Advice needed
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Advice needed
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Topic: Advice needed (Read 1171 times))
fv22
Plinker
Posts: 279
yes
Real Name: Robert
Advice needed
«
on:
March 10, 2017, 10:26:07 AM »
Ok I did a stupid thing...
A little background first. When I first got my Trail NP .22 (my first "springer" type gun ever and first pellet rifle in over 40 years) I could not stand the trigger and did not know of this site yet. Looking on youtube I found the r/c bearing trigger mod. Did it and made the trigger acceptable. Once I found this site saw other options but never bothered since I was satisfied with trigger. I knew the safety no longer works but did not bother me since I'm the only use it and only for backyard paper punching.
As I've gotten better with it I also am more pellet picky so the other day when I put a pellet in that fit too loose in the bore I wanted to take it out. Could not lift it out with a finger nail so turned gun over to shake it out. BIG MISTAKE! Gun fired with barrel open, barrel slammed shut , pellet went who knows where. No damage and nobody hurt so just chalked it up to stupid mistake never to be done again. Next shot I completely missed target. I usually get sub dime sized groups so I immediately knew something was wrong. Took a good look at gun and realized barrel was bent up. Moved in from my 20 yard position to 10 tried again, still missed target. Aimed about 6 inches below target and hit very top so gun was shooting about 16 inches high from point of aim at 10 yards...
Read everything I could about bending a barrel and made a jig, got a clamp and straightened it out pretty easily. Put all back together fired to sight in scope and was able to sight in pretty easily but no longer get good groups. As said before I usually get sub dime sized groups at 20 yards. Now I'm lucky to get 1 inch groups at 10 yards with some being closer to 2 inches. I could have one shot a perfect bullseye and the next over an inch away
Cleaned barrel, and shot another 80 or so pellets through it to see if this would help as it has in the past when bore got dirty but no difference. I did get 1 dime sized group out of about 25 groups I tried but most were an inch or larger. Has no side play and seems to luck up tight.
Is it time to buy a new barrel or is there something else I can do to get this back to the good shooting gun I had before my dumb mistake!
Thanks in advance for any help!
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Gulf Breeze FL.
ESully
Shooter
Posts: 46
yes
Re: Advice needed
«
Reply #1 on:
March 10, 2017, 11:56:12 AM »
Check to see if the barrel has any play when locked up. Have you tried the brass washer update at the pivot to reduce side play? You can also try the tissue over the breech to see if any air is leaking past the o-ring.
And don't forget to check the screws holding the stock to the action.
«
Last Edit: March 10, 2017, 11:58:55 AM by ESully
»
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New York
mobilehomer
Trained professional. Do not try this at home without adult supervision and trained medical staff on site.
GTA Senior Contributor
Posts: 5137
yes
Real Name: Ken
Re: Advice needed
«
Reply #2 on:
March 10, 2017, 12:18:23 PM »
This is more common than you think. Many here(including your truly) have had the barrel slip while almost at full cock. Your barrel has bent. The best solution is to bend the barrel back down. There are many ways to do this, but it starts with mechanically centering your scope if you use one. Look in the GTA Library for detailed instructions on barrel bending. Or do a search on the whole site for it. You will find better information than what I can give that way.
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White House, TN
If we had some ham, we could have some ham and eggs..... If we had some eggs!!
https://www.zeemaps.com/map?group=962067
HYspd
Expert
Posts: 1463
yes
Real Name: Chuck, also answers to Grumpy and Hey YOU!
Re: Advice needed
«
Reply #3 on:
March 10, 2017, 04:36:40 PM »
I wish people would read entire posts before replying....
Since you are a research and hands on kinda guy....look into barrel pivot adjustment, bushing replacement also see breech lockup/alive jam.....don't just take my word for it, go ahead and learn it like i did....
All require removing the stock to do....
Pivot adjustment.... stock off (get that RC bearing out so the safety will work!!)...set safety.... cock action,...for plastic (factory) bushings, point action straight up with barrel out of battery (action open) tighten pivot until the barrel will just stay horizontal...ei bushing drag supports barrel weight...
Get a GRT trigger....Best $30 you'll ever throw down on an airgun part....
