Opinions on the Daystate Wolverine .303?



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Offline DFWdude

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Re: Opinions on the Daystate Wolverine .303?
« Reply #20 on: June 27, 2012, 02:35:51 PM »
I think what a lot of people are missing here is the point that Daystate is making is the Wolverine will be the basis of all their future guns. The .303 is just a statement piece for now.


Yes, that is the current line about the future of DS products.  In terms of technology, perhaps.  But I seriously doubt DS will make a full range of Wolverines in all the present calibers. 

Tony Belas himself stated that the Wolverine was "scaled up" in every dimension to handle the pressures of the .303. Building up to fit a specific application is fine, but building up to go small (.177 - .20 - .22) makes little sense. This breech is at least 40% larger than necessary for the smaller calibers.   Smaller than needed for .25 too.



IMO, the rifle's SIZE is not intended for the smaller calibers. Yes, it will be sold in Britain in .177 and .22. But in my humble opinion, it will be sold to Brits who (blindly and faithfully) look beyond the fact that it is way overbuilt for these calibers.

I have some big .177 rifles already. FWB 300s and others. I seldom shoot them. To big, too heavy. They are my prized "closet queens."  I got rid of my Marauder because it was to long and heavy for my 6 foot frame.

It would be beautiful, but I doubt DS will make a scaled-down Wolverine of appropriate size for .177 or .22. Too expensive for a small, domestic, sub-12fpe market.
« Last Edit: June 27, 2012, 02:38:13 PM by DFWdude »

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Offline badredbird

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Re: Opinions on the Daystate Wolverine .303?
« Reply #21 on: June 27, 2012, 02:49:54 PM »
good thought mr manny , for me it would be useless
  • leon wv
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Offline Plekto

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Re: Opinions on the Daystate Wolverine .303?
« Reply #22 on: June 27, 2012, 03:19:23 PM »
While I respect the history behind it, .303 is a sub-standard choice.  If you analyze the data on various calibers, the best caliber for all-around hunting, accuracy, and efficiency is approximately 6.5 -7.0 mm.  Of course, this is for firearms, and assumes proper firearm bullets (vs pellets), but I'd suspect that the same would hold true for airguns as well, since really large bores are very inefficient and slow.  Yes, they are effective, but 3 or 4 shots per fill is a real issue. 

I'd personally just make a gun that could fire 90 or 100gr .270 Winchester bullets.  Sierra, Hornady, and many others make bullets that look like they are machined out of a single piece of metal compared to most pellets.  It's always seemed odd that instead of  just using standard calibers that you could get supplies for at any reloading shop, they end up with oddballs that don't fit any normal specs.  This also makes it more difficult to get a good barrel, as a .270 Win barrel is a dime a dozen compared to something odd like .303.

Online grumpy

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Re: Opinions on the Daystate Wolverine .303?
« Reply #23 on: June 27, 2012, 04:43:55 PM »
In the near future they will be offering every caliber they sell on the Wolverine platform.
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Offline John B

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Re: Opinions on the Daystate Wolverine .303?
« Reply #24 on: July 01, 2012, 10:11:59 AM »
Thanks Grumpy, it makes even more sence now.  A flagship attention getter that is "scaled up" in every dimension, rather like (tho they did it backwards) the Career 707 and the 9mm Ultra-which is a 707  "scaled up" in every dimension - and I would point out the Ultra 9mm was designed to shoot only one projectile and that was made by the same folks who made the rifle. 
 Personally having (legally years ago) taken many many 600+lb razorback hogs with a .22 RF I realize shot placement is where it's at and the daystate may do just that?
 Darn nice to have any new airgun designs coming out!
John
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Offline Dick Tracey

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Re: Opinions on the Daystate Wolverine .303?
« Reply #25 on: July 16, 2012, 06:59:11 PM »
I now this is advertising hype for the most part but is interesting read.

http://www.airgunsofarizona.com/Daystate/Wolverine.html

I also question the selection of .303 cal, especially designed for American market. 
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Offline Nomadic Pirate

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Re: Opinions on the Daystate Wolverine .303?
« Reply #26 on: July 16, 2012, 08:05:28 PM »
The Huge dowside of the 707 Ultra was exactly that, it only shot one round, but at least jyou could shoot the very accurate roundball too,..still i was just about to sell mine because I couldn't get all I wanted out of the Gun,....than I found the 100gr Wadcutter and everything changed now i absolutely love them guns,  any gun that only works with one pellet is severly handicapped in my view
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Offline pfcappy

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Re: Opinions on the Daystate Wolverine .303?
« Reply #27 on: July 20, 2012, 10:13:04 AM »
I want one... it is possibly the best rifle the UK has to offer... I would like to see it compared to one of the new Evanix in 9mm... power and accuracy wise... I still think the Wolverine would win that contest...
.72 cal/12 Guage Dan McVey Custom(in progress),
.58 Cal Jack Haley Custom,
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Offline pfcappy

