GTA
All Springer/NP/PCP Air Gun Discussion General => Air Guns And Related Accessories Review Gates => Topic started by: DevilsLuck on April 14, 2018, 04:54:40 PM
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If one has the appropriate torque on their scope rings, and mount; is it necessary to use LocTite?
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I may not be the best person to ask. I secure my scope mounts with a torque wrench and use no Loctite anywhere on any of my airguns.
Stock screws do get a bit of Vibratite VC-3 to prevent them from vibrating loose. VC-3 can be retightened and still retain its properties. Not all my stock screws get that treatment. Most front screws have a star washer under the screw head with a flat washer between there and the stock.
I have found this system works for me. I'm always open to suggestions for improvement, though.
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Usually after a few snug ups during break in , they hold ok, though periodic checks are recommended. Sometimes I run into a gun that just needs a little extra holding power and I break out the blue stuff.
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;) Being an old Harley rider blue Loctite is my friend and I use it for all stock screws. My scope mounts just get the specified torque since they are metal to metal and not subject to the compression problems that are inherent with wood and synthetic stocks. But that's just my solution to a thorny issue ;D
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I never put loctite on any of my scope bolts, don't need it IMO, basically what Don said, you really don't need it on a scope mount IMO however I'm a pcp nut and not a springer fan so it might be different on a spring gun. I just check mine every now and then just for good measure and they're always tight.
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Torque is nothing new ...
Before Loctite was available, it was recommended to use nail polish on the scope mount & ring screws. ;)
To keep screws from backing out on our Harleys, we used the runny "aviation" Permatex in the can. 8)
Cheers,
Smoketown
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Torque is nothing new ...
Before Loctite was available, it was recommended to use nail polish on the scope mount & ring screws. ;)
To keep screws from backing out on our Harleys, we used the runny "aviation" Permatex in the can. 8)
Cheers,
Smoketown
::) ::) Getting old I forgot the sticky Permatex trick used it on my then new Sporty back in '67 before me and a buddy did a cross country road trip in late spring of '68. It kept mirrors and foot pegs from falling off ;D ;D
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Torque is nothing new ...
Before Loctite was available, it was recommended to use nail polish on the scope mount & ring screws. ;)
To keep screws from backing out on our Harleys, we used the runny "aviation" Permatex in the can. 8)
Cheers,
Smoketown
While I realize that liquid “locking agents” aren’t new; I was curious as to whether they were necessary at all, if one used the “correct “ torque on the scope mount, and rings. I’m currently experimenting with this using my new D34. With the RWS single piece mount. 30lbs is holding fast. For the rings; a tourque of 20lbs gave way, I’ve since up it to 25lbs. I’m still in the middle of testing. But for 7 shots it’s held. I’m heasitant to go much higher.
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There is also the trick of putting some bore polish paste along the 11mm groves this gives the adapter some extra bite, I haven't messed with a scope on the Ruger Air Hawk .177 I recently acquired, Maybe today It will get played with , since I am basically snowed in :o
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Torque is nothing new ...
Before Loctite was available, it was recommended to use nail polish on the scope mount & ring screws. ;)
To keep screws from backing out on our Harleys, we used the runny "aviation" Permatex in the can. 8)
Cheers,
Smoketown
While I realize that liquid “locking agents” aren’t new; I was curious as to whether they were necessary at all, if one used the “correct “ torque on the scope mount, and rings. I’m currently experimenting with this using my new D34. With the RWS single piece mount. 30lbs is holding fast. For the rings; a tourque of 20lbs gave way, I’ve since up it to 25lbs. I’m still in the middle of testing. But for 7 shots it’s held. I’m heasitant to go much higher.
Torque is NOT new ... "Miracle" locking agents ARE. (If the early 70's could be considered new ...) ;)
Steel screws in aluminum mounts, clamping a scope to an item subject to recoil ... What could possibly go wrong? :o
Are your screws lubed?
Dirty threads equal high torque and low tension.
Tension (EVEN tension) is what you are really looking for.
Seriously, some have excellent luck using torque alone while others have screws loosen, even with Loctite.
As the old grind goes, "Your Mileage May Vary".
I almost always use some form of locking agent on ALL screws that I want to remain tight.
(Bone dry and de-greased (also test fit by hand) as the "thread locker" does provide some lubrication.)
Cheers,
Smoketown
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Torque is nothing new ...
