Muzzle Brake legality



Author Topic: Muzzle Brake legality  (Read 5467 times)

Offline bradyman1

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Muzzle Brake legality
« on: September 14, 2010, 03:27:48 PM »
Are muzzle brakes legal on airguns in MO? How do you find out that info? I am curious? I assume if it is a factory installed integral part of the gun it is (like a shrouded barrel), but what about the aftermarket offerings? I have always heard (not that the info is correct) that (@*#&%(*@&) are illegal. Aren't muzzle brakes a type of (*^%?
2013 hunting season totals

                  Me                     9 year old son       5 year old son       Mom
Squirrels.   4.                                   3                       2                 2  
Starlings.   22
Rabbits.                                            1.                                        1
Chippers.      3
Groundhogs.  1
Frogs.            4.                                                          1
Possums.       4
Skunks.         1
Crows.           3

Offline 454 Big Block Chevy

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Re: Muzzle Brake legality
« Reply #1 on: September 14, 2010, 04:03:02 PM »
a standard muzzel break, serves 4 real purposes....
a weight.... to help ballance the rifle and make i less barerl jumpy...
to protect the crown of the barrel,
a handle to assist cocking...
and aesthetics. 

a muzzel break in itself, is usually just a piece of metal, around the barrel, not an extension like a suppressor.  a shrouded barrel does help quiet the report down, but by no means are (@*#&%(*@&)... its also widely agreed, its not smart to make any air rifle quieter...for legal reasons.   they can be and are quite loud... but thats the nature of the beast.  also check your local laws... your ATF or the Firearms tobacco alcohol Burroughs  in your area might have more information.  i know in las vegas, you could legally own a suppressor for any firearm that you could legally own, however, the permits were over 1200 and the suppressors themselves werne't cheap either.
Gamo Hunter sport converted to Crosman NP.  Simply Amazing 17-18FPE
http://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=45489.0
http://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=45782.msg429370#msg429370

AirForce Condor SS .25 cal.  62 FPE with O ring mod, soon to be 90+ FPE.

Offline bradyman1

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Re: Muzzle Brake legality
« Reply #2 on: September 14, 2010, 04:18:09 PM »
I was under the impression that the ones sold (like the ones TKO sells) reduce the noise. Isn't that also the case when shrouding the barrel on the Condors?
2013 hunting season totals

                  Me                     9 year old son       5 year old son       Mom
Squirrels.   4.                                   3                       2                 2  
Starlings.   22
Rabbits.                                            1.                                        1
Chippers.      3
Groundhogs.  1
Frogs.            4.                                                          1
Possums.       4
Skunks.         1
Crows.           3

Offline RedFeather

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Re: Muzzle Brake legality
« Reply #3 on: September 14, 2010, 04:26:35 PM »
If you are talking about the ones offered here in the US purported to make your air gun "mouse fart quiet", they are technically illegal and should not be discussed here.  (Taboo subject on most US air gun forums.)  Let me just say that I, personally, would not want to be in such a manufacturer's "client" database should BATF decide to pursue the matter.

Offline bradyman1

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Re: Muzzle Brake legality
« Reply #4 on: September 14, 2010, 04:46:38 PM »
Well I don't know if they are marketed that way, but it appears that is what people think they do. I am just trying to determine whether they are legal. I understand they are often times marketed as this or that but is quieting a side effect, or a superstition? I want to stay on the right side of the law, and would not suggest, alter, or condone any modification to make our guns illegal. That is partly why I am asking. I wouldn't want to unintentionally brake the law by adding a hop up part.
2013 hunting season totals

                  Me                     9 year old son       5 year old son       Mom
Squirrels.   4.                                   3                       2                 2  
Starlings.   22
Rabbits.                                            1.                                        1
Chippers.      3
Groundhogs.  1
Frogs.            4.                                                          1
Possums.       4
Skunks.         1
Crows.           3

Offline Jman

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Re: Muzzle Brake legality
« Reply #5 on: September 14, 2010, 05:02:50 PM »
Shrouds are built in legal (@*#&%(*@&), reason be is that you cant remove a shroud and use it on a different gun...

