GTA
All Springer/NP/PCP Air Gun Discussion General => European/Asian Air Gun Gates => Czech & Russian Air Guns => Topic started by: bReTt on January 25, 2019, 04:43:28 AM
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Mrs. Peterson came through with a fantastic gift for me on my birthday...
I’m liking it so far. I’m pretty particular so there a few “issues” that $500 worth of pistol shouldn’t have but they are minor and can be easily dealt with.
I have already cleaned and polished the bore, wiped down and lubed the pistol. It’s drilling <dime sized holes at 23’ single hand with H&N match light wads. More pellet testing and practice should hopefully reduce that size. Maybe a little trigger adjusting too as there is some creep in it before it breaks but overall a very nice trigger.
Grips will start getting worked over soon, I’ll most likely get started this weekend. A new palm shelf is definitely needed along with some finger grooves. I’ll take the grips off and see how complicated it would be to make some new ones from black walnut. I have a 4’ section of a 10” diameter limb that broke off our tree a few years ago in a freezing rain (rare in Western WA) and it has beautiful color in the heartwood. That would be a real treat to have grips made out of a piece of that.
Right now I’m enjoying the pistol. I hope to get to know it real well.
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Seems you have two keepers there! ;) ;) ;)
pv
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Most excellent news, Brett! Once I get my lefty grips, maybe I can shoot mine as well as you shoot yours. That grip plan sounds great. Keep us informed of the progress.
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Congrats! What a great birthday gift and happy birthday!
I’ve been eyeing this pistol for a great long time....some day I will need to join this club too.
Best of luck with the new gun!
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First the Russians infiltrate the NRA and now GTA. Yicks... :P :P :P
Nice, where did you acquire it from?
-Y
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Welcome to the club Brett!! Really happy for you.
The grips are supplied with the intention that the owner should modify them to suit their taste. Can't wait to see what you come up with. :D
Dime-size groups are outstanding fir the first time, and single-handed!! Nice shootin' there Tex.
Russians in the GTA aren't infiltrators. They're invited!
Curious as to what other little niggly things bother you for $500. I think it's still a great deal considering the quality and ability of a 46M.
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Hi Brett,
Your 46M breech is locked closed in the picture above. Apparently the seals tend to take a set, if you store it that way. But you probably know that.
I have shot a few hundred pellets from my 49M that I bought a few weeks ago. Tonight, I finally shot two cleaning pellets through it. They came out pristine. This barrel looks just as bright as it did on day one; and lead simply does not build up in it. I had been thinking of fire lapping it, but based on the way it shoots and stays clean, I see no need to improve it.
So, I am curious as to how you polished your pistol's barrel, and why you felt the need to do it?
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Seems you have two keepers there! ;) ;) ;)
pv
Yes sir! You are correct. Even if Mrs. P didn’t come through with the 46, she is definitely a keeper... my best friend.
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Most excellent news, Brett! Once I get my lefty grips, maybe I can shoot mine as well as you shoot yours. That grip plan sounds great. Keep us informed of the progress.
I will keep you all informed of any grip progress. Currently I am reshaping the ones that came with it for a custom fit.
Here is where it’s at so far. I have the grips mounted on the pistol again and I’m going try some shooting today to see how it feels. I’ll continue shaping and shooting until I get it where I want it.
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First the Russians infiltrate the NRA and now GTA. Yicks... :P :P :P
Nice, where did you acquire it from?
-Y
Hey! Mrs. P ordered it from Krale in the Netherlands 🇳🇱. She ordered on the 10th, shipped on the 11th and at the door on the 14th. That’s smoking fast!
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Welcome to the club Brett!! Really happy for you.
The grips are supplied with the intention that the owner should modify them to suit their taste. Can't wait to see what you come up with. :D
Dime-size groups are outstanding fir the first time, and single-handed!! Nice shootin' there Tex.
Russians in the GTA aren't infiltrators. They're invited!
Curious as to what other little niggly things bother you for $500. I think it's still a great deal considering the quality and ability of a 46M.
I’m REALLY pleased with this pistol! It’s so precise and easy to shoot accurately... at least as far as MY ability allows. My dime sized groups are when I actually can call my shot when aimed at the bull. I still pull shots and I’m not counting those... 😝. What I’m emphasizing is that the pistol has it going on, not necessarily me.