Before Loctite was available, it was recommended to use nail polish on the scope mount & ring screws. ;)
To keep screws from backing out on our Harleys, we used the runny "aviation" Permatex in the can. 8)
Cheers,
Smoketown
::) ::) Getting old I forgot the sticky Permatex trick used it on my then new Sporty back in '67 before me and a buddy did a cross country road trip in late spring of '68. It kept mirrors and foot pegs from falling off ;D ;D
;D ;D ;D The old aluminum Anderson pegs that I ran would spit their bolts faster than you could tighten them!
An exciting ride to be sure!!
Cheers,
Smoketown
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Been there and done that makes for a challenging ride to say the least ::) ::)
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Never used Loctite on scope rings as so far, never had a problem with then, but did for stock screws until i started reading about the Vibra-Tite VC3. As mentioned above, it works just like the blue Loctite with the added bonus that if needed, you can tighten screws a little more without needing to reapply it.
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What is this "loc tite" stuff of which you talk about????
Who needs it?
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What is this "loc tite" stuff of which you talk about????
Who needs it?
Duct tape is right up there with the disposable lighter, and the wheel when it comes to all-time greatest inventions ever!
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Loctite is a German-owned American brand of adhesives, sealants and surface treatments that include acrylic, cyanoacrylate, epoxy, hot melt, silicone, urethane and UV/light curing technologies. Loctite products are sold globally and are used in a variety of industrial and hobbyist applications.
Generally on this site the Loctite referenced is Loctite blue - an anaerobic thread locking compound which holds threaded fasteners securely until the joint is broken by loosening or tightening. At this point it must be reapplied and the part reassembled.
I don't think anybody really NEEDS the stuff but it sure is nice not having bolts and screws work loose.
Personally I use Vibratite VC-3 as I can tighten it without reapplication.
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On hard thumping powder burners I’ve used rosin, the stuff baseball players run on their bats, on the bottoms of the scope rings prior to setting the scope down. Just a small dab.
Vibratite is awesome stuff, but really tough to clean off the threads if you ever want to start over, like years later mount that scope on another rifle. So, back to blue lock tite I went on air rifle scope ring screws only. I used to lock tite the scope ring bases to the pic rail of a scope, but learned that the scope must come off a lot on my Marauder if I need to access the bolt, hammer, etc. so I left those clean of any locking solution.
Something I sorta learned myself, and it became habit from doing it to the hard hitting center fire guns, is after everything is mounted, wiped clean, etc., I run a pencil line mark against the scope and the edge of both scope rings(just the top half of the rings), just so I have a quick visual to see if the scope ever slips forward or back. The graphite line is not noticeable really, but easily seen, if you know what I mean.
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I always follow the recommendations that Tim McMurray from Mac-1 Airguns (is he still around ?)...
Clean all screws and thread with alcohol, and just tighten (not overtighten) until the screws "squeak" a little.
Seems to work well for me so far... and I have transplanted scopes and mounts numerous times over the years.
Anyone else remember that recommendation from way back when ?
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If one has the appropriate torque on their scope rings, and mount; is it necessary to use LocTite?
I never us thread locker on my scope mounts. I use a torque wrench to limit the possibility of scope tube damage which I've had when using 15in/lbs torque with the two piece BKL "double strap mounts", however I've never had scope tube damage with the BKL one piece mounts using 15in/lbs torque on the top strap screws................
(https://i.imgur.com/XF3r4Csl.jpg)(https://i.imgur.com/NW0Tyk6l.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/lXo9HDBl.jpg)
Notice the distinctive "double strap dents" on these two scopes from the two piece double strappers using 15in/lbs of torque...........
(https://i.imgur.com/mLyOJ2sl.jpg)(https://i.imgur.com/LamRSe1l.jpg)
I'm currently using a UTG universal picatinny to dovetail adapter on my HW springers and a set of Weaver Quad Lock rings clamped to the adapter like this...........
(https://i.imgur.com/Ito5HrNl.jpg)
Even though these Weaver mounts have narrow top straps like the BKL two piece mount I've had no scope tube damage using 15in/lbs of top strap screw torque yet the rather heavy 5-15x50 Hawke scope still holds firm using only 10in/lbs of torque!
Here is the scope creep using the BKL double strappers when only 10in/lbs of torque are applied to the top straps, yet as mentioned above 15in/lbs of torque deformed the scope tube............
(https://i.imgur.com/8u7bshQl.jpg)
Anywhoo......as mentioned, I never use thread locker on my scope mount screws.
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I’m on 3 scopes now using no thread locker. So far with 18lbs torque; they’ve held.
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If one has the appropriate torque on their scope rings, and mount; is it necessary to use LocTite?
Never used Loctite
Always used a torque wrench to set correct torque values
Never had a slippage