Hatsan 135 nitro piston conversion
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Hatsan 135 nitro piston conversion
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Topic: Hatsan 135 nitro piston conversion (Read 6345 times))
SpiralGroove
Ruminating Perfectionist !!!
GTA Senior Contributor
Posts: 7200
>The gun's gotta look good and shoot straight ->
Real Name: Kirk
Re: Hatsan 135 nitro piston conversion
«
Reply #20 on:
April 05, 2016, 06:07:16 PM »
Martijn, please be careful
My wife occasionally needs to pull me out of the shop too!
So does the gun finally cock & shoot? When assembled, the trigger
should not
be in the cocked position
like in the picture
.
Logged
Bothell, WA
PCP's:
AR2079A-HPA (.177)
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Orange rider
Shooter
Posts: 27
yes
Real Name: Martijn
Re: Hatsan 135 nitro piston conversion
«
Reply #21 on:
April 06, 2016, 03:53:58 AM »
Yes it works fine now.
Cya
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Velden, The Netherlands
...............................................................................
Gamo Cadet Delta, Sheridan blue streak, Sheridan EB20, Umarex LG15, Haenel 310, Diana 25, Diana 60, Hatsan 135, Crosman 1077, Gamo G1200, Crosman 622, Baikal IJ22, Gamo Expomatic
Yogi
GTA Senior Contributor
Posts: 7439
yes
Real Name: Yogi
Re: Hatsan 135 nitro piston conversion
«
Reply #22 on:
April 06, 2016, 01:10:25 PM »
Thanks for your post!
It was very informative and gave me a good appreciation for how they all go together.
This got me thinking(sometime a dangerous undertaking), what does the piston do?
All it really does is hold the piston seal square with the compression tube. Could you not machine 3/4 off the back and just have a mini-piston? At the back end you would have the detent for the ram" rod" to push against. At the from end you would just have the piston seal lip and a little bit more. With a properly weighted mini-piston you should be able to achieve the same velocities. You could make the stroke longer.
I'm sure there is a simple explanation why this mini-piston is a bad idea.
What is it?
Thanks,
-Y
Logged
San Francisco, CA
Hatsan 95 Vortex, .22
RWS 5G,
Diana 10M
RWS LP8 Magnum,
Diana 340 N-Tec, .22 Compact Lexus
HW 50S, .177, .20, and .22
SteveP-52
I just lurk, I'm no longer a
GTA Senior Contributor
Posts: 8002
Real Name: Steve
Re: Hatsan 135 nitro piston conversion
«
Reply #23 on:
April 06, 2016, 02:16:12 PM »
The bottom of the piston has a machined channel in it for the end of the cocking arm to slide in and push it back when you cock the rifle. Cut that 3/4 off and you cut off the machined hole the trigger sear goes into to hold the piston back for firing.
Logged
NY, USA
Orange rider
Shooter
Posts: 27
yes
Real Name: Martijn
Re: Hatsan 135 nitro piston conversion
«
Reply #24 on:
April 07, 2016, 04:19:44 AM »
Not only that, but if you made a shorter version of the piston and you'd put back the slot for the trigger to fall in, the pistonseal would also come back further than the gap where the cockingarm slides through. So there wouldn't be any extra pressure build up and you would damage the seal every time you fire the rifle.
Then again, you could shorten it to the maximal possible extend to maximize the pistontravel. Don't actually know to much travel you'd gain and what that would do to the muzzlevelocity. But one thing you'd have to consider is the maximal travel of the gasram. If the travel of the piston would be longer than the travel of the ram so the last bit of the pistontravel would be unpowered in free air.
But there are other options to gain 'some' power/velocity. A lighter piston has less inertia so it's acceleration would be better gaining pressure. Other things to do are polishing the piston, reducing contactsurface by placing teflon (ptfe) pads or stuff across the pistonsurface. But I think these things are marginally improving your power.
Kind regards,
Martijn
«
Last Edit: April 07, 2016, 05:27:44 AM by Orange rider
»
Logged
Velden, The Netherlands
...............................................................................
Gamo Cadet Delta, Sheridan blue streak, Sheridan EB20, Umarex LG15, Haenel 310, Diana 25, Diana 60, Hatsan 135, Crosman 1077, Gamo G1200, Crosman 622, Baikal IJ22, Gamo Expomatic
Yogi
GTA Senior Contributor
Posts: 7439
yes
Real Name: Yogi
Re: Hatsan 135 nitro piston conversion
«
Reply #25 on:
April 07, 2016, 10:15:30 AM »
Thanks for all you comments....
All very good points. It just seems to me that the gas ram is just a replacement for the coiled spring in all current air guns.
I would love to see an air gun originally designed with just the gas ram in mind. It seems that part of the reason for the long piston is to retain the spring. Since this is not necessary with a gas ram, I think improvements could be made.
Thanks for pointing out about the cocking part of the piston! I had forgotten about that...
Martijn,
How did you attach the "buttons" to your piston?
Once again, Thanks to everyone for their input!