Niggly things are the loose grips, palm shelf not holding position and front sight holder/weight that actually holds the blade is crooked/rotated slightly counterclockwise when viewed from behind the gun. It should be a simple fix, I haven’t taken it off yet to see if there is a flat on the bottom of the barrel or a guide hole or what. Maybe it was tightened “off” at the factory and the set screw has embedded into the metal and so it wants to keep setting into the same place.
All MINOR things that are being addressed. It a fantastic rig so far. I’m really impressed. The finish is much nicer in real than pictures show. It looks much rougher in pictures to me. Right now I’m concentrating on getting the grip shaped so that means taking off, putting on, taking off, putting on. Once I get that fitted and finished, I’ll work on tweaking the other stuff.
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Hi Brett,
Your 46M breech is locked closed in the picture above. Apparently the seals tend to take a set, if you store it that way. But you probably know that.
I have shot a few hundred pellets from my 49M that I bought a few weeks ago. Tonight, I finally shot two cleaning pellets through it. They came out pristine. This barrel looks just as bright as it did on day one; and lead simply does not build up in it. I had been thinking of fire lapping it, but based on the way it shoots and stays clean, I see no need to improve it.
So, I am curious as to how you polished your pistol's barrel, and why you felt the need to do it?
Thank you! Yes I am aware of storing the breech locked and setting the seals. I’m trying to NOT store it closed. I also leave my break barrels cracked open and my underlevers stored with a wine cork between the lever and the barrel to relive the pressure off of the breech seal. I store my other guns with bolts/breeches closed.
First I simply cleaned the bore with patches on a jag and a small squirt of PCL. I pushed a couple through wet and then 2-3 dry. It’s not a science, just getting it clear of any storage grease. The first wet patch came out with a blob of something clear on it. I assume storage grease? The remaining didn’t have anything else with it other than a dirty patch but not real bad.
I felt no need to polish the bore. It’s something that I like to do for my own peace of mind. I used a bore mop with a small amount of JB Bore Paste applied. I stroked it through approximately 20 strokes. In and back out counts as one stroke. After that I ran a couple wet patches through on a jag then dry patches until clean... maybe 5-6?
This may make some folks cringe but I use a carbon fiber cleaning rod and I worked the pistol from the muzzle end. Gasp, gasp, faint faint! 👀👀🤢🤢
As I spend time with anything, I find that I like doing certain things to them to “improve” them and make it like I want it. Most of it comes down to personal preference.
If you don’t feel that your pistol needs anything else done to it then don’t. It’s yours and you treat it the way you like, not how others think you should.
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Welcome to the club Brett!! Really happy for you.
The grips are supplied with the intention that the owner should modify them to suit their taste. Can't wait to see what you come up with. :D
Dime-size groups are outstanding fir the first time, and single-handed!! Nice shootin' there Tex.
Russians in the GTA aren't infiltrators. They're invited!
Curious as to what other little niggly things bother you for $500. I think it's still a great deal considering the quality and ability of a 46M.
Oh, I just remembered....
I mentioned somewhere about some creep/grit in the trigger. I did nothing for it and it has since disappeared. I have maybe 50 shots through the pistol. Maybe is was a speck of debris or a burr on one of the sear surfaces??? It’s a non-issue now.
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front sight holder/weight that actually holds the blade is crooked/rotated slightly counterclockwise when viewed from behind the gun. It should be a simple fix, I haven’t taken it off yet to see if there is a flat on the bottom of the barrel or a guide hole or what. Maybe it was tightened “off” at the factory and the set screw has embedded into the metal and so it wants to keep setting into the same place.
Well, that got me looking at my own 46M. My front sight housing was a bit loose, so I tried tightening it. It felt tight, but the grub screw kept turning, so I turned it some more. It was to the point where I started to think it was stripped, but I turned a it more and what happened next is that the housing rotated on me! I took out the grub screw to see that there is a milled dimple in the bottom of the barrel. What's really weird is that the inside end of the grub screw has an offset "blob" on it. Looks like it was cut off that way and not filed flat or something, but it also looks like it could have been machined that way. Who knows with these Russians. The threads looked OK on both the housing and the screw so I put it all back together. When I tightened it all the way up the housing rotated again (around the barrel) as I was doing that, but when fully tight, it ended up perfectly aligned. No matter though, I'm going to Ace tomorrow and finding a pointed end grub screw to replace it.