Offline bradyman1

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Re: Muzzle Brake legality
« Reply #6 on: September 14, 2010, 05:13:27 PM »
Taken from the Missouri ATF site:



Q: Does the ATF regulate the sale and possession of air guns? Is an air gun classified as a “firearm” under Federal law?
The term “firearm” is defined in the Gun Control Act of 1968, 18 U.S.C. Section 921(a)(3), to include “(A) any weapon (including a starter gun), which will, or is designed to or may readily be converted to expel a projectile by the action of an explosive; (B) the frame or receiver of any such weapon….” Based on Section 921(a)(3), air guns, because they use compressed air and not an explosive to expel a projectile, do not constitute firearms under Federal law — unless they are manufactured with the frames or receivers of an actual firearm. Accordingly, the domestic sale and possession of air guns is normally unregulated under the Federal firearms laws enforced by ATF.

We caution that ATF is not charged with enforcement or oversight of the firearms laws of States or localities. To determine possible restrictions on air guns where you reside, we recommend that you contact the office of your state Attorney General, the State Police, or other State/local law enforcement authorities for further guidance.
2013 hunting season totals

                  Me                     9 year old son       5 year old son       Mom
Squirrels.   4.                                   3                       2                 2  
Starlings.   22
Rabbits.                                            1.                                        1
Chippers.      3
Groundhogs.  1
Frogs.            4.                                                          1
Possums.       4
Skunks.         1
Crows.           3

Offline RedFeather

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Re: Muzzle Brake legality
« Reply #7 on: September 14, 2010, 06:08:04 PM »
I don't want to get this thread banned but let me make one thing clear.  It is not the air gun that is the issue but the "moderator", "brake", "LDC", whatever euphemism you so chose to label it.  The BATF considers such devices firearms in themselves.  Simply the manufacture and possession, alone, without a permit is a violation.  If you want one for an air gun, you can have one BUT you need to pay the fee.  $$$$$ but cheaper than Mr. Lawyer and all that entails.

Offline oldpink

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Re: Muzzle Brake legality
« Reply #8 on: September 14, 2010, 09:23:51 PM »
The main thrust of the whole muzzle break thing is to ensure that it is integral to the gun and not easily removable, as with the Evanix Blizzard, Benjamin Marauder, and various others that have a barrel shroud instead of something that could be easily detached, then adapted to a powder burner.
That's why the muzzle break, although not a shroud per se, on the Gamo Whisper, is made to be basically impossible to remove.
It's a fairly gray area, but one best not explored, unless you want to pay the big bucks and go through the extensive paperwork for a Class III license.
Airguns...they're not just for kids anymore.

Offline CharlieDaTuna

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Re: Muzzle Brake legality
« Reply #9 on: September 14, 2010, 11:57:42 PM »
Get a (*^% and then be prepared to set in a cell next to him and pay a healthy fine.

Remember.... the manditory sentence is 10 years and $10,000.00 fine for making one, owning one or selling one and the ATF have now won a case regarding airguns.

Read this:
 
He's going to jail!
 (Origional Article & Copied from Tom Gaylord)

 Sunday, July 16, 2006

He's going to jail!


Michael A. Crooker was found guilty on Wednesday, July 15, 2006 of illegally manufacturing a (*^%. He faces a mandatory sentence of 15 years. This link has the report:

Airgun (*^% case

Crooker made a (*^% for a Korean Big Bore 909, a .45 caliber air rifle. In 2004 he sold the rifle and (*^% to another party and he shipped it through the U.S. Postal Service, where it was intercepted.

When ATF tested the (*^% on a firearm, it silenced the report. That is the legal definition of a (*^%.

Making a (*^% is a violation of several counts of the same law. Because a (*^% is considered to be a firearm by federal law, the maker has just made a firearm without a license to manufacture - count one. Firearms that are sold are required to have serial numbers, and this one didn't - count two. And possession of an unregistered (*^% is also a crime - count three.

The jury did ask for additional clarification on what constitutes a (*^%, but the judge was unable to give them anything beyond the law. I have written an article about (@*#&%(*@&) for Pyramyd Air. It should be up on their web site soon. I included the definition of a (*^% in that article, so you can read it for yourself. When it goes up, this is where it will be:

Articles

For 12 years I have maintained that (@*#&%(*@&) and airguns do not mix. People who play with the law open themselves to prosecution. Even if you win your case, the experience will not be pleasant. Now that BATF has a win under their belts, I expect them to prosecute other (*^% violations more vigorously.

