REVISED 1/16/13: New GRT-IV replacement for Gamo plastic trigger



Author Topic: REVISED 1/16/13: New GRT-IV replacement for Gamo plastic trigger  (Read 22671 times)

Offline CharlieDaTuna

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I receive e-mails and questions almost every day and the forum as well asking about a replacement trigger for the new Gamos but there has always been underlying problems with the concept.  ???

I am strongly considering developing a CNC program and tooling up to make a replacement trigger for the entire line of the late model Gamo rifles using the new trigger block and plastic triggers. ;) The problem is that it would not be a simple drop in like the GRT-III trigger. It’s just not possible. :(

Why am I bringing this up????    I would like to establish the interest, get your thoughts and to determine the acceptance to help me decide if I really want to invest my time and money in doing this. It does take time and money and I don’t want to waste either of them if nobody has an interest based on the information below. I’m not doing this so much for the money (you don’t get rich doing these things) although that is a good incentive, but more because the need is there and it’s good for the airgun enthusiasts.  ;D

The R&D has already under way and it does look feasible but there are a couple of drawbacks that do make me hesitate.  :-\ As with anything else that is made from the ground up, CNC programming, making the jigs, and tooling up is very costly as well as time consuming. The GRT-III development took a long time for it to pay for itself.

The one major draw back is that in order to install the GRT-4G, the trigger block must be removed from the gun. The GRT-4G can be installed in the springer version of Gamo without a spring compressor. To install the GRT-4G in an IGT Gamo does require a spring compressor. Once the trigger block is removed, the installation is pretty straight line and rather simple to do but does require a little mechanical ability and no special tools. 8)

It will come with step by step instructions and step by step trigger pics (in downloaded instructions as before) along with additional hardware that may be needed in addition to the trigger. The trigger as before will be pre-adjusted prior to shipping.

Another issue is that although there are many airgun enthusiasts out there, how many are mechanically inclined, willing to make a spring compressor and bold enough to start ripping an airgun apart??? Almost everyone that has taken a gun apart, especially a Gamo, knows that for the most part, they are very simple and easy to work on. ;D

That said, in addition, the new Gamo rifles can be vastly improved and because the trigger has been removed and there is now access to the internals, the installation instructions will be appended with a complete tune guide so the person can do a SuperTune while he has it opened up. The instructions will include what parts and lubes to order and where to order them from, how and where to lube and with what.

When finished, he should have a gun that is almost the gun that the older Gamo’s were when tuned. Keep in mind thought that they cannot be TurboTuned because of the internal design. 8)

That is it in a nut shell

I would appreciate as many comments and thoughts as possible from any and all of you that have any interest so please speak out if you would. And if you would rather not post your comment, then please e-mail me at CDT2@Verizon.net . A lot of my final decision will be based on the forum participation. :) :)

Finally…. If there are any late model Gamo trigger block assemblies from a trashed gun or even junk or unwanted guns with the trigger assembly in tact that is willing to part with it, I sure would like to have them for testing and parts for the R&D side of this project.  :D :D

Thank you all for your taking the time to read this and thanks in advance for your responses.

Bob….aka: CDT


This has been the second post on the GTA forum and never updated. I thought you might want to see how the future of the GRT-4G progressed since this original post back on Sept. 30, 2010.
???

In early October of 2010 we began working on the R&D for a new trigger design for the late model Gamo with the modular trigger block in earnest.  :-X We realized early on that it was going to be a far more complex CNC programming and manufacturing process than the GRT-III trigger and that the installation by the consumer could be an issue and something that would need to be overcome.  ??? ::)

After many weeks to trial and error, testing and many failures, we finally came up with a working prototype.  ;) I sent out several test triggers to different people including Gene to get some outside field testing results, comments, opinions and suggestions.  The results were that I received were very positive.  ;D  ;D

We made some very minor changes in the geometry, did some more testing and prepared to make the jigs and plates for production. That and the CNC programming is one of the more costly and time consuming parts of the final preparation before the manufacturing process can begin. No room for error there.  :'(