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Re: Opinions on the Daystate Wolverine .303?
« Reply #28 on: July 20, 2012, 10:14:27 AM »
Just a thought... is there an LDC for it?
.72 cal/12 Guage Dan McVey Custom(in progress),
.58 Cal Jack Haley Custom,
Umarex Steel Storm,
AirForce .22 Condor with Barrel Extension (AirHog),
Benjamin .22 Nitro Piston, with Tuna Trigger.
Crosman .22 2200 Magnum pump

Offline Nomadic Pirate

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Re: Opinions on the Daystate Wolverine .303?
« Reply #29 on: July 20, 2012, 01:16:54 PM »
I want one... it is possibly the best rifle the UK has to offer... I would like to see it compared to one of the new Evanix in 9mm... power and accuracy wise... I still think the Wolverine would win that contest...

It's a 100 FPE gun, no use try to compare it to any .357 out there, better of compare it to the powerfull .25s

Wanderfully built, but power and chice of caliber kinda make shake my head, just a no mans land :(
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Offline rsterne

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Re: Opinions on the Daystate Wolverine .303?
« Reply #30 on: July 21, 2012, 06:55:19 PM »
This rifle is pretty much a straight progression of the performance of modern PCPs extended to a larger caliber.... The pellets are "just shy of 50 gr.", which means they will have proportions in between the 15.9 gr. JSB Exact and the 18.1 gr. Heavy.... Scaled down to .22 cal the pellet weight would be "just shy of 17 gr."  to use their terms.... In .25 cal, the pellet would be "just shy of 26 gr.", so very similar in shape (and therefore Ballistics Coefficient) to the 25.4 gr. JSB King.... However, driving that 50 grains at 950 fps, which is pretty much ideal, works out to about 100 FPE, nearly double what the .25 cal Kings would be at that velocity (51 FPE), and nearly three times the energy of an 18.1 gr. JSB Heavy at 950 fps (36 FPE).... and the trajectory should be almost identical....

Our current .22 and .25 cal PCPs are somewhat handicapped by the pellets commonly available.... There just aren't really any good choices with a good BC once you go beyond the weight of the Baracuda/Kodiaks (21 gr. in .22 cal and 31 gr. in .25 cal).... Yes, there are heavier pellets, but not ones with a great BC.... To really improve the long range capability, we need longer, heavier, bullets, properly made and with a good BC.... The new 41.5 gr. .223 cal bullets (virtually identical to a .22LR bullet) used in the "Sinner" benchrest rifles are an example, but they won't fit our .217" air rifle barrels (and the twist rate would be too low anyway).... A typical big bore, like the .308 DAQ Exile, is designed to shoot 113-120 gr. bullets at around 850 fps (185 FPE).... However, the twist rate of the DAQ is likely too fast for the relatively short pellets used in the .303 Daystate, even if they would fit.... Besides, the DAQ would drive a pellet that light supersonic, which is a waste of time with a diablo shape....

IMO, the new Daystate will certainly have its followers.... and it's detractors.... The advantages of good accuracy, and what I would hope would be readily available ammunition (even if there is only one choice) along with power in the 100 FPE club are certainly plusses.... However, the lack of other pellet choices, and (I'm guessing) the inability to shoot "bullets" with double (or more) the weight, SD, and BC at high subsonic velocities, won't put it in the same class as our current Big Bores....

Just how I see it....

Bob
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Offline badredbird

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Re: Opinions on the Daystate Wolverine .303?
« Reply #31 on: July 22, 2012, 09:56:59 AM »
i cast for my 25 cals , with great results, can you cast with these? without actully having one o r having shot one , tough to say how id like it, if they accurate   well i always like that , but the lack of choices concerns me in ammo dept also , but like rsterne said there will be some on both sides according to your needs , it does see, ike a production progression tho
  • leon wv
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Offline Nomadic Pirate

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Re: Opinions on the Daystate Wolverine .303?
« Reply #32 on: July 26, 2012, 01:50:50 AM »
1st few indipendent reviews are pretty discouraging, with a Fill of 250 BAR only about 10 good shots and that at less than 100 FPE, very inefficient if you ask me, accuracy wasn't stellar either.

Beautiful built gun with incredible features, but getting down to the nitty gritty for just shy of 3 Grand you don't get much of a Big Bore
« Last Edit: July 26, 2012, 01:52:25 AM by Nomadic Pirate »
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Offline badredbird

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Re: Opinions on the Daystate Wolverine .303?
« Reply #33 on: July 26, 2012, 12:08:38 PM »
well if you dant have accuracy you have nothing, i wouldnt touch it  why when there are ven more owerful options
  • leon wv
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Offline Powder burner

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Re: Opinions on the Daystate Wolverine .303?
« Reply #34 on: July 26, 2012, 01:43:16 PM »
  note: with powder guns 303 is just a name, the bullets they use are actually slightly larger than .308.
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