GTA
All Springer/NP/PCP Air Gun Discussion General => European/Asian Air Gun Gates => UK Airgun Gate => Topic started by: tresser@sbcglobal.net on November 11, 2022, 09:11:13 PM
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Just purchased a used AA TX 200. After I unpacked it cocked it and put in a pellet and tried close the action but I could not do so, unfortunately the beartrap safety is completely blocked, frozen won't budge at all. After releasing the safety the gun fired as I pulled the trigger - I guess the spring tension was released with the barrel open but just the same I can not close the action at all. The cocking lever is in the down position and the bear trap safety on the side of the gun is unmovable. I do not even have a manual for this gun, so I am at a complete loss what to do further. If anyone out there could offer some suggestion how fix this problem, or if all else fails recommend me somebody who can fix this issue I would be very grateful. Lajos
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Just purchased a used AA TX 200. After I unpacked it cocked it and put in a pellet and tried close the action but I could not do so, unfortunately the beartrap safety is completely blocked, frozen won't budge at all. After releasing the safety the gun fired as I pulled the trigger - I guess the spring tension was released with the barrel open but just the same I can not close the action at all. The cocking lever is in the down position and the bear trap safety on the side of the gun is unmovable. I do not even have a manual for this gun, so I am at a complete loss what to do further. If anyone out there could offer some suggestion how fix this problem, or if all else fails recommend me somebody who can fix this issue I would be very grateful. Lajos
Contact the seller
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You may not be getting the rifle fully cocked ??? Just a guess, but here is your owners manual.
https://www.pyramydair.com/airgun-resources/manuals/air-arms-tx200-hc-owners-manual.pdf (https://www.pyramydair.com/airgun-resources/manuals/air-arms-tx200-hc-owners-manual.pdf)
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I agree with Back Roads - it sounds as though the gun is not fully cocked. Even if the gun is not cocked you can apply a little more force to the cocking lever and while holding it securely depress the beartrap lock and ease the cocking lever back to battery.
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Roadworks and Backwoods are right on the money. I've been loving my TX200 for two and a half years now, so I indeed have a little experience with this problem: pull the cocking lever until you've heard three clicks, now, load your pellet, then, holding on to the lever, push down on the beartrap release and allow the cocking lever to be returned to it's position attached to the barrel. Now, release the automatic safety, shoot and repeat. Orv.
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Thank you one and all for your replies. The gun was purchased from an auction house as mechanically fine. I will try to contact them, but my guess is that they will be no help. As to the not fully cocked; it is fully cocked and the cocking lever can not go any further, as a matter of fact it is presently unmovable.
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I'd still bet that the gun is not fully cocked. Try putting butt of gun on thigh, with left hand try to pull the cocking lever just a little bit further to rear and see if you get the final click. Then try depressing the bear trap and closing the cocking lever.
If the above does not work, turn gun upside down and look in the slot of the stock and see if maybe the pin holding the cocking lever has maybe started to work it's way out and is jammed against the stock.
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Hello Jonah; Thank you for your advise. Unfortunately the cocking lever is completely unmovable whatever I am trying with it. I do not want further force it meaning breaking something. The pins looking in the slot are centered.
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OK I felt ambitious so I got my Google Fu going, this may be the fix and issue 8)
https://johnshortell.com/air-arms/ (https://johnshortell.com/air-arms/)
Here is a play list for the TX 200 many tips and tricks.
https://www.google.com/search?q=air+arms+tx+repair&rlz=1C1CHBF_enUS914US914&sxsrf=ALiCzsYgvSbX_2BvpYD6lwwClQqVPKsn5g:1668264317975&source=lnms&tbm=vid&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjQx8Hw8Kj7AhXCJDQIHeGOAe8Q_AUoBHoECAIQBg&biw=1366&bih=617&dpr=1 (https://www.google.com/search?q=air+arms+tx+repair&rlz=1C1CHBF_enUS914US914&sxsrf=ALiCzsYgvSbX_2BvpYD6lwwClQqVPKsn5g:1668264317975&source=lnms&tbm=vid&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjQx8Hw8Kj7AhXCJDQIHeGOAe8Q_AUoBHoECAIQBg&biw=1366&bih=617&dpr=1)
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After releasing the safety the gun fired as I pulled the trigger - I guess the spring tension was released with the barrel open but just the same I can not close the action at all. The cocking lever is in the down position and the bear trap safety on the side of the gun is unmovable.
