So, can you achieve any level of proficiency in this game if the only place you can consistently shoot without driving an hour is under 15 yards?This is really pretty much impossible with a springer, isn't it?
Quote from: TwiceHorn on June 06, 2017, 09:20:38 PMSo, can you achieve any level of proficiency in this game if the only place you can consistently shoot without driving an hour is under 15 yards?This is really pretty much impossible with a springer, isn't it?It's pretty much impossible with any type of air gun. You really need to get good dope at only 3 distances to build a reasonable chart in ChairGun 10, 27 and 50 yards. Zero your rifle at 27yds and then get good hold offs at 10 and 50 yds. Enter the data into ChairGun with your pellet, best guess velocity and scope height. Once you do this you can play with your velocity and scope height until you get your 10, 27 and 50yd hold offs to closely match ChairGun. Once you do this you should shot some shots at 15-16yds and 35-40yds to confirm your chart. You will continuously make small tweaks to your Chairgun data until one day you have complete confidence in your numbers. This may take several matches/ months.If you can't drive the hour the few times necessary to get this data and reliably zero your rifle at 27yds, then be content to "blow the snot" out of all three of the 10-15 yd targets you will encounter at a typical FT match and enjoy the rest of the match happy to be outdoors with a great bunch of people. Jim in Sacramento
Howdy, Texas Mark.I feel yer pain, as I started where you are only a few months back.Things I learned so far include:I could not find a perfect gun setup overnight, but I kept shooting in my backyard (15 yard max) to improve my trigger technique.Until I got actual range data for a zero; plus POI drops for three distances ... everything I put in ChairGun and PPC was a guess and not a good guess.I could open the patio sliding door in the living room, open the garage doors and shoot 22 yards from the front of my house through the living room into the backyard. OH ... move that lamp from the end table by the couch. Dang it!Ranging on a 12X beyond 30 yards or so is an educated guess. I'm training to use the mil dot marks, too. Thanks for that post!!Borrow or purchase a laser range finder and you can practice ranging objects in your neighborhood without firing a shot. I half-open the sliding garage door, and peer out at stuff in the neighborhood, practicing without freaking the neighbors.The more you shoot, the more fun it is to shoot.You will get there.Bob
I guess I should follow Cliff's advice, shoot on the range on match day and just accept whatever I get, to *(&^ with the rest. I don't really feel like I get good shots on the sight in range most of the time, but, that's my problem.
Quote from: TwiceHorn on June 08, 2017, 10:31:58 AMI guess I should follow Cliff's advice, shoot on the range on match day and just accept whatever I get, to *(&^ with the rest. I don't really feel like I get good shots on the sight in range most of the time, but, that's my problem.Cliff is right, you are over complicating the process. One question I have is why would you change your scope setting 1 MOA just because you switched from clicking to holdover? it sounds like you can now hold dead on at 15 yards at home, giving you the less than desirable double zero. Almost all the Hunter Class shooters I know zero their rifles at somewhere between 27 and 30 yards. This is so that they only hold their cross hairs over the target at all distances, never holding under the target. I think the least of your concerns at the moment is learning to bracket. Until you get a rifle/scope combination that is properly zeroed with good holdover information, knowing the distance to the target is of little value. See if you can talk Cliff into another long range practice session with the intent of getting a good zero around 27 yards and the hold overs at 2 or 3 other distances. Then never touch your scope knobs when shooting at home. Only adjust your scope when you can shoot at your actual zero distance. Good luckJim in Sacramento
Mark...check your scope height. Mine was a half inch off to high and showed itself as .5 inches POI lower at 10 yards..... Who did you measure your scope height?In chair gun you can play with scope height a bit, plug in some numbers higher and lower than what you actually measured , then see if the data then comes more into line with what you think it should beyou said you used the light at the range to focus range find..... was it dark otherwise? Ive found that the only way to get reliable data while focus ranging, is to set the wheel up in VERY bright daylight. lotsa reasons for doing that but the human eye will see objects in shadow or not well illuminated as either closer or farther..... If youve zero'd in less than Ideal light, you may be seeing that error manifest itself in your targets
So, can you achieve any level of proficiency in this game if the only place you can consistently shoot without driving an hour is under 15 yards?I'm finding my lack of ability to a) practice beyond 15 yards, b) range beyond 15 yards c) gather ballistic data beyond 15 yards, d) try to bracket, e) learn how to dope the wind to be incredibly frustrating. I can't change anything or even check my zero for poi shifts unless it shows up under 15 yards.I've taken Bob's advice of trying to master the short targets, so I should be good if it's 10-15 because I can blow the snot out of a 3/8" bull at those ranges but I can't do a durn thing else. None of my data fits Chairgun. I can't use PP calc because I cant shoot groups beyond 15.I cant upgrade or change hardware without invoking the ordeal of re-shooting everything and creating a bunch of new uncertainty.This is really pretty much impossible with a springer, isn't it?
Yeah, I shoot a lot of 3/8" bulls like that, but at 15 yards tops. It does help with my trigger work and position and breathing, but I fear that it isnt revealing things going on with my gun and me. And it doesn't help much with my FT scores, at all.Chairgun seems utterly useless with my rifle. So, in preparation for an upcoming match, now cancelled, I tried to shoot groups at 10-15, "measure" the dots, and make a range card that looks something like this:10 1.811 1.612 1.213 1.014 .815 016-30 "aim low"30-55 ?And that's about the best I can do.But, I made the mistake of shooting multiple groups at these ranges. They grouped, pretty nicely in most cases, all touching under 3/8, some one hole, some one ragged hole, not helped by using regular paper and dome pellets. Well, when I go to measure them, they're all off a little, sometimes by as much as 1/8. At those ranges, that's a half a dot or more. Now, "milling" the drops, they're fairly similar, but when you actually try to put a ruler on them, forget it.When you read about POI shifts, it seems to be marked, but I think I'm getting little ones (a few sixteenths) that are only significant if you're doing something like shooting FT.Confused, frustrated, about to put my stuff in the classifieds.