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Author Topic: CZ200 question  (Read 241 times))

Offline mobilemail

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CZ200 question
« on: December 06, 2021, 11:38:49 AM »
I'm thinking about adding an external regulator to my .177/12fpe CZ200. Can anyone tell me what kind of shot count I could expect with a 2900psi fill?

Right now, filling the rifle to 2000psi gives about 50 shots within 3% of the peak at about 11.6 fpe (I would have to check my notes on the exact velocity) using an 8.4gr pellet.
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Offline fivestar45

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Re: CZ200 question
« Reply #1 on: December 06, 2021, 11:52:58 AM »
My 200s is a .22 cal with the larger Altaros aluminum air tube and external reg. If I recall correctly using a 2800psi fill I got 100 useful shots @ +- 750fps.
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Offline HunterWhite

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Re: CZ200 question
« Reply #2 on: December 06, 2021, 12:10:42 PM »
I also bought one of the Alteros aluminum tubes. It's a very nice addition to the CZ200.
The tube has 150 cc's of air, the standard tube has 120 cc's.
The Alteros tube also has a probe fill at the end, under the pressure gauge. This means that you don't need to remove the tube to fill it.
This Alteros tube isn't cheap, but not bad either.  You get a probe, probe fill, gauge*,regulator, aluminum tube. The fill pressure is the same as the steel tube, 2750 psi / 190 bar. You will need to check the exchange rate euros to dollars, mine cost $270 but I also bought a wrench, that added about $15. I expect that the tube with reg and probe fill would be about $255.
I know that the aluminum tube for M-Rods was about $150 when you could get one. That was just the tube, the fill port and regulator were separate.

* the pressure gauge dosen't show red above 190 bar like the OEM gauge on the CZ200.

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« Last Edit: December 06, 2021, 01:04:15 PM by HunterWhite »
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Offline Ribbonstone

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Re: CZ200 question
« Reply #3 on: December 06, 2021, 01:02:36 PM »
Can see where some games we play would be easier if we could play the full game on one fill.  Something that you know needs 60 shots, but you only have 50….bothers us to refill at some point.

Done at match speeds, might get 90-100 good shots unregulated….double the energy to about 12, usually can get nearly ½ the shots.

200T or S200’s were freakish good at a long un-regulated plateau...just not quire 60 shots good (the .22 can get to 60...but 12 foot pounds in .22 is kind of “trajectory challenged”).

Just a longer/larger volume air tube could get you there.

The only one I played with (other guy’s gun) had an Altaros reg insalled.  LOOKED like just an add on between the tube and the action, but as I never used one/installed one, have no real clue to the real work needed.

Did get him up to closer to 90-95 shots at about 11-12 foot pounds.  Wasn’t “magic”, used more air to do it (wider pressure range), but the point was not to refill in the middle of what he was doing.


Having two of the things, but one in .22, did try just swapping air tubes.  Nope.  Not a lot of difference between the two tubes on the same frame, but enough to notice by chronograph and on paper.

It might work out as a cheaper alternative if you spend the time playing-around with the two tubes to get them to meet.  Even today, think a whole functioning air tube runs about $150-$160.

(Evidently a closet “daredevil”, I still keep using that S200’s  2003 air tube ratter than replacing it.)

Are sealed units when off the rifle, can haul them around separate from the rifle, but need some allowances to be swappable.

Stripper/brake/LDC has to be skinny enough for the tube to pass underneath. Front fill or rear fill tubes, they interchange, but have to pass under the LDC.

It might be a lot of work to get the two into “close enough” velocity agreement.  The two I have are close enough for hunting, not close enough to target work...never tried to cure that.

Sill have to stop the .177  at 50 shots and swap tubes.

Likely would need one “fart shot” to get the new tube working right...which may be against the rules of a game.


So...not owned, but shot: Altros.  Haven’t checked the “who/what/where “of that one in a long long time. May be more/better options, but would prefer and external reg so not to take up any of the tube volume.

