosman and Sheridan guns with their respective names and model numbers.  During the 60s, the Ted Williams and J.C. Higgins names were used.  By 1969 they had gone back to calling a Daisy a Daisy and a Crosman a Crosman.  The pictures tell the story, they are from 1959, 1960, 1967 and 1971 catalogs.

     

       

Very cool. I really thought they stopped mail order in 68 but I guess that's wrong. Can you email those pics to me I can't read the print on them here. I will pm you my email address.
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Offline JKM6442

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Re: Crosman 140
« Reply #24 on: May 08, 2022, 06:56:14 PM »
When I made the statement that Sears got out of the gun business, I should have phrased that to say that Sears stopped buying guns marked Sears and Crosman lost their biggest customer that purchased branded guns.  I was told years ago that after MLK and RFK were assassinated Sears didn't want their name on guns any more.  I have emails in to Sears branded gun collectors to get their put on this.  Sears continued to sell air guns in their stores and some stores may have had Sears branded guns that stayed in inventory for some length of time.  I do have a Sears branded 1400 dated Nov '68 but consider it to be one of the last branded 1400's made.  Its possible that Sears branded Crosman's were made later than this due to contractual obligations but by the end of '68 it was over.  If someone has a Sears branded air gun with a '69 or later date, I would like to know this.

As far as parts guns go, Crosman was legendary for not wasting parts.  When the J.C. Higgins branded 180 carbine was replaced by the unique to Sears long tube 180, which used a 160 length CO2 tube, Crosman fitted the first variation of these with a 2 piece barrel spacer until they used up all the existing shorter carbine length spacers.  To assemble a parts gun using obsolete parts is definitely something Crosman would do.  As stated, I don't know how they marketed or sold these parts guns.
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Offline Blowpipe Sam

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Re: Crosman 140
« Reply #25 on: May 08, 2022, 07:54:26 PM »
Thanks for posting the old catalogue pages.  Quite interesting to see what Crosman was claiming for fps back then.  Seems a bit more realistic than the figures we see today. ;)
  • Fire base Bert.  The last outpost on the Sopchoppy river.  Florida
My Battery
Hatsan Striker  .25
Hatsan Mod 125  .25
Hatsan Mod 125  .22
Hatsan Mod  95.  .22
Ruger Impact Max .22
FDAR Xisico XS60c .22 
Crosman 1400 .22.  3rd model
Crosman 1400 .22.  2nd model
Crosman 1400 .22.  1st. Model
Crosman 2240XL 14.5” Carbine .22
Crosman 2100 .177
Crosman 1377 .177
Industry B-3 .177

Offline LOKEY

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Re: Crosman 140
« Reply #26 on: May 08, 2022, 09:56:01 PM »
Even though it's hard to read the add he posted from 1971 describes the Crosman .22 but it doesn't say anything about dovetailing for a scope? So maybe in 1969 when mine was made Sears decided to actually sell these without the dovetailing. You know that they would have said something about being able to mount a scope if you could. I find it hard to believe they just left that detail out of a sales add.
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Offline TerryM

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Re: Crosman 140
« Reply #27 on: May 09, 2022, 07:23:19 AM »
Even though it's hard to read the add he posted from 1971 describes the Crosman .22 but it doesn't say anything about dovetailing for a scope? So maybe in 1969 when mine was made Sears decided to actually sell these without the dovetailing. You know that they would have said something about being able to mount a scope if you could. I find it hard to believe they just left that detail out of a sales add.


By '69, Sears was advertising these as Crosman, so I assume these were regular production barrels without Sears, J C Higgins or whatever embossed on them.  As such, they would not have scope grooves.

An ad from '65 shows a kid aiming a "1400" without a rear sight on it.  Kind of hard to hit anything, that way...
  • TX
Crosman model#
101, 108, 110, 112, 113, 114 (x3), 118,
120, 140, 180 (x3), 187, 400, Mark II, 1377, 1322, 150, 122CG, Sears 126.19311, Ted Williams Match Rifle (2nd variant 160)  Self made 180-400-114 hybrid carbine
Benjamin model#
312, 317, 342, 237, Discovery
Sheridan:
Blue Streak (x2: '64, '67)
F model CO2 Blue Streak (converted to bulk fill)

Offline Glasstomb

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Re: Crosman 140
« Reply #28 on: May 09, 2022, 12:49:02 PM »
I have a Sears 126.19300.  Crosman 1400? White spacer scope groves and one piece barrel/receiver.  Where is the serial number located? How can I determine date of manufacture?
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Offline JKM6442

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Re: Crosman 140
« Reply #29 on: May 09, 2022, 08:59:17 PM »
I have a Sears 126.19300.  Crosman 1400? White spacer scope groves and one piece barrel/receiver.  Where is the serial number located? How can I determine date of manufacture?

There is no serial #.  The date code is usually stamped on the breech plug. The first one or two digits is the month.  The last digit is the year.  Not all of them were stamped with date codes, and the replacement plugs are not dated.  Your Sears 1400 with scope grooves is the holy grail of 1400's.
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Offline Garandsx5

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Re: Crosman 140
« Reply #30 on: May 10, 2022, 12:07:40 AM »
To get a better handle on the selling of guns at Sears, just search. I use ‘Sears xxxx (the year) Fall catalog’. This will bring up the entire catalog and you can search page by page. Outfit called musetechnical. Fall catalog will be heavy with firearms and hunting gear. Use the same search scheme, but substitute‘Christmas’ for ‘Fall’ and you will get a wider selection of pellet and BB guns. For instance, Christmas 1972 introduced the Sears exclusive branded guns from Daisy. The Fall 1973 catalog has a number of Sears and Ted Williams branded guns, primarily from Winchester and High Standard. This is well after the GCA of ‘68. After ‘68, firearms could no longer ship direct to a customer’s home, but were shipped to the store for pickup after appropriate paperwork.
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Offline Glasstomb

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Re: Crosman 140
« Reply #31 on: May 10, 2022, 07:22:04 AM »
Quote
There is no serial #.  The date code is usually stamped on the breech plug. The first one or two digits is the month.  The last digit is the year.  Not all of them were stamped with date codes, and the replacement plugs are not dated.  Your Sears 1400 with scope grooves is the holy grail of 1400's.