It sounds as though the trigger did engage, which suggests that the anti bear trap (ABT) mechanism is engaging after the trigger group. This can happen if the piston rod, which is screwed into the piston and fixed with thread lock compound, starts to unscrew, and the upshot is that the ABT is taking the full force of the mainspring (>200 lbf with the export mainspring), and the ABT doesn't offer enough leverage to allow you to disconnect it.
What I would try is to pull the cocking lever back with as much force as I could muster, then hit the front end of the ABT lever with a lightweight mallet to try to shock it free. If that worked, I'd de-cock and strip the rifle, and check the piston rod.
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Hello Back_Roads and Jim-in-UK
Back_Roads; Thank you again. I have took the action out of the stock and looked at the bracket and the screw. The screw is perfectly flush with the bracket and the cocking lever has no touch marks.
Jim-in-UK; Thank you very much for your very logical suggestion. Unfortunately even a fair amount of the suggested hammering on the front of the lever did not budge it.
My suspicion is the same as yours, something internally is crewed up.
Unfortunately for me because this one is an FAC or a US spec rifle, guessing here 15 or 18 ft/lb at the muzzle I can not take it apart without a spring compressor, which I do not have or I do not even have any idea how and where to get one of these.
I tried the proven and tested UK method; pushing down on the end of the action to release the big screw, no go.
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A spring compressor may be purchased through Pyramyd Airguns for about a hundred dollars. I'm a bit surprised that one is necessary on a TX200. I've thoroughly read the blog by Tom Gaylord and he doesn't indicate the use of one in his disassembling of the TX200. Orv.
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I did my full power TX without a compressor. Instead of pushing, i set the action muzzle-up on a bench, drape a towel or denim over the muzzle, then grab the towel around the barrel with one hand and pull down. This lets me hang my body weight off the gun instead of pushing against it. Hope that helps. Good luck!
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Looks like a very sturdy sash cramp to de-compress the mainspring is the only alternative. It will need at least 5" of travel, and some way to ensure the action and trigger block stay in line will be essential.
I would not recommend undertaking this yourself, unless you have the right equipment and know what you're doing.
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Hello everyone; Thank you for your valuable contributions. I have managed to take the gun apart. The center screw was difficult to loosen all the way. It finally sprang apart with some force. The reason for this could have been that it had the stuck bear trap although I am not sure that the spring was still cocked. Everything inside was covered with black grease. I might have be missing 2 parts from the spring assembly; the Front Spring Guide HP MK3; TX350H and the Rear Guide Washer HP; TX363. according to the manual. At least I have not found these two. I wish I could be sure if these should have been in there or not? I have never seen one of these before.
I plan to order a Vortek PG4 Steel HO Tune kit and a Moly piston seal and use these instead of the stock parts. What I do not know if this kit comes with the parts I might be missing (top hat, washer). The Compression Tube Assembly Std; TX281 also shows some wear, especially on top side close to the black nut on top. Please give me your opinions because I need any assistance I can get. Hope that I will be able to reassemble it w/o a spring compressor.
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Well done on getting the rifle apart.
The front spring guide is a steel piston weight, which often remains stuck in the piston after the spring has been withdrawn - it can usually be jolted free by bringing the piston down sharply onto a firm surface.
I would suggest putting the rifle back together minus the mainspring, and check whether it cocks the trigger without the ABT sticking.
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I would suggest putting the rifle back together minus the mainspring, and check whether it cocks the trigger without the ABT sticking.
I agree you should figure out the abt issue so you don't install a new spring kit and still have the problem.
Most aftermarket spring kits including Vortek have front and rear guides included so you won't need to reuse the factory parts.
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I would suggest putting the rifle back together minus the mainspring, and check whether it cocks the trigger without the ABT sticking.
I agree you should figure out the abt issue so you don't install a new spring kit and still have the problem.
Most aftermarket spring kits including Vortek have front and rear guides included so you won't need to reuse the factory parts.
Good advice Jim. Someone may have altered the stroke too, causing it to foul the bear trap.