(https://i.postimg.cc/tTBZP30c/20190126-140748.jpg)
(https://i.postimg.cc/cC53qQX3/20190126-141445.jpg)
Since I've posted that last pic I can see that it looks more like a piece of slag from poor machining of the screw.
After 14 years of owning this pistol, I never thought to check the tightness of this screw.
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Hi Brett,
My pistol's front sight is also skew like yours. Probably off the same production run from Krale.
Anyway, the dimple in the barrel won't allow the sight base to be rotated. The sight blade has a hole through it with a flat a t the bottom. So, unless one takes a file to the flat (or makes a new blade), the front rotation is pretty much stuck. I say this after coming to the conclusion that the barrel is pressed or held in the receiver by I means I could not determine, and was not willing to mess with.
So, my solution was to make the rear sight blade parallel with the front. The rear sight blade is held on by means of "reverse screws"; meaning turning clockwise to loosen. It is not a left handed thread. Rather, the head of the screw, holding the sight blade is also the "tip" of the screw (away from the screw driver slot). So, whatever you do, do not force these tiny screws anti-clockwise till they let go; because their slots will probably let go first.
I set my rear blade to take up the angular clearance in its mounting slots. That more or less cancelled the front sight cant. Now, after looking into it, you might determine that it was the rear sight that was skew all along :). Either way, this slight flaw is mildly disappointing for such an expensive pistol, but ultimately has not affected how well it shoots.
After trimming my wooden grips to allow my hand some comfort, I now conclude that I would like the front strap to backstrap distance perhaps 3/8 longer. As the backstap has the fancy shape to it, sticking some wood (or rubber) to the front strap to be make it "fatter" will definitely help stabilize the pistol in my hand. When I saw that Dennis had done something like this, I thought "nuts". But now I see his point.
I suspect that you will come to discover the pistol over time; and the improvement process will be exactly that; a process. Trying to make the grip perfect in one step is likely to destroy it.
Now, I did not buy the pistol to resell, but anything I do to it should not detract from it. One could argue that a grip that exactly fits my hand, by definition won't suit anyone else. Still, I am in no hurry to remove wood, that I would replace with more wood later. Except perhaps, trying to carve a grip from scratch...
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The rear sight blade is held on by means of "reverse screws"; meaning turning clockwise to loosen. It is not a left handed thread. Rather, the head of the screw, holding the sight blade is also the "tip" of the screw (away from the screw driver slot). So, whatever you do, do not force these tiny screws anti-clockwise till they let go; because their slots will probably let go first.
A VERY important point there Peter, good on 'ya for making that so clear.
sticking some wood (or rubber) to the front strap to be make it "fatter" will definitely help stabilize the pistol in my hand. When I saw that Dennis had done something like this, I thought "nuts". But now I see his point.
Well, yeah, I am a bit nuts at times, but in this case I find that the rubber gives just a tiny bit of squish and keeps me from constantly making those annoying minute adjustments. It also lessens my grip strength by eliminating the fear that I am holding too loose and the gun will fall. It just sort of helps "lock" it into my hand.
Here's some advice from Thomas Rink about grip forming (this gets into adding fillers and such, but as you grind away on yours, you might keep some of this in mind):
"Grip forming:
Should you decide to customize your grip by yourself, you should consider the following basic guidelines.
As a general rule: Firstly remove excess material, secondly refill existing hollow spaces. Otherwise you tend to make the grip much too bulky.
As coating material we use a silicon based grip putty. It is easy to handle and poses no health hazard. For larger, self-supporting areas epoxy based grip paste is suitable.
The diameter of the grip should be measured in such a way, that the central phalanx of the index finger is placed more or less right-angled to the barrel.
If at the ready, the barrel should form a straight line into your arm. This can only be achieved, by gripping widely enough behind the weapon. Shooters with shorter fingers may therefore experience difficulties in reaching the trigger. Shooters, who´s hand tends to point to the left on zero-position, may also encounter difficulties. At the ready the bead would then always tend to break to the left. The best solution for such problems, are most likely found in a compromise. Everything else must be compensated through specific training of your muscle memory (also for posture of the head! see below).
