Hi,by the story of how the UK selected 12fpe, it is a pretty random number.I guess in the US it not something meaningful. You can make whatever fpe you want.I shoot indoor and do not really care if it is 12fpe. It matters that it punches the target and has good accuracy.Others just see it as a limit imposed by law that has no real world meaning.Why do you want a rifle with exactly 12fpe? Are you in some very specific match/application?CheersChris
Hi,well I am not sure I agree, but I have to say I don't have much experience with springers. What I know comes from reading and documentation.I just watched a very interesting video report by Tom Gaylord. He had completed some pellet/velocity testing with different airguns. He was mostly looking to debunk the myth that supersonic velocities lead inevitably to less accuracy. Instead he figured out that that is not true absolutely true, and it mostly all depends on the gun/pellet pair. In particular, he found out that the recoil harmonic can be tuned, especially in springers, so that the pellet will leave the barrel at a neutral point in the recoil wave.This greatly improves accuracy when tuned for a specific pellet weight and velocity. He was able to show that supersonic accuracy was actually occurring with several pellets and springers when properly tuned,So from this I learned that springers just need to be adjusted properly to have a better performance at a specific fpe.You can have an untuned 12fpe that will not so good and a tuned 20fpe springer that will drive nails.This is why I cannot agree that 12fpe springers have some magical combination of performance natively.12 was just a number picked by some lawyer and has not special meaning.Expensive overseas rifles are properly tuned for 12fpe because that is the maximum they are allowed to get out of it.But that is it. They are tuned to that limit, not the other way around. They did not pick 12fpe because that is the result of a research showing it would lead to the perfect tuning.I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on this But that is the beauty of this hobby.CheersChris
Quote from: cdegrassi on November 21, 2014, 07:02:47 PMHi,well I am not sure I agree, but I have to say I don't have much experience with springers. What I know comes from reading and documentation.I just watched a very interesting video report by Tom Gaylord. He had completed some pellet/velocity testing with different airguns. He was mostly looking to debunk the myth that supersonic velocities lead inevitably to less accuracy. Instead he figured out that that is not true absolutely true, and it mostly all depends on the gun/pellet pair. In particular, he found out that the recoil harmonic can be tuned, especially in springers, so that the pellet will leave the barrel at a neutral point in the recoil wave.This greatly improves accuracy when tuned for a specific pellet weight and velocity. He was able to show that supersonic accuracy was actually occurring with several pellets and springers when properly tuned,So from this I learned that springers just need to be adjusted properly to have a better performance at a specific fpe.You can have an untuned 12fpe that will not so good and a tuned 20fpe springer that will drive nails.This is why I cannot agree that 12fpe springers have some magical combination of performance natively.12 was just a number picked by some lawyer and has not special meaning.Expensive overseas rifles are properly tuned for 12fpe because that is the maximum they are allowed to get out of it.But that is it. They are tuned to that limit, not the other way around. They did not pick 12fpe because that is the result of a research showing it would lead to the perfect tuning.I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on this But that is the beauty of this hobby.CheersChrisIm looking for competition level accuracy and like you I am following the advice of people doing it. Im not stuck on 12FPE and don't really care what it is If its accurate and not hold sensitive. The limit to this is real close to 12FPE give or take a little. If FT target shooters start winning with 20FPE springer I will join the band wagon. Until then Im chasing the 11-13PFE gun.In not agreeing to disagree im just saying Tom Gaylord Isn't winning a Field Target match with a supersonic 20FPE springer
I give up. I see why the 12FPE is not in US.
Esp. with the TX, FT shooter prefer "smooth" I know a lot of people just over 12fpe - 13-14.5 max(it seems)- who do very well. The shooter I know who has used a TX more than anyone else say's "you tune a TX the way it wants to be tuned, not to what you want" , and he has had many many TX's of all types. A good friend who one piston class a couple of years ago would have loved to shoot WFTF-"12fpe"- but his rifle was best at 13.2fpe . Now anyone wanting "20fpe" out of a TX, get a different rifle.John