John -
Thanks for the info. There's no date on the breech plug so no telling when it was made. There's a number stamped on the sliding breech cover. Not sure what that number represents.
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Offline Beaver Trapper

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Re: Crosman 140
« Reply #32 on: May 10, 2022, 10:03:09 AM »
  I have two , one is  the ordinary 1400 in .22 cal saved from the trash, the other is a 140 in .25 cal. The 140  was converted to .25 using a new barrel and it has the two piece breech /barrel .  A bolt handle has been added to the sliding cover. Shoots Benjiman .25 pellets in the 600fps +  range and is very accurate.  I don't know why more of our MSP weren't made in .25 ?
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Offline Goose

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Re: Crosman 140
« Reply #33 on: May 10, 2022, 10:13:14 AM »
To get a better handle on the selling of guns at Sears, just search. I use ‘Sears xxxx (the year) Fall catalog’. This will bring up the entire catalog and you can search page by page. Outfit called musetechnical. Fall catalog will be heavy with firearms and hunting gear. Use the same search scheme, but substitute‘Christmas’ for ‘Fall’ and you will get a wider selection of pellet and BB guns. For instance, Christmas 1972 introduced the Sears exclusive branded guns from Daisy. The Fall 1973 catalog has a number of Sears and Ted Williams branded guns, primarily from Winchester and High Standard. This is well after the GCA of ‘68. After ‘68, firearms could no longer ship direct to a customer’s home, but were shipped to the store for pickup after appropriate paperwork.

Thanks for posting that.  I'd been looking for a good link to the Sears catalogs for a long time.

Does anyone else remember the Guns & Ammo Annuals?  I've been looking for those as well because they were a good source of info on what airguns were available at the time.

Ride on,

J~
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Offline LOKEY

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Re: Crosman 140
« Reply #34 on: May 13, 2022, 02:08:34 PM »
Well I got my new pump cup in the mail (I am still waiting on the other seals) So I replaced it and it actually pumps and fires but it doesn't hold air more than about a minute. Nice to hear it pop but I can't shoot it until I get the internal seals  >:(
  • St petersburg Floida

Offline LOKEY

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Re: Crosman 140
« Reply #35 on: May 13, 2022, 09:02:36 PM »
I got the rest of the seals I needed. It's now resealed and so far holding air. When shooting it feels much more powerful than my 101. I will Chronograph it later. I will say it was not easy for me to do the "Square" seal. I have arthritis pretty bad in my left hand and holding that piece to get the old seal out was a real chore, But well worth it.
  • St petersburg Floida

Offline LOKEY

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Re: Crosman 140
« Reply #36 on: May 13, 2022, 10:35:05 PM »
Whats everyone's opinion on refinishing the stock on these. I think with some darker stain it would look amazing?
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Offline Blowpipe Sam

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Re: Crosman 140
« Reply #37 on: May 13, 2022, 10:54:00 PM »
The wood on these old 1400’s varies in quality from year to year.  Crosman used a one coat stain and varnish that chips easily and flakes off. I haven’t had any luck staining the stock from my Sears model ( manufactured 5/67).  It all came out blotchy so I stripped it as best I could and did the linseed oil and beeswax treatment.  My recently acquired 3rd model has an interesting dark varnish with a slight purple undertone I’ve never seen before.
  • Fire base Bert.  The last outpost on the Sopchoppy river.  Florida
My Battery
Hatsan Striker  .25
Hatsan Mod 125  .25
Hatsan Mod 125  .22
Hatsan Mod  95.  .22
Ruger Impact Max .22
FDAR Xisico XS60c .22 
Crosman 1400 .22.  3rd model
Crosman 1400 .22.  2nd model
Crosman 1400 .22.  1st. Model
Crosman 2240XL 14.5” Carbine .22
Crosman 2100 .177
Crosman 1377 .177
Industry B-3 .177

Offline TerryM

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Re: Crosman 140
« Reply #38 on: May 14, 2022, 05:40:52 AM »
  I've refinished a couple of these.  Not fun.  After the work getting the old finish off, I left it blonde with a few coats of Tru-oil.  They look nice enough... for old junk wood.
« Last Edit: May 14, 2022, 05:53:50 AM by TerryM »
  • TX
Crosman model#
101, 108, 110, 112, 113, 114 (x3), 118,
120, 140, 180 (x3), 187, 400, Mark II, 1377, 1322, 150, 122CG, Sears 126.19311, Ted Williams Match Rifle (2nd variant 160)  Self made 180-400-114 hybrid carbine
Benjamin model#
312, 317, 342, 237, Discovery
Sheridan:
Blue Streak (x2: '64, '67)
F model CO2 Blue Streak (converted to bulk fill)

Offline LOKEY

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Re: Crosman 140
« Reply #39 on: May 14, 2022, 04:37:25 PM »
I have been searching through the site and found examples like this. I think if I could get this effect it would really make the grain in my stock stand out nicely. I am pretty good at working with wood. For some reason I couldn't load pics of his refinish job but here is a link. I think it looks pretty nice.

https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=25728.0

  • St petersburg Floida