Hatsan 95 has taken a turn for the worse. (Pics added on new post)

[Devin]

My father and I got his 95 out for it's first workout yesterday. Things were looking good, dieseling had come to a near stop, cocking and shot cycle had also smoothed out a bit until one pull of the barrel. Suddenly during cocking the rifle there was some significant friction and sound of metal on metal. We took the action out and looked in through the cocking slot to see what seems to be a sleeve that fits over the spring inside of the piston had been all chewed up. I can only assume that the missing material has sheared away and is scattered inside of the tube, and quite possibly has worked itself into the area the piston seal travels.

So, a heads up to those of you with the 95 and maybe other Hatsans. Keep an eye out for abnormal wear in this area. If it is indeed a full sleeve fitted over the spring on the piston-end, Hatsan should think about using a more robust steel for this part. It looks to be pretty weak and thin, thin enough that I could imagine this piece wearing out and flaking away in any of the 95's over time, some more quickly than others as in my father's case.

[Tarheel]

My father and I got his 95 out for it's first workout yesterday. Things were looking good, dieseling had come to a near stop, cocking and shot cycle had also smoothed out a bit until one pull of the barrel. Suddenly during cocking the rifle there was some significant friction and sound of metal on metal. We took the action out and looked in through the cocking slot to see what seems to be a sleeve that fits over the spring inside of the piston had been all chewed up. I can only assume that the missing material has sheared away and is scattered inside of the tube, and quite possibly has worked itself into the area the piston seal travels.

So, a heads up to those of you with the 95 and maybe other Hatsans. Keep an eye out for abnormal wear in this area. If it is indeed a full sleeve fitted over the spring on the piston-end, Hatsan should think about using a more robust steel for this part. It looks to be pretty weak and thin, thin enough that I could imagine this piece wearing out and flaking away in any of the 95's over time, some more quickly than others as in my father's case.

Can you post up some large, clear pics of the problem, please ?

Thanks !

Dave

[microsalmo]

... what he said.

[Devin]

They should have been about double this size (nevermind, they enlarge by clicking), but for those who want/need pictoral guidance.

All you can see are the chewed up edges, but I believe that is a sleeve that goes over the spring as a buffer between the coils and the inner surface of the piston. I would have taken apart to investigate further, but I'm looking to just get a replacement (hopfully).

[Charles Outdoors]

  I don't believe that is a sleeve. That is where they cut the slot you are looking through and did not cut all the way through nor did they clean up the edges afterwards. My 125 sniper looked the same way assuring me to take it apart before even firing a shot. The piston also had these shavings inside it. Hopefully one of these shavings is not stuck between the piston and chamber walls.

[Devin]

  I don't believe that is a sleeve. That is where they cut the slot you are looking through and did not cut all the way through nor did they clean up the edges afterwards. My 125 sniper looked the same way assuring me to take it apart before even firing a shot. The piston also had these shavings inside it. Hopefully one of these shavings is not stuck between the piston and chamber walls.

It's a sleeve of some sort, it is between the spring and piston. Very thin and very weak.

Try looking closer at the second photo, you can see the thickness of this "sleeve". They may have well stacked a couple layers of tin foil. Photos of more angles would allow you to see better what it is. But these are the ones my father took, and I have no way of getting any more at the moment.

[Charles Outdoors]

Trust me. It's not a sleeve. I just filed those thin pieces off my piston a week ago in the same slot. They left slivers of metal on the  inside of the piston when cutting out that slot. Had the same thing on mine.

[Devin]

Trust me. It's not a sleeve. I just filed those thin pieces off my piston a week ago in the same slot. They left slivers of metal on the  inside of the piston when cutting out that slot. Had the same thing on mine.

OK, I could see the thin material continue around the spring, so I assumed it was a sleeve. It may just be left over flashing from cutting the slot in the piston (an aweful lot, that's for sure). The concern remains seeing as there are bits of sharp metal shards floating around in the compression tube. It looks like having a spring compressor should be a prerequisite for owning one of these followed by a complete tear-down before the first shot. Poor manufactureing, and non existant QC...tisk tisk. I'm worried about taking it apart and finding yet more damage. Can they be returned after being completely disassembled?

[Plekto]

It's not really a problem with poor manufacturing so much as the fact that almost all high quality steel and aluminum goes to China's aerospace, civic, and military industries.  What you are left with is mostly cheaper recycled alloys for anything that is being exported.  It's part that they allow it, but part of it is that it's nearly impossible for the companies to get quality materials at a competitive price in China if you're making stuff outside of a few specific industries.  Welcome to the dictatorship rearing its ugly head and screwing with the supply chain.

So they build it to spec.  It just wears out quicker. Or in the case of vehicles, does horrible in crash-tests.  It's not how strong it is but how much it can take when it's being subjected to forces that are going to potentially wear it out or break it.

That piece of metal is probably strong enough in the German rifle they copied.  But I also suspect that it's made out of high quality metal that's machined to exact tolerances.  Because they know that price isn't a concern when you're talking about potential metal in the chamber (total disaster scenario).  I bet that little piece is a couple of dollars to the price of a typical German rifle.     

Note - you'll also likely note that the Chinese airguns also tend to have their springs take a set/get damaged when left cocked, in a much shorter time. 

[Raizer]

It's not really a problem with poor manufacturing so much as the fact that almost all high quality steel and aluminum goes to China's aerospace, civic, and military industries.  What you are left with is mostly cheaper recycled alloys for anything that is being exported.  It's part that they allow it, but part of it is that it's nearly impossible for the companies to get quality materials at a competitive price in China if you're making stuff outside of a few specific industries.  Welcome to the dictatorship rearing its ugly head and screwing with the supply chain.