This was a jury trial.
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Offline 454 Big Block Chevy

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Re: Muzzle Brake legality
« Reply #10 on: September 15, 2010, 12:07:08 AM »
what bob said...
Gamo Hunter sport converted to Crosman NP.  Simply Amazing 17-18FPE
http://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=45489.0
http://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=45782.msg429370#msg429370

AirForce Condor SS .25 cal.  62 FPE with O ring mod, soon to be 90+ FPE.

Offline bradyman1

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Re: Muzzle Brake legality
« Reply #11 on: September 15, 2010, 09:29:44 AM »
Thanks for the reply guys. Thanks for the article Charlie! I always pretty much thought the same thing. I just didn't understand that many times when you see a modified 1377 it has a muzzle brake, or a lot of the condors have a shrouded barrel added and if I have read correctly they are said to make the gun more quiet. I thought maybe there was a legal loophole, or maybe they were not what I thought they were being as they are advertised openly on the net, and obviously purchased and used openly on the net. I will stay away from them, as I would also suggest others to do.
2013 hunting season totals

                  Me                     9 year old son       5 year old son       Mom
Squirrels.   4.                                   3                       2                 2  
Starlings.   22
Rabbits.                                            1.                                        1
Chippers.      3
Groundhogs.  1
Frogs.            4.                                                          1
Possums.       4
Skunks.         1
Crows.           3

shooter40x40

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Re: Muzzle Brake legality
« Reply #12 on: September 15, 2010, 09:45:41 AM »
(@*#&%(*@&) are not against the law but you must pay the tax and register them with the batf. Then you can use it on anyting that you own, air or firearm. Just pay the tax.

Offline CharlieDaTuna

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Re: Muzzle Brake legality
« Reply #13 on: September 15, 2010, 09:55:33 AM »
There is a big difference between a muzzle brake, a moderator and a (*^%.

A muzzle brake is nothing more than an extension on the barrel that is not much more that a handle to assist cocking and make it purty. It has next to nothing to do with reducing the "report" or mechanical noise on any airgun and is not intended to.

A moderator (sometimes called and air stripper) such as is on the Gamo Whisper does suppress the sound of the expulsion of the air coming out of the muzzle of the barrel by breaking it up but is not an actual (*^% and the reason that it passes the test is that it cannot be removed from the gun (without destroying it) and placed on a powder burner to suppress the noise. It does suppress the report of pellets that break the sound barrier such as the PBA's.

A (*^% is just that... a device that silences the report and is constructed for just that purpose usually using a series of springs and baffles in a sequence in a tube that is specifically designed to silence the report.

  • Simpsonville,  SC
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I DO NOT ANSWER GENERAL AIRGUN QUESTIONS IN PM'S SO DO NOT PM ME WITH AG QUESTIONS.

Bob aka: CharlieDaTuna
Co-founder of the GTA


HOME OF THE GRT-III --- GRT-4G TRIGGER --- CBR TRIGGER
http://charliedatuna.com/GRT-III%20Trigger%20New.htm
http://www.charliedatuna.com/GRT-4G.htm

Home of the NPSS-NP (CBR) Triggers:
http://www.charliedatuna.com/NPSS%20non%20PP.htm

Website: http://charliedatuna.com/

E-Mail: CDT22@Frontier.com

Offline RedFeather

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Re: Muzzle Brake legality
« Reply #14 on: September 15, 2010, 05:29:21 PM »
Search for Doctor Beeman's home page and you will see a link to a comprehensive discussion.

Yes, there are a lot of PCP's out there with after-market (@*#&%(*@&) and, if in the US and that device does not have the tax paid, it is a violation.  Many air gunners snigger at this and will hoot you off a forum but it's still the plain truth.  And, even if you made one and welded it to a gun so that it could not be taken off without destroying the device, you are still in violation for making it.  As I said before, if the BATF ever decides to crack down on this and bust some of these long time sellers here in the US (legal in the UK), you don't want to be a customer.  Agents like to seize records and PC's.  And you can bet the IRS will be looking at past transactions.  Maybe yours?

BTW, moderators only have to lower the report of a firearm by a very small amount, one time, to be considered (@*#&%(*@&).  Even sticking a plastic bottle on the end, if it lowers the report, will qualify.

Offline Tarheel

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Re: Muzzle Brake legality
« Reply #15 on: March 30, 2012, 12:32:15 PM »
There is a big difference between a muzzle brake, a moderator and a (*^%.