Should the fore-sight point to the left, it can be helpful to build up material in the area around the back of your palm with filler or leather. As a rule of thumb: 1 size of a fore-sight deviation complies approximately with 1 degree wrist turn and at the same time with approximately 1 millimeter material build up at the back end of the grip. The same effect is achieved with a removal of material in the area across the base of your fingers. Should the fore-sight point to the right, vice-versa.
Never exaggerate the material build up in case of a left pointing fore-sight, as this will otherwise result in an overcompensation of your arm position apposed to the axis of your barrel (see above). By shifting your head position to the right, a leftpointing fore-sight can center itself. This new posture should be fixed by special shooting glasses with a wide iris or a small glass support.
Should your have the notion, that your thumb does not have the right position, very often it will do, to lower the whole thumb rest slightly.
To tip the gravitational center of the weapon to the back, you can drill holes into the grip and fill them with lead.
After having built up your grip with filler, it is often too smooth. It works wonders to brush the grip with wood glue and then sprinkle with saw dust (or grit from model railroads). However this does not work with our silicone mass.
Here's another REALLY good tip from Thomas on how to grip the gun:
How to slip on an anatomical pistol grip?:
When slipping on a anatomical grip, it is important, that it fits always evenly in the hand. The better the grip is adapted to the hand, the more simply is that.
The goal is, that the recoil will always come into the same point in the palm, and/or the trigger finger always is in the same angle to the trigger.
The middle part of the finger should press the grip straight, parallel to the barrel axis, towards the ball of the thumb. The strength for that depends on the discipline (FP more loosely, SP more firmly) and on the personally feeling (whereby all extremes are to be avoided).
To reach this, you should go up like as follows:
Slip on the grip into the web between thumb and forefinger.
Put in, the side of the hand and the ball of the thumb from behind.
Put the basic fold of the fingers behind the corresponding edge at the grip.
The parts of the fingers pull the grip against the ball of the thumb.
Lift up the ball of the thumb and the side of the hand backwards and replace them inwards, so that the hand “not worthy” itself into the grip.
Spread the thumb and the forefinger alternately outwards, so that the moving of the trigger finger produces no more tensions in the web between thumb and forefinger.
The whole procedure should last, after some practicing, not longer than 3 seconds.
Take care that the grip fits evenly along the ball of the thumb. If it isn’t the case, repeat the last both points or begin from start.
Here's the link to Rink Formgriffe https://www.formgriffe.de/en/ (https://www.formgriffe.de/en/)
Hope this helps.
BTW - how does one hyperlink in here?
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Anyway, the dimple in the barrel won't allow the sight base to be rotated.
(https://i.postimg.cc/tTBZP30c/20190126-140748.jpg)
What would be the harm in using a Dremel round tip bit and elongating that dimple to the left or right to allow the front housing to straighten up?
Baikal screwed it up in the first place!
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Thanks Dennis,
so that the hand “not worthy” itself into the grip.
That "not worthy" is the software trying to shield us from the effects of a vacuum. Hilarious :)
Your link displayed fine.
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The barrel wall is pretty thin. I would prefer there were no dimple; and that the front sight base screw not press on the barrel. It is just inviting distortion of the bore. Much rather have a split clamp style mount, that uses the principle of "angle of wrap" to produce huge grip, without huge radial stress...
I would rather make a new dimple than drift the old one. This requires a new threaded hole in the sight base.
Without the v-shaped cavity, the screw would need to be much tighter to prevent front sight rotation (see paragraph number one). I am very gentle with that screw, and would Loctite it if it might come loose.
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Thanks Dennis,
so that the hand “not worthy” itself into the grip.
That "not worthy" is the software trying to shield us from the effects of a vacuum. Hilarious :)
Almost sounds Chinese in philosophy. I take the attitude "is the grip worthy of my hand?
Your link displayed fine.
What I mean is, how do you use a highlighted word and make it go to a link? I can do it in my email browser, but not in here. I've seen it done here. To make it more clear, I wanted to be able to click on the phrase Rink Formgriffe and make it go directly to the link (that's not a link BTW, I just colored it blue).
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Hyperlink like this - quote my post to see what is in it:
Rink Formgriffe (http://www.formgriffe.de/en/)
Rink Formgriffe (http://www.formgriffe.de/en/)
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Hyperlink like this - quote my post to see what is in it:
Rink Formgriffe (http://"https://www.formgriffe.de/en/")
Is there a button above for doing that, or do I have to code it myself?