-Y
Logged
San Francisco, CA
Hatsan 95 Vortex, .22
RWS 5G,
Diana 10M
RWS LP8 Magnum,
Diana 340 N-Tec, .22 Compact Lexus
HW 50S, .177, .20, and .22
Orange rider
Shooter
Posts: 27
yes
Real Name: Martijn
Re: Hatsan 135 nitro piston conversion
«
Reply #26 on:
April 08, 2016, 07:40:50 AM »
Hi Yogi,
I didn't place the buttons on my piston. It was an example I found online. The topicstarter on that site (can't remember which site it was) wrote that he drilled holes in de back of the piston and place the buttons in the holes with a tight fit and superglue, but the superglue, according to him wasn't necessary. If you were to place these buttons and they are made of teflon (ptfe) no glue would be applicable because teflon can't be glued.
I've been thinking about place buttons or pads but the effort of making this would the much greater then the exspected result.
I shot my Hatsan a couple of times now with only the gasram as a modification and that was overwhelming. It had lots of power (more then when I was shooting with the spring). So either the spring was tired or the gasram (set at 140 bar be a previous owner) is more powerfull then at the original pressure.
I'm now thinking of placing a damper on the end of the barrel because a the noise it produces now.
Kind regards,
Martijn
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Velden, The Netherlands
...............................................................................
Gamo Cadet Delta, Sheridan blue streak, Sheridan EB20, Umarex LG15, Haenel 310, Diana 25, Diana 60, Hatsan 135, Crosman 1077, Gamo G1200, Crosman 622, Baikal IJ22, Gamo Expomatic
RCO
Sharp Shooter
Posts: 563
yes
Real Name: Rob
Re: Hatsan 135 nitro piston conversion
«
Reply #27 on:
April 08, 2016, 11:26:50 AM »
Ptfe can now be glued with special adhesive. Most buttons are Delrin. The holes are flat bottomed and cut with a mill cutter. Once in place they don't need glue because they are trapped between the flat bottom and tube wall.
My ram converted 125 is better and smoother with the buttons. Any reduction in vibration is a plus for accuracy.
If the piston is too light it bounces off the compressed air before the pellet moves. Too heavy a piston is just as bad.
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Illinois
Yogi
GTA Senior Contributor
Posts: 7439
yes
Real Name: Yogi
Re: Hatsan 135 nitro piston conversion
«
Reply #28 on:
April 08, 2016, 04:51:39 PM »
[quote author=Orange rider link=topic=107118.msg1021105#msg1021105 date=1460112050Hi Yogi,
I'm now thinking of placing a damper on the end of the barrel because a the noise it produces now.
Kind regards,
Martijn
[/quote]
The extra noise my be dieseling from extra lube. Should reduce within a 100 shots or so...
-Y
Logged
San Francisco, CA
Hatsan 95 Vortex, .22
RWS 5G,
Diana 10M
RWS LP8 Magnum,
Diana 340 N-Tec, .22 Compact Lexus
HW 50S, .177, .20, and .22
Orange rider
Shooter
Posts: 27
yes
Real Name: Martijn
Re: Hatsan 135 nitro piston conversion
«
Reply #29 on:
April 09, 2016, 05:17:01 AM »
Hi all,
I'll fire some shots and hope th noise reduces. Otherwise if will have another project and thats making a damper.
When using these buttons won't you see wear and tear because all friction goes into a really small surface?
Kind regards,
Martijn
Logged
Velden, The Netherlands
...............................................................................
Gamo Cadet Delta, Sheridan blue streak, Sheridan EB20, Umarex LG15, Haenel 310, Diana 25, Diana 60, Hatsan 135, Crosman 1077, Gamo G1200, Crosman 622, Baikal IJ22, Gamo Expomatic
57West
Shooter
Posts: 59
yes
Real Name: Steve
Re: Hatsan 135 nitro piston conversion
«
Reply #30 on:
April 21, 2016, 11:04:47 PM »
That was informative. Thank you! Looks like you need to build yourself a bigger case next!
Logged
Cape Cod
Hatsan 135 .25 vortex
IZH 61 .117
Diana 34 T-06
Crosman 1377
Orange rider
Shooter
Posts: 27
yes
Real Name: Martijn
Re: Hatsan 135 nitro piston conversion
«
Reply #31 on:
May 06, 2016, 04:20:24 AM »
About the case. I didn't took the Hatsan along when buying the case. Kind of a bummer, but the Hatsan only comes out on really sunny and warm days so I'll manage.
Kind regards,
Martijn
BTW It seems like the noise was in fact caused by dieseling and thats gone now.
Logged
Velden, The Netherlands
...............................................................................
Gamo Cadet Delta, Sheridan blue streak, Sheridan EB20, Umarex LG15, Haenel 310, Diana 25, Diana 60, Hatsan 135, Crosman 1077, Gamo G1200, Crosman 622, Baikal IJ22, Gamo Expomatic
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Hatsan 135 nitro piston conversion