A muzzle brake is nothing more than an extension on the barrel that is not much more that a handle to assist cocking and make it purty. It has next to nothing to do with reducing the "report" or mechanical noise on any airgun and is not intended to.

A moderator (sometimes called and air stripper) such as is on the Gamo Whisper does suppress the sound of the expulsion of the air coming out of the muzzle of the barrel by breaking it up but is not an actual (*^% and the reason that it passes the test is that it cannot be removed from the gun (without destroying it) and placed on a powder burner to suppress the noise. It does suppress the report of pellets that break the sound barrier such as the PBA's.

A (*^% is just that... a device that silences the report and is constructed for just that purpose usually using a series of springs and baffles in a sequence in a tube that is specifically designed to silence the report.


Bob,

I realize this is a 2 year old thread, but I would like to "re-visit" it, since there have been changes in the "airgun world".

At the time of the original post, the GAMO Whisper was "big news" . . . It's still around today.

Today, we have the STOEGER X20S SUPPRESSOR with a built-in "Suppressor" which does, in fact, contain chambers, baffles, and a spring, intended to reduce the report of the rifle, which is does quite well. Also, we have the recently introduced GAMO Bone Collector Bull Whisper IGT with it's "built-in noise dampener" ( from PA's ad ), and the HATSAN 125 SNIPER with its "Integrated Sound Moderator". Those are NOT muzzle-brakes, air-strippers, flash hiders, or anything else, other than what they are, how they are designed and constructed,  and what they do.

Products like the "TKO" and "barrel shrouds" are openly discussed on GTA, yet that seems to be "OK", as long as PCP's are being discussed, but not break-barrels, for example. TKO's are removable and transferable from airgun to airgun, which seems to violate the restrictions on their ownership and use.

I know that the word "$!(#%@#*" is forbidden on GTA, yet there are numerous uses of other "pseudonyms" ( LDC's, Shrouds, etc ), just use the Search feature to find them.

What is your input on this today, almost 2 years after the original post ?

I am not "throwing stones", but would like to know the effects, if any, that these changes and new products have had on GTA and it's policies about discussing "sound reduction" on the forum.

Thanks,

Dave



Even with the finest pellet rifle in the world, shooting the most accurate pellet in that particular rifle, and sighting through a perfectly-adjusted scope with the world's finest optics, it all still boils down to the person holding the rifle . . . !

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Offline sawtoothscream

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Re: Muzzle Brake legality
« Reply #16 on: March 30, 2012, 01:05:41 PM »
I wouldnt recommand one.  I bought a tko but no longer use it because its not worth the risk to me.   
Benjamin disco .22 modded,Mellon RVA, leaper 3-9x50, full camo (HUNTER)
Hatsan 125 sniper .22 leapers 3-12x40 (Back yard fun and hunter)
crossman 2240 carbine modded, mellon stock adapter, tippman 98 stock, RB grips, mellon airstripper, red dot, hipac.  (starlings and HOSP worste nightmare)

Offline Tarheel

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Re: Muzzle Brake legality
« Reply #17 on: March 30, 2012, 01:22:33 PM »
I wouldnt recommand one.  I bought a tko but no longer use it because its not worth the risk to me.   

My  questions are more about the ability to discuss topics on GTA. As it stands now, some things are allowed and some are not, even though they are "one in the same", with just a different "euphemism" or "synonym" being used to identify them.

Dave
Even with the finest pellet rifle in the world, shooting the most accurate pellet in that particular rifle, and sighting through a perfectly-adjusted scope with the world's finest optics, it all still boils down to the person holding the rifle . . . !

Crosman Nitro Venom .22 (Wood Stock)

180 BAR GAS RAM - HATSAN (Coming Soon )

Offline thekid

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Re: Muzzle Brake legality
« Reply #18 on: March 30, 2012, 01:34:14 PM »
As a Non-American..
The reasons I can see that it can be discussed without that word, is it has no bearing.
When the MAN becomes hip on the euphemisms... they will not be discussed any more.
My opinion.
In Canada we can't even get the marauder because of that.
Don't know If a TKO could get past customs..... But I wouldn't even think about it.

Offline bobster

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Re: Muzzle Brake legality
« Reply #19 on: March 30, 2012, 01:37:31 PM »
Why not just leave this subject alone?  Why stir up a big mess?

I'd like to suggest this thread be moved to the non-productive threads gate.

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