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I went to anther forum to use the button, as GTA does not have one.
This forum then added an extra http, that had to be removed before the link worked - should work now. The one you quoted was still in the debugging process...
Have added a blue font variant. Just quote it to see what is in it (why does that sound familiar :) )
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Test
Baikal[/color=blue]
Cool, got it! Thanks. (https://search.aol.com/aol/search?q=lake%20baikal&s_it=loki-tb-sb)
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It works, Dennis.
Now, if you are concerned with displaying overly long text strings, find a way to compress that impressive list of airguns, into one word :)
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It works, Dennis.
Now, if you are concerned with displaying overly long text strings, find a way to compress that impressive list of airguns, into one word :)
I've been waiting for someone to make a remark about that, and I've been trying to think of where I can compile and link it to. Maybe I'll make a folder on postimage just for that, but then I have to label each pic as to what gun it is.
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Thanks for pushing me on that.
I fixed it. See below.
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Ah heck with it.
This is easier.
Sorry, I am too late, but here is a solution; if you still have that list saved somewhere:
EDIT, You got it done!
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No worries. Couldn't preview or test my profile so had to go back and forth, editing and such. Read above couple posts and see what I did.
Thanks for the help. :D
I feel so much cleaner now.
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Apparently the crooked front sight still hasn't been fixed. My 46 that was made in 1998 had a crooked sight. I just slid the sight forward a bit. Just loosen the sight, flip the gun over on a flat surface so it's resting on the front and rear sigths, snug down the front sight screw. Presto, front sight perfectly indexed to the rear.
No obvious loss of accuracy.
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Thanks Mike!
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Thank you for your interesting and informative posts.
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Finished my grips.... for now. Now it’s time to shoot and stop messing with it.
I moved the trigger blade back but, boy, was that little screw tough to get to turn. I ended up using some penetrating oil and heat to move it. I boogered it up pretty bad in the process. I’ll do some cleanup on it later or do as Dennis has suggested and replace it with an Allen head screw.
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Congrats on the Izzy Brett!
One that been on my bucket list for a while.
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Congrats on the Izzy Brett!
One that been on my bucket list for a while.
Thank you Scott! Get one, you’ll like it. They are much nicer in real than pictures reveal.
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I replaced the set screw (4mm) on my front sight housing today. I thought at first I might have to grind it to more of a point than it had (it has a sort of hollow point) thinking that it wouldn't seat into the dimple, but it did, and I guess I'm one of the lucky ones in that it locked in straight.
But I also had a thought as I was tightening it. Couldn't you just grind the end of the screw flat so that the end sort of spanned over the offset dimple? That way you could set it in place straight. I would think that it would still have enough holding power to keep the housing in place...???
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Finished my grips.... for now. Now it’s time to shoot and stop messing with it.
I moved the trigger blade back but, boy, was that little screw tough to get to turn. I ended up using some penetrating oil and heat to move it. I boogered it up pretty bad in the process. I’ll do some cleanup on it later or do as Dennis has suggested and replace it with an Allen head screw.
This looks GREAT!
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I moved the trigger blade back but, boy, was that little screw tough to get to turn. I ended up using some penetrating oil and heat to move it. I boogered it up pretty bad in the process.
Don't feel too bad. I tried to get mine loose, gouged it, and gave up. And this with a proper hollow ground screw driver...
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I moved the trigger blade back but, boy, was that little screw tough to get to turn. I ended up using some penetrating oil and heat to move it. I boogered it up pretty bad in the process.
Don't feel too bad. I tried to get mine loose, gouged it, and gave up. And this with a proper hollow ground screw driver...
I dropped some Blaster on both sides of the screw and in between the split in the trigger blade with a Q-tip soaked with the stuff. I let it sit for a few minutes and then used a lighter to heat the screw up ever so slowly. When I thought that I had enough heat on it I really had to apply torque to it but it did twist. I actually did the damage before I resorted to the oil and heat. I too used a proper hollow ground screw driver and still boogered it up.
http://blastercorp.com/PB-Blaster-Penetrant-remove-stuck-parts-spray (http://blastercorp.com/PB-Blaster-Penetrant-remove-stuck-parts-spray)