Thanks for the comparison Ron, you bought a JM kit before I could get you mine to install. What you describe is what I've always heard, Vortek makes more power but is a tad harsher, JM a little less power and a little smoother. Maybe the smoother is because of less power, will be interesting to see if the power comes up on the JM kit but I am not sure that will happen. Kind of hard to really compare the shot cycle if the power level is not the same.
The spring has quite a bit more preload. I had a hard time getting the gun together without a spring compressor. The preload will lessen some once the spring takes a set.It makes a nice shooting R1 but as of now it's making less power than my R9 in the same caliber with a Vortek kit.
I'd not heard before about issues of the cocking shoe hitting the vortek kit's metal exterior guide. Are there particular guns you've found this most problematic?I'm getting ready to put in a new spring in my D460 and had been debating between Vortek and Macarri. So its interesting to read these experiences even if they're on HWs.
Quote from: Bayman on June 14, 2022, 01:49:03 PMThe spring has quite a bit more preload. I had a hard time getting the gun together without a spring compressor. The preload will lessen some once the spring takes a set.It makes a nice shooting R1 but as of now it's making less power than my R9 in the same caliber with a Vortek kit.I would not try to open up or try to replace a spring without a spring compressor - In my opinion even if you are strong enough it is safer to use a spring compressor - especially if something slips - you should not recommend not using one.Why compare the R1 to the R9 - If you are not happy with the R1 = sell it.
Quote from: Denby95 on June 14, 2022, 05:23:56 PMI'd not heard before about issues of the cocking shoe hitting the vortek kit's metal exterior guide. Are there particular guns you've found this most problematic?I'm getting ready to put in a new spring in my D460 and had been debating between Vortek and Macarri. So its interesting to read these experiences even if they're on HWs.I only have experience with the Weihrauch Vortek kits. I've had to relieve the cocking foot on a couple of Hw30s and a Hw50. The Hw95 and the Hw80 with the new style cocking shoes can drag on the steel guide.Clearancing the foot or the shoe is kind of a pain because you have remove the spring and barrel to grind and polish it. If you reassemble it and don't get it right you'll have to disassemble it again and relieve it some more..I never had these problems with the older Vortek plastic outer guides.
So I went with the Vortek because it’s easy to cut coils without having to rework the end of the spring.
FWIW, the ARH kit in my HW95L .22 is absolutely soundless when cocking until the piston latches onto the trigger. During install I really polished the cocking shoe, along with everything that I could reach, and lubed with Krytox GPL-205. FPS seemed to settle at 722 after 2K to 3K shots using the FTT 14.66 gr pellets. I did not count the # of coils in the ARH spring but the original Weihrauch spring has 34. The ARH guides were a snug fit in the ARH spring. I do NOT see any dieseling when shooting now and I recommend the GPL-205 grease for anyone planning on a kit install in their rifle.
Quote from: Denby95 on June 14, 2022, 05:23:56 PMI'd not heard before about issues of the cocking shoe hitting the vortek kit's metal exterior guide. Are there particular guns you've found this most problematic?I'm getting ready to put in a new spring in my D460 and had been debating between Vortek and Macarri. So its interesting to read these experiences even if they're on HWs.I only have experience with the Weihrauch Vortek kits. I've had to relieve the cocking foot on a couple of Hw30s and a Hw50. The Hw95 and the Hw80 with the new style cocking shoes can drag on the steel guide.Clearancing the foot or the shoe is kind of a pain because you have remove the spring and barrel to grind and polish it. If you reassemble it and don't get it right you'll have to disassemble it again and relieve it some more..Quote from: Bayman on June 14, 2022, 05:57:48 PMQuote from: Denby95 on June 14, 2022, 05:23:56 PMI'd not heard before about issues of the cocking shoe hitting the vortek kit's metal exterior guide. Are there particular guns you've found this most problematic?I'm getting ready to put in a new spring in my D460 and had been debating between Vortek and Macarri. So its interesting to read these experiences even if they're on HWs.I only have experience with the Weihrauch Vortek kits. I've had to relieve the cocking foot on a couple of Hw30s and a Hw50. The Hw95 and the Hw80 with the new style cocking shoes can drag on the steel guide.Clearancing the foot or the shoe is kind of a pain because you have remove the spring and barrel to grind and polish it. If you reassemble it and don't get it right you'll have to disassemble it again and relieve it some more..I never had these problems with the older Vortek plastic outer guides. "I never had these problems with the older Vortek plastic outer guides."Hummmm......the very first Vortek PG2 kit I bought had exactly this problem with the plastic "outer guide" in my R9. Here is a pic of the grooving in the guide that crated "plastic shavings" in the receiver tube. To solve the "plastic shaving problem" I also polished the cocking shoe sliding surface and radius the sharp edges. After the "cocking shoe honing and sharp edge removal" there was no other issues with "plastic shavings in the receiver" however that early PG2 kit in my R9 lost 80 fps velocity before I finished a case of CPLs (about 4500 shots in 3 months) so the PG2 kit was retired and replaced with an ARH offering. Here is a pic of the PG2 kit outer guide........
As for selling my R1, I'll probably hang on to it now that I put another new 20 caliber barrel on it. If I feel I want more power from it I will just put back the 29 coil 0.865"x 0.148" Vortek spring. It was making 18-19 fpe before I switched to 27 coil spring and then the JM kit. Or I'll just convert it 22. I have too much time and money tied up in it to let it go now. Besides it's still a cool gun.
Quote from: Bayman on June 14, 2022, 08:46:36 PMAs for selling my R1, I'll probably hang on to it now that I put another new 20 caliber barrel on it. If I feel I want more power from it I will just put back the 29 coil 0.865"x 0.148" Vortek spring. It was making 18-19 fpe before I switched to 27 coil spring and then the JM kit. Or I'll just convert it 22. I have too much time and money tied up in it to let it go now. Besides it's still a cool gun.Hi Ron,Can you remember how much preload the 29 coil Vortek spring had when making 18 - 19 ft. lb. in the R1?Just trying to get a handle on the energy efficiency of what we in the UK call FAC rifles.Thanks,Jim