So they build it to spec.  It just wears out quicker. Or in the case of vehicles, does horrible in crash-tests.  It's not how strong it is but how much it can take when it's being subjected to forces that are going to potentially wear it out or break it.

That piece of metal is probably strong enough in the German rifle they copied.  But I also suspect that it's made out of high quality metal that's machined to exact tolerances.  Because they know that price isn't a concern when you're talking about potential metal in the chamber (total disaster scenario).  I bet that little piece is a couple of dollars to the price of a typical German rifle.     

Note - you'll also likely note that the Chinese airguns also tend to have their springs take a set/get damaged when left cocked, in a much shorter time. 

You do realize that these are Turkish built rifles of Hatsan's own design right?
Not Chinese clones of German guns.

[Plekto]

The same comments about metals and their quality still apply, though.  It's clear that someone cut corners in a bad way.  Someone doesn't understand the importance of those tiny parts being the reason it all works properly.  And why none of it can be made cheaper if you want it to stay working.

Also, built in Turkey?   So basically a copy of a German airgun.  But with even worse quality control and reverse-engineering skills than they get in China.  I'm leery of Chinese built airguns, but Turkey is... yeah, no thanks.  I hear their shotguns are fine, though.  But airguns are not firearms and they require special knowledge and skills to get right.

[z28rod]

Plekto,
Hatsan makes some very fine air guns. They also have come out with some very invocative design features this spring....Maybe this is just one that slipped thru the cracks. Its the first time Ive read about anything like this, so i would think you just were the unlucky buyer....

[Nomadic Pirate]

Pletko, I think your vision is slightly screwed, LOL

[Paul68]

Trust me. It's not a sleeve. I just filed those thin pieces off my piston a week ago in the same slot. They left slivers of metal on the  inside of the piston when cutting out that slot. Had the same thing on mine.

OK, I could see the thin material continue around the spring, so I assumed it was a sleeve. It may just be left over flashing from cutting the slot in the piston (an aweful lot, that's for sure). The concern remains seeing as there are bits of sharp metal shards floating around in the compression tube. It looks like having a spring compressor should be a prerequisite for owning one of these followed by a complete tear-down before the first shot. Poor manufactureing, and non existant QC...tisk tisk. I'm worried about taking it apart and finding yet more damage. Can they be returned after being completely disassembled?

Do not take it apart. Contact Hatsan and tell them what you have found. They may ask you to send the rifle directly to them. I am currently in the process of sending my 125 to them due to similar problems with loose metal destroying the power plant. They SEEM interested in finding out what is going on and addressing it at the manufacturing level, and guns with this condition should help them identify the problem and elmiminate it in future production runs.

There are more than a few cases of loose metal in the actions of the new Hatsans, and it is beginning to look like a recurring issue.

Contact - info@hatsanusa.com

Give them a detailed description of the problem, and include your pics.

[fortyshooter]

Just looked at my Sinper 125 and there is a little piece of metal,chip,in the same location,but seems to be trapped by the spring against the tube wall. You can move it around slightly with a long metal scribe. Maybe I can fish it out of there.
Be great if Pyramyd Air would offer a  clean and prep option,to take care of issues like this!
Gun is still shooting fine,but would like to prevent any later issues down the road.

[Trondyne]

I seem to have the same thing in the exact same spot...   

I guess I should try to get it out of there...

{EDIT}

On closer inspection this does *appear* to be some kind of sheath, looks intentionally located between the spring and the piston...strange..  It does not seem to (want to) move (yet) but with some more use probably will..

Jim

[Smackey54]

Before I ever shot my Mod 95, I tore it down, and the slots where the piston engage the sear, were blackened and perforated. They are metal left from incomplete machining in a $140 gun. Tear it down, and remove the piston. Using a dremel tool or Swiss file, remove the material from the slot, square up the edges and debur progressively up to 400 grit sand paper or emery cloth. Make sure you also sand those same surfaces inside the piston, making sure there are no burs or rolled metal from the filing. Then polish the shoulders around the sear engagement slot, thoroughly clean and degrease, then relube. While you have the piston out, check the seal and cylinder for metal filings....flush out if you find any.

Or....you can return the gun.

Mark

[Trondyne]

I just put a few shots through her after spraying some lube in the spring area...

I realize now that there is a pronounced squeaking when cocking and this despite the fact that the spring area is well lubed at the moment..  I assume this squeaking is not normal and could mean this gun needs a tear down and lube at a minimum... 

Any thoughts?

Jim

[Tarheel]

I just put a few shots through her after spraying some lube in the spring area...

I realize now that there is a pronounced squeaking when cocking and this despite the fact that the spring area is well lubed at the moment..  I assume this squeaking is not normal and could mean this gun needs a tear down and lube at a minimum... 

Any thoughts?

Jim

If that sprayed "lube" was something like WD-40, or similar, the solvents in it may have started attacking parts, like your Seal !

Dave

[Smackey54]

I just put a few shots through her after spraying some lube in the spring area...

I realize now that there is a pronounced squeaking when cocking and this despite the fact that the spring area is well lubed at the moment..  I assume this squeaking is not normal and could mean this gun needs a tear down and lube at a minimum... 

Any thoughts?

Jim

I would recommend a drop of Chamber lube or 30 weight silicone oil in the chamber....then work the action a few times without cocking it. If it is the seal, the squeaking will stop. If it does not, you may have to tear it down and inspect it. If you suspect it is NOT the seal, but metal on metal. DO NOT try to cock it or move the action. It will require tear down, inspection and possibly corrective action.