While we were working on the new trigger, we also experimented with the installation process and found that the new Gamo modular trigger design made it possible, with care, and preferably with the assistance of a second person, it was quite easy to disassemble and reassemble the gun without using a spring compressor.  ;) ;) But again, care needed to be taken and understanding that the spring was used and already set. However, using a new spring would be far more difficult and a spring compressor should be used.  :-\

In late December, a limited production run to test the market was under way and in mid-January, the new GRT-4G trigger was released. Keep in mind, our objective in providing a new trigger for the Gamo was not to get rich…lol… but rather to fulfill a need for those that own or would like to own a Gamo and also knowing it had the trigger issue.  :D  Unlike with the GRT-III trigger and being aware that it was going to be a limited market and the GRT-4G application would apply only to the new Gamos’ using the new plastic trigger module; we did not want to over commit ourselves. But it was for all intent and purposes, a “success” and the Gamo customers were highly satisfied with it and had nothing but positive comments regarding its performance.  ;D ;D

In March 2011 we did a second production that was a revised trigger with a little change in the geometry and eliminated the first stage adjustment screw and made it so that the first stage was set up to be as perfect in the geometry as it could get if using an adjustment and at the same time to prevent any possibility of accidentally overcoming the function of the safety switch which was a distinct possibility with the screw.

Our customer response has been fantastic and the GRT-4G is everything that the GRT-III of the past has been, just in a much narrower field of application. To those of you that have taken advantage of the GRT-4G trigger, thank you and thank you for your support.   ;) ;)

And so there you have the rest of the GRT-4G trigger story. ;) ;)

Charlie

« Last Edit: April 09, 2013, 11:59:56 AM by CharlieDaTuna »
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HOME OF THE GRT-III --- GRT-4G TRIGGER --- CBR TRIGGER
http://charliedatuna.com/GRT-III%20Trigger%20New.htm
http://www.charliedatuna.com/GRT-4G.htm

Home of the NPSS-NP (CBR) Triggers:
http://www.charliedatuna.com/NPSS%20non%20PP.htm

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Offline Addictedtoair

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Re: New GRT-IV replacement for Gamo plastic trigger
« Reply #1 on: October 01, 2010, 02:10:02 AM »
I'm 100% for the Late Model Gamo Series of weapons to have the option of having a trigger upgrade available. I feel a good trigger is the most "bang for the buck" upgrade that can be done to any weapon. Gamo's decision to go plastic seemed to be the end of one the most important items that is installed in any current tune, that being the GRT-III trigger. I personally feel strongly enough about this that although I don't currently need one, I would make a donation for the R&D of the new trigger! Thank you Bob for even being willing to think about helping out so many air gunners.

Thankfully and Respectfully Your's,
Brett H. Bishop
SSG,U.S.Army(RET)
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FX Independence .22/Gamo Whisper .177

Offline RHINOTEX

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Re: New GRT-IV replacement for Gamo plastic trigger
« Reply #2 on: October 01, 2010, 09:27:10 AM »
The new Gamo trigger design has removed any possibility of purchase of an otherwise very good gun line.   I think that says it all.   Bob

Offline oldpink

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Re: New GRT-IV replacement for Gamo plastic trigger
« Reply #3 on: October 01, 2010, 09:40:18 AM »
It's definitely an intriguing idea, but I wonder how much modification would be necessary to install it.
If it works well, I seriously believe that Gamo should send a big fat check to Bob for coming up with this to ensure future sales of their guns that would have otherwise dried up and blown away.
I'm not joking, either!
Airguns...they're not just for kids anymore.

Offline bradyman1

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Re: New GRT-IV replacement for Gamo plastic trigger
« Reply #4 on: October 01, 2010, 10:30:20 AM »
You could also possible offer 2 kits. One with just the trigger and one with the other lubes etc. needed for the Super Tune. I think both kits would be good sellers.
2013 hunting season totals

                  Me                     9 year old son       5 year old son       Mom
Squirrels.   4.                                   3                       2                 2  
Starlings.   22
Rabbits.                                            1.                                        1
Chippers.      3
Groundhogs.  1
Frogs.            4.                                                          1
Possums.       4
Skunks.         1
Crows.           3

Offline CharlieDaTuna

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Re: New GRT-IV replacement for Gamo plastic trigger
« Reply #5 on: October 01, 2010, 11:19:06 AM »

Thanks addictedtoair but I'm not looking for any fund/money donations but rather just the parts that someone might have setting around.