Did extend the shot shot count at the same energy from a standard 122CC tube.  Likely a more even velocity than 3%, but realistically can’t tell the difference between 2% and 4%.
« Last Edit: December 06, 2021, 01:05:30 PM by Ribbonstone »
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Offline HunterWhite

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Re: CZ200 question
« Reply #4 on: December 06, 2021, 01:26:27 PM »
CZ200, aka AA T200 gets a very good unregulated shot string for such a tiny reservoir.  It's not enough for a FT match. Inside the pressure tube is a little gizmo called a "POTT" that is the secret to the unregulated shot string, but I'm pretty sure that it must be removed to use that nifty screw on regulator.
To remove the POTT, you must degas the tube and unscrew the endcap. The endcap is on there very tight. You will need a special wrench, and you will probably need to make a fixture to hold the tube while you unscrew the endcap.  This would be two pieces of 2x4 clamped together, (6 or 8 inches long) then drill a hole the entire length of these 2x4's. 

I wanted to be able to disassemble my tube, that's why I bought the special wrench from Alteros, I will need to make the 2x4 fixture.

HTH.

Hunter
« Last Edit: December 06, 2021, 01:34:04 PM by HunterWhite »
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Offline Ribbonstone

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Re: CZ200 question
« Reply #5 on: December 06, 2021, 02:12:27 PM »
Been debate about what the POTT really does.... is it just a restriction of does it act like ½ a reg.?

Evidently, it's the reason for the long plateau at 12ish foot pounds....and the reason you have to fight to get it to 20 (where you'll not find a very long plateau).  Can get power without it, but a poor unregulated shot count.  12 foot pounds is well within the range where the pott system still works its "magic".

9725ca7f-0cc2-4fbe-af58-9732c9daec8e by Robert Dean, on Flickr

It’s just not 60 shot or 100 shot “magic”. Same valve/same tune, a longer air tube (more volume) would get to 60 easy enough.

Only times I’ve played games with one, were running stages. If they allowed a refill, would refill between stages.  The 5 min spent doing that did me a lot more good than BSing with the other guys waiting for the next stage.

MAYBE the first shot after a top-off was a little bit off.  Testing at home showed it sometimes happened, sometimes didn’t. More an unpredictable event than something that always happened.

---------
Keep seeing smaller air volumes listed for the basic tube….conflicts with what’s printed on the tube.

Never opened one up and measure- filled it with liquid to find out.

But if it really is smaller….then that shot count is all the more impressive for a non-regulated.
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Offline desertplinker

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Re: CZ200 question
« Reply #6 on: December 06, 2021, 08:37:41 PM »
Hunter
Just an FYI if you haven't received your tool yet, once you get the factory end off, it's not needed to put them on that tight. I have removed the factory cap and put them back on finger tight with no air leaks. Once you get them off you can remove and install very easy. If you get one installed from Altaros they are not as tight as factory guns. By the way, the pott does act as sort of a regulator. I took the Pott out of a 15 ft. lb. gun and it went to 20 foot pounds. But I had previously cranked on the hammer spring some and opened the air adjust also.
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Offline triggerfest

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Re: CZ200 question
« Reply #7 on: December 08, 2021, 02:13:09 PM »
It also depends on if you have a CZ200 with the short pressure tube (50cc) or long pressure tube (80cc).

I have two CZ200s with one of each. The CZ200 with the 50cc pressure tube is equipped with the external HUMA reg and does about 75 consistent shots at 12fpe (.177). Without HUMA this is about 45 - 50 consistent shots.

Btw the 80cc pressure tube with no regulator does even a stunning 80 consistent shots at 12fpe (.177).

The CZ200 is really an amazing platform in terms of consistency and accuracy. I think it shines best in 12fpe or as 5fpe match version. I think the .22 version is slightly more powerful as only option in case you want to get closer to 15-16fpe.
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Offline Ribbonstone

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Re: CZ200 question
« Reply #8 on: December 08, 2021, 02:54:51 PM »
OK...now I gotta take a cylinder apart and actually volume-measure.  SUCKER? had been believing the 122ml printed on the side of those tubes “forever”, and it might be BS. 

Wouldn’t be the first time I’ve been airgun-lied to.

NOW I see lower volumes (which makes the shot counts even better from an efficiency prospective).

Could be old tubes vs new tubes….could be they always printed the wrong thing (knowingly or not).

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From your experience...think I’d just go with a bigger tube rather than regulation to get the same (75-80 shot) results.  Just for the sake of simplicity.
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Offline pat585

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Re: CZ200 question
« Reply #9 on: December 08, 2021, 03:04:31 PM »
I had one in my cart last year from Altaroes & i should have bought it, but with Covid i figured with my luck it would have been delivered in the ocean. Nice shot count.
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