Steve
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Hello Jim-in-UK and DanD; Thank you for your valuable contributions. As a newbie I certainly can use any help I can get. You guys are right I found the top hat inside the piston. I measured the piston inside/outside yesterday evening to determine if something is stuck inside or not. Whoever was in there before me must have loved moly grease because the top hat was stuck to the degree that even soaking the inside with solvent for a few hours and followed by hard tapping on the counter upside down could barely dislodge it. Everything else was swimming in moly. Especially cleaning the inside of the piston took quiet an effort. I find it very interesting and never would have imagined that installing the gun w/o the main spring would allow function testing the ABT! Great information! As soon I did this I will report. Right now the ABT works fine, although I am surprised how short the lever travel is. I am planning also to replace the piston seal and the front and rear bearings on the piston. Hopefully these will not prove to be to difficult to do? Regards. Lajos
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Hello Nitrocrushr; Thank you for your contribution, even though yours definitely complicates the issue at hand. How could I know if the stroke is stock or not? Measuring the length of the piston or what? Regards. Lajos
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Hello Nitrocrushr; Thank you for your contribution, even though yours definitely complicates the issue at hand. How could I know if the stroke is stock or not? Measuring the length of the piston or what? Regards. Lajos
Lajos, I flip the gun upside down with no stock on it. Lay it accross sandbags. As Jim mentioned, the main spring should be removed for this.
Place a piece of masking tape alongside of the cocking shoe groove. With cocking lever closed, take a pen and place a mark on the tape across from front edge of cocking shoe.
Now cock the rifle. After the piston rod is latched in the trigger block, bring it front ever so slightly. Just enough to take the backlash out. Place another mark across from front edge of the cocking shoe.
Measure that distance in mm’s with calipers.
To reduce chances for bear trap locking up, wedge a piece of something the thickness of a credit card under the bear trap to keep it from engaging. After you get the stroke measured, you can remove this shim and test the function of the bear trap.
Steve
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Hello Everybody; First of all many thanks for everybody for your valuable contributions and advise. This is the closing report on my issue, I wish it could be more positive, but unfortunately the problem did not found a solution. Here is what happened; after I managed to dismantle and clean up the action I have ordered a set of Vortek Pro 4 HO spring kit a piston seal and 2 O rings for the compression tube. Installation of the Vortek spring kit requires a piston compressor. I t also says this on their instructions. Therefore I did not manage to install this. Installation of the piston seal and the O rings did not represent any problems. The Vortek piston seal is of a great quality. So I went back to the stock spring kit, relubed it and installed it w/o problems. By the way there is a weight and size difference between the the Vortek and the (17 year old) factory spring kit. The factory kit weighs 172 grams, while the Vortek kit weighs 151 grams only. The difference in length is about 0.75 to 1.00" the Vortek being the longer and of course the stronger one. After completing the installation of the action I have cocked it and fired it once out of the stock. It worked fine. I reinstalled the action in the stock hoping for the best, which hope was immediately dashed because the cocking issue and the blocked ABT reappeared immediately at the first try of cocking and trying load and fire it again in the stock, just the same as it originally was. The problem this time became even worse as it originally was, because as I tried release the spring tension by disengaging the safety and pulling the trigger, while holding into the cocking lever (per manual) the safety could not be engaged either. At that moment I gave up and called the seller and requested a return for credit. Hope they will send the promised return label, that I do not have pay at least for the return shipping. This air rifle was sold as "mechanically fine". Live and learn. All the best for everybody. Lajos
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Purchased a USED gun ... Does not work as described then the seller should be contacted right then & there & a resolve worked out.
Take said gun all apart, change out stuff and fiddle about inside and then contact seller there is a problem ??? Don't think the seller has any liability to condition or operation of the gun he sold you.
JMO ....
BTW ... OP asked for comment via PM :P
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Is it possible the rear stock screw by the trigger guard is too long and binding the action, so the gun works out of the stock, but not in the stock?
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Here is what happened; after I managed to dismantle and clean up the action I have ordered a set of Vortek Pro 4 HO spring kit a piston seal and 2 O rings for the compression tube. Installation of the Vortek spring kit requires a piston compressor. I t also says this on their instructions.
I just installed a PG4 Kit in my TX200 Mk III and there was no need for a spring compressor. Actually, I didn't remove the top hat prior to installing the kit on my 1st try which meant that the spring needed to compress even more in order to get the lug back in. The sear wouldn't engage however, which made me realize that there must've been a top hat up inside that piston meaning that the rifle needed to come apart again in order to remove it. Anyway, the point is that I was still able to compress the spring by hand enough to get the retaining bolt/lug back in with the top hat in place. Without it, it was a breeze to install.