As I see it at this point, there would be no modification needed for thstall the new trigger. There are some logistics that I need to work around, especially in one particular area but I do believe that I can overcome it. If not, it will squash everything. :( :(

You are probably right brandyman1 regarding two kits but I would not sell any kits for tuning, just the trigger kit.

There was a point in time that Gamo was sending me their trigger complaint customers, and still do occasionally, for the replacement GRT-III trigger. But one thing for sure.... they ain't gonna send me no check :D :D :D
  • Simpsonville,  SC
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I DO NOT ANSWER GENERAL AIRGUN QUESTIONS IN PM'S SO DO NOT PM ME WITH AG QUESTIONS.

Bob aka: CharlieDaTuna
Co-founder of the GTA


HOME OF THE GRT-III --- GRT-4G TRIGGER --- CBR TRIGGER
http://charliedatuna.com/GRT-III%20Trigger%20New.htm
http://www.charliedatuna.com/GRT-4G.htm

Home of the NPSS-NP (CBR) Triggers:
http://www.charliedatuna.com/NPSS%20non%20PP.htm

Website: http://charliedatuna.com/

E-Mail: CDT22@Frontier.com

Offline ezman604

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Re: New GRT-IV replacement for Gamo plastic trigger
« Reply #6 on: October 01, 2010, 12:06:20 PM »
Bob, are there any other AGs that this trigger might fit besides the Gamo line? I'd sure like to have an upgrade for PL1K, TF89 & Ruger Blackhawk. Just curious if any of them use a similar trigger assenbly. MANY thanks for your continued efforts in the sport!!!!
Happy Shooting!!!!
Dave
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Revelation 760 PumpMaster (Vintage 1967)
Powerline 1000S .177 (semi-tuned by me & innards by kiwi Pete)
Benjamin Super Streak .177/.22 (converted to NP & w/GRT-III)
Beeman HW97K .177
Benjamin Trail NP XL1100 (home tuned by muwah with Tuna trigger)
Stoeger X-20 RAMmed by Gene and Tuna trigger
Winchester 1000SX .177 (semi-tuned by muwah)
Winchester 1000B RAMmed by Gene
Crosman 1377 "Goldfinger"
Disco .22 Multi-Shot Custom

Ain't this a great place to be

Offline renowntwo

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Re: New GRT-IV replacement for Gamo plastic trigger
« Reply #7 on: October 01, 2010, 12:09:28 PM »
i know  i would like 2 have the trigger  because the plastic 1 stopped me from gettin the big cat in .22
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Offline CharlieDaTuna

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Re: New GRT-IV replacement for Gamo plastic trigger
« Reply #8 on: October 01, 2010, 01:14:44 PM »
The GRT-IV trigger will be designed around the new Gamo trigger block and will not work in anything else that I know of at this time.
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I DO NOT ANSWER GENERAL AIRGUN QUESTIONS IN PM'S SO DO NOT PM ME WITH AG QUESTIONS.

Bob aka: CharlieDaTuna
Co-founder of the GTA


HOME OF THE GRT-III --- GRT-4G TRIGGER --- CBR TRIGGER
http://charliedatuna.com/GRT-III%20Trigger%20New.htm
http://www.charliedatuna.com/GRT-4G.htm

Home of the NPSS-NP (CBR) Triggers:
http://www.charliedatuna.com/NPSS%20non%20PP.htm

Website: http://charliedatuna.com/

E-Mail: CDT22@Frontier.com

Offline Chortdraw

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Re: New GRT-IV replacement for Gamo plastic trigger
« Reply #9 on: October 01, 2010, 01:16:48 PM »
Stop buying Gamos for a while and have China put Bob on their payroll so he can teach them how to correct their problem. How much Yen do you need Bob??
Rem 1200 Vantage,chopped, tuned w/ muzzle brake and the Tuna trigger