Bushings, factory.... are washer type plastic hims on the side of the breech block, sometimes molded in a one piece gizmo with plastic barrel shrouds....replace with brass washers....worth cutting out molded ones replace them...
To get at them, stock off, DO NOT cock the action, remove pivot bolt, now an action similiar to cocking the action will work to wiggle the breech lock out of the fork....disentangle the cocking lever foot from the piston...bushings are the round flats on the sides, use a pick type pointy thing to dig em out....when lubricating use HIGH percentage moly paste like from Granger's as lowest quality lube, there is better but this is the easist to find of adaquate quality stuff....the brass washers are metic and can be hard to find to the point that when I did find them I bought a box of 100....when reassembling relocate the cocking foot then the breeck block, the block can require and interesting and possibly concerning amount of force(particularly for your first time installing brass parts) but keep lining em stuff and jamming it together bingo everything will pop into place once you get your eyes crossed exactly right (this gets easier with practice)
Alive jam....with the breech block out and the bushings removed (molded in bushing make this annoying for your time but this is how it works) notice the "LIP" on the breech block that forms the inner diameter of the pockets the bushings sit in...that is actually a tubalar metal bushing fitting from side to side in the breech block...to get that bushing out is the goal but we aren't there yet.....the alive jam pin usualy has a chisel point...pressing the jam pin inwards releases pressure on the pivot bushing allowing bushing to be pushed out.....with the bushing out, the pin and it's spring come.out.....clean deburr clean lube and reassembly is reverse of disassemby...
Pivot adjustment for brass bushings....rest action in your hand... you want to be ligbtly supporting the pivot area.w ith both the tube and the breech block touching your hand so can feel any movement.....twiddle the pivot bolt and you feel movement between the fork and the block......the point where that movements just stops plus a slighit more is what you want.....the slight bit more is the fun part, some guns like maybe 1/16 of a turn more some as much as 1/4 to hit their sweet spot only way to be sure is testing the cometely reassembled rifle, but a bit tight is much better than way too loose....
«
Last Edit: March 10, 2017, 04:49:05 PM by HYspd
»
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Stuarts Draft VA
The Black Knight....a severely recrowned, chamfered, lapped deburred, honed, Krytox lubed and resealed Titan GP NP .22 with brass washers, a GRT-III trigger, a CP 3-9X40 and a BNM LCD soft bedded into a Fury II stock that is stuffed with 1¼ pounds of duct seal making for a 9 pound, solid shooting, 19fpe (with Crosman Destroyers of all things, at 770fps) 30 yard bottle cap assassination machine...
MODDER FOREVER FOREVER MODDING
fv22
Plinker
Posts: 279
yes
Real Name: Robert
Re: Advice needed
«
Reply #4 on:
March 10, 2017, 09:59:54 PM »
Thanks all for the reply's!
HYspd, Lots of great advice there. I will read up even more and follow all your suggestions. I took barrel out to bend it so know how it comes apart and re-assemble. I have read about the replacing the plastic shims with brass but since there was no play and after inspecting them saw no visible wear so didn't bother. After reading your info and thinking more about it I want everything to be right so I will replace them now. Do you know what size they are? If not I will take apart again to measure.
Will go through everything you suggested and see what happens. My only problem is I'm busy and might take me some time to get to it...
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Gulf Breeze FL.
grandadg
Shooter
Posts: 33
yes
Real Name: Graham
Re: Advice needed
«
Reply #5 on:
March 19, 2017, 10:45:38 AM »
Very sound advice given by HYspd there all I will add is that make sure the barrel will stay put in any position when it is cocked,It must not be able to drop under its own weight. you should be able to almost return it to the full closed position and have it sit there without any support.But not so much that it is hard to move it by hand there should be just the slightest amount of drag on it. I would also check that the two mating faces of the breech are not damaged I have seen a breech face that has compressed slightly because of the very same accident . This means that sealing is almost impossible,until the faces are re matched.
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South Shields, England
Roadworthy
Honorary GTA Moderator
GTA Senior Contributor
Posts: 9706
yes
Real Name: Thomas
Re: Advice needed
«
Reply #6 on:
March 19, 2017, 12:24:52 PM »
If you want to fabricate brass or bronze washers I have attached instructions.
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Near the Southern Coast of Washington State
Real knowledge is knowing the extent of one's ignorance.
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Advice needed