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1377..16" barrel/FT piston/flow through bolt/brass breach/air stripper.
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Offline shadow

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Re: New GRT-IV replacement for Gamo plastic trigger
« Reply #10 on: October 01, 2010, 04:30:22 PM »
It's hard for me to tell Bob to jump into it and design another trigger for the Gamo's and a Company that has lost it's way as far as listening to what the customer want's. Gamo just throw's a brand name on there guns like the Bone Collector etc. but it's just the same shooter in a different coat. If the trigger was made it would be a great improvement along with a Super Tune due to Gamo's new guide design. These things can still breath new life into a airgun that seems to be crying out for help. I wonder what would happen if Bob put's his time and effort into bringing forth another outstanding trigger to keep the Gamo alive then in a year or two the company takes another wrong turn with their airguns. :( I'm all for a new trigger design for the Gamo's  but I'm also for Bob enjoying his retirement but I think Bob has to tinker with the those airguns just like the rest of us. ;) Ed
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Offline Pete

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Re: New GRT-IV replacement for Gamo plastic trigger
« Reply #11 on: October 01, 2010, 05:51:57 PM »
Hi..
I have to agree with Shadow.....
A new trigger would be great as long as Gamo don't
change the gun again.....Then charlies time/efit/cost
would be for nothing... The new design would need at least a 5 year
production life to make it worth while...
Crosman invested heavly in gas rams so you can bet
the others haven't over looked that fact..Will there
be another change to a ram down the track ?
but then they mite just retro fit a ram if it happens..
the new model could be stage 1 of that process...
So much unknown

I surpose you need to weigh up set up cost against
the projected production life for the new model..
EXSPERIANCE - being able to recognise your mistake the second time you make it....

Career Infinity .22 PCP
Hatsan Mod 55 .177
Hatsan Mod 75 .22
Hatsan Mod 99 .177
Kral Underlever .177
Gamo Hunter 440 .22
Others...

Link to other hobbie's
My XT660 side car build on Adventure rider...
http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=775145

Offline CharlieDaTuna

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Re: New GRT-IV replacement for Gamo plastic trigger
« Reply #12 on: October 01, 2010, 11:47:17 PM »
Yep Ed... just can't seem to leave them alone. Gamo and the Gamo customers have been good to me in the past and I feel that with a trigger and even a light tune, they could still be a good gun.


You are right Pete. It's a pretty big gamble and takes quite awhile to pay for itself but then like I said before....I ain't figgern' on gitten rich. Just the idea of making/providing an improvement for other hobby/enthusiasts means a lot to me. 
  • Simpsonville,  SC
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I DO NOT ANSWER GENERAL AIRGUN QUESTIONS IN PM'S SO DO NOT PM ME WITH AG QUESTIONS.

Bob aka: CharlieDaTuna
Co-founder of the GTA


HOME OF THE GRT-III --- GRT-4G TRIGGER --- CBR TRIGGER
http://charliedatuna.com/GRT-III%20Trigger%20New.htm
http://www.charliedatuna.com/GRT-4G.htm

Home of the NPSS-NP (CBR) Triggers:
http://www.charliedatuna.com/NPSS%20non%20PP.htm

Website: http://charliedatuna.com/

E-Mail: CDT22@Frontier.com

Offline bradyman1

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Re: New GRT-IV replacement for Gamo plastic trigger
« Reply #13 on: October 01, 2010, 11:55:30 PM »
That is an awesome attitude Bob! You have a great following and it is apparent why.
2013 hunting season totals

                  Me                     9 year old son       5 year old son       Mom
Squirrels.   4.                                   3                       2                 2  
Starlings.   22
Rabbits.                                            1.                                        1
Chippers.      3
Groundhogs.  1
Frogs.            4.                                                          1
Possums.       4
Skunks.         1
Crows.           3

Offline Rocker1

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Re: New GRT-IV replacement for Gamo plastic trigger
« Reply #14 on: October 02, 2010, 11:42:31 AM »
 ANY thing that would improve the gamo design at this point would be a vast improvement, my hats off to you Mr Bob. Thanks David
HW97                                                       GENE BUILT MULTI SHOT DISCO              EVANIX AR6                                                  CZ200                                                               TITAN 2X1377 RWS 45  GAMO DELTA BENJAMINE 392 REMINGTON NPSS  G1 EXTREME RWS 35 GENES R11 I HAVE HID FROM HIM REMINGTON SUMMIT gas rammed PHANTOM  Bsa lonestar 25                                      crosman quest 177 CZS200                                 BT65 TURKEY GUN

Offline shadow

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Re: New GRT-IV replacement for Gamo plastic trigger
« Reply #15 on: October 02, 2010, 07:58:22 PM »
If Bob put's this trigger into production and sales I will add it to my tuning options for the newer Gamo's with the plastic triggers. Ed
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Plinker71

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Re: New GRT-IV replacement for Gamo plastic trigger
« Reply #16 on: October 02, 2010, 09:41:02 PM »
A smoother pull and crisper break  on a trigger are always a plus.  I just bought a new CFX that unfortunately has the plastic trigger.  Gun still shoots well but needs some improvement.
I would definitely purchase one along with info on the tune.

Alan

Offline Davee1

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Re: New GRT-IV replacement for Gamo plastic trigger
« Reply #17 on: October 03, 2010, 03:28:40 AM »
Well...I would have no problem with installing a GRT-IV in my .177 Bone Collector that I rcvd as a gift.  And my brother just bought a BigCat1200 .177, and I could help him install one.
I kept thinking to myself how much better the Bone Collector would be if it had a better trigger.  And with the knowledge that a person can take the standard Gamo craptastic plastic trigger, and replace it with a quality aftermarket trigger...well that just keeps folks buying those Gamos.  I had stopped buying their products because of their plastic trigger.
So yes, I hope you do go forward with the GRT-IV.  I've got one leaning up against the wall in a corner, waiting for a better trigger.  And I already have my spring compressor, and have used it plenty of times.  ;D
Gamos all with GRTIII trigger... Whisper.22, Shadow1K.177, CFX.22/177, ShadowExpress.22/shotshell, a .177 Bone Collector with the new plastic trigger(sucks),  Diana 350M.177/22, P5.177, LP8.177, HammerliX2.177/22, Storm22, Chinese B3.177, B3AK47.22, B4.22, B21.22, Beeman1073SwitchBarrel.177/22,  P1.177, P3.177, P17.177, Browning B800.177/22, Crosman1377, Benji HB22, Marauder.22/25.

Offline maxiedog

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Re: New GRT-IV replacement for Gamo plastic trigger
« Reply #18 on: October 03, 2010, 04:04:39 AM »
Count me in. I hav 2 friends that love my BC but won't buy one because of the trigger. That would make 3 sales counting me. Even at a higher sale cost. Good luck with the project. Another thought- Offer pya and others this as an upgrade option. I mentioned this to PYA about a month ago for the GRT111
Question=  Would this also allow the nitro piston upgrade?
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Offline CharlieDaTuna

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Re: New GRT-IV replacement for Gamo plastic trigger
« Reply #19 on: October 03, 2010, 01:18:12 PM »
Yes, a Nitro upgrade would still work.
  • Simpsonville,  SC
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I DO NOT ANSWER GENERAL AIRGUN QUESTIONS IN PM'S SO DO NOT PM ME WITH AG QUESTIONS.

Bob aka: CharlieDaTuna
Co-founder of the GTA


HOME OF THE GRT-III --- GRT-4G TRIGGER --- CBR TRIGGER
http://charliedatuna.com/GRT-III%20Trigger%20New.htm
http://www.charliedatuna.com/GRT-4G.htm

Home of the NPSS-NP (CBR) Triggers:
http://www.charliedatuna.com/NPSS%20non%20PP.htm

Website: http://charliedatuna.com/

E-Mail: CDT22@